[00:00:23]
>> GOOD EVENING. IT IS 6:00 PM.
[1. CALL MEETING TO ORDER]
ON APRIL 3RD, 2025.WE WILL CALL THIS REGULAR MEETING OF THE TOWNSHIP BOARD OF THE CHARTER TOWNSHIP OF MERIDIAN TO ORDER.
FIRST ON OUR AGENDA THIS EVENING IS THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
WILL THOSE WHO ARE ABLE PLEASE RISE AND JOIN US IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
BEFORE WE GO ON TO ROLL CALL, I'LL ASK THAT WE HAVE A BRIEF MOMENT OF SILENCE TO RESPECT AND HONOR THE WOMAN WHO WAS THE VICTIM OF A HIT AND RUN THIS WEEK ON GRAND RIVER AVENUE.
THANK YOU. WE WISH HER A SPEEDY RECOVERY [NOISE] OUR NEXT AGENDA ITEM THIS EVENING IS ROLL CALL.
WILL CLERK DIMAS, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
I'M SORRY. DEPUTY CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
>> ALL BOARD MEMBERS ARE PRESENT.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. NEXT AGENDA ITEM IS AGENDA ITEM 4 PRESENTATIONS.
WE HAVE NONE. NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS ITEM 5.
CITIZENS ADDRESS AGENDA ITEMS AND NON AGENDA ITEMS.
[5. CITIZENS ADDRESS AGENDA ITEMS AND NON-AGENDA ITEMS]
THERE ARE SEVERAL OPPORTUNITIES FOR PUBLIC COMMENTS AT TONIGHT'S MEETING. WE HAVE A LOT OF PUBLIC HERE.THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO WISH TO ADDRESS OUR AGENDA OR ANY ITEM NOT ON OUR AGENDA.
WE'LL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO HERE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING, AS WELL AS NEAR THE END OF THE MEETING AFTER OUR AGENDA IS COMPLETE.
THOSE WHO WISH TO ADDRESS THE BOARD MUST COMPLETE A SMALL WHITE PIECE OF PAPER LOCATED ON THE TABLE NEAR THE DOOR AND PRESENT THE CARD TO THE BOARD OR A MEMBER OF THE TOWNSHIP STAFF PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD.
WHEN IT'S YOUR TURN SUPERVISOR. THAT'S ME.
WE'LL CALL YOU UP TO CALL THE NEXT SPEAKER TO THE PODIUM TO SPEAK TO THE TOPICS INDICATED.
WHILE IT'S NOT REQUIRED, IT IS HELPFUL FOR THE SAKE OF OUR MEETING MINUTES IF YOU PROVIDE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD AT THE BEGINNING OF YOUR REMARKS.
CITIZENS ARE REQUIRED TO LIMIT COMMENTS 2, 3 MINUTES.
AN AUTOMATED SYSTEM WILL KEEP TRACK OF THE TIME AND AN AUDIT WILL BE WILL ALERT YOU WHEN YOUR TIME HAS EXPIRED.
THE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD VALUE THE PUBLIC COMMENT AND INPUT.
THE MEETING FORMAT AND RULES, HOWEVER, DO RESTRICT BOARD MEMBERS FROM ENGAGING IN CONVERSATION WITH COMMENTERS OR ANSWERING QUESTIONS DIRECTLY.
QUESTIONS AND CONCERNS MAY BE ADDRESSED BY BOARD MEMBERS AT A LATER TIME IN THE MEETING, OR IT MAY BE REFERRED TO A MEMBER OF THE TOWNSHIP STAFF TO FOLLOW UP ON.
PLEASE ADDRESS ALL COMMENTS TO THE BOARD AND OR THE BOARD'S CHAIR AND NOT TO INDIVIDUAL BOARD MEMBERS OR TO OTHERS IN THE AUDIENCE.
WITH THAT SAID, WE DO HAVE A NUMBER OF PUBLIC COMMENT REQUESTS.
FIRST THIS EVENING IS BRAD SHAW, FOLLOWED BY JANE CHARRETT, MR. SHAW.
>> THANK YOU, BRAD SHAW, 4504 DOBIE ROAD, TALKING ABOUT THE DOBIE ROAD REZONING.
LAST YEAR, OUR LAST MEETING WE HEARD FROM ONE BOARD MEMBER, YOU MAY NOT LOVE THE NOTICE REQUIREMENTS OF THE MASTER PLAN, AND YOU MAY NOT LOVE THAT SOME FOLKS GOT INVOLVED IN THE MASTER PLANS UPDATE, AND SOME DIDN'T.
THIS IS A VERY LOW BAR FOR MEETING THE PUBLIC INTEREST.
YOU KNOW THAT THE PEOPLE THAT WERE THERE HAD AN AGENDA, AND YOU KNOW THAT THE PEOPLE WHO WERE AGAINST THAT AGENDA WERE NEVER INVITED THERE.
THE PUBLIC NOTICE FOR A MASTER PLAN IS NOT THE SAME AS A PUBLIC NOTICE FOR REZONING.
YOU HAVE PRETENDED THAT YOU HAVE REZONED PROPERTY FROM INSTITUTIONAL TO RESIDENTIAL WITH PROPER PUBLIC NOTIFICATION.
YOU CAN'T SHOW THAT YOU'VE DONE THAT.
IT IS ODD THAT WE ARE NOW MOVING FROM RESIDENTIAL TO HIGH DENSITY RESIDENTIAL WHEN YOU NEVER DID ANYTHING PROPERLY GETTING FROM INSTITUTIONAL TO RESIDENTIAL.
THERE WERE TWO PARTY TRICKS, THEY WERE CLEVER, BUT YOU DID NOT LEGALLY REZONE THAT PROPERTY FROM INSTITUTIONAL TO RESIDENTIAL.
I NOTICED IN THE RESOLUTION, YOU INCLUDED THE TWO YEAR LIMIT, AND IN THE NOTICE, YOU DID NOT.
[00:05:03]
IT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU COULD ADD THOSE THREE WORDS TO THE NOTICE, SO THAT'S CLEAR IF YOU GO THAT WAY.THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE PROCESS, I HAVE NEVER BEEN NOTIFIED BY THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP ON ANYTHING.
I'VE HAD PEOPLE, DOING CORE SAMPLES IN MY FRONT LAWN.
THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT ISSUE TO ME, AND I'VE GOT NO MEANINGFUL COMMUNICATION.
I'VE ASKED IN EMAILS THAT I BE NOTIFIED.
I AM HERE PRIMARILY TO BEG YOU THAT AS SOON AS YOU GET THE SITE PLAN, THAT YOU NOTIFY ME.
I HAVE A RIGHT TO REVIEW THAT AS SOON AS YOU HAVE IT.
DO NOT WAIT UNTIL 48 HOURS BEFORE I HAVE TO GIVE THREE MINUTES ON THE SUBJECT.
THAT IS MY REQUEST. THANK YOU.
FOLLOWED BY SUZANNE LE ALOHA. THANK YOU.
>> JANE CHART, 6221 BRIDGEWATER CIRCLE EAST LANSING.
I'M HERE TO SUPPORT THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER ON BEHALF OF MYSELF AND MY HUSBAND, JOHN. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. SUZANNE LE ALOHA AND THEN STEVE AGNOSI.
>> HI, EVERYBODY. SUZANNE LE ALOHA, AND I LIVE IN LAKE OF THE HILLS AND HASLETT.
I ALSO AM REPRESENTING A FELLOW SENIOR CENTER ADVISORY BOARD MEMBER THAT SHE WASN'T ABLE TO BE HERE TONIGHT.
SHE DID SEND AN E MAIL TO EVERYONE, BUT I WANTED THE PUBLIC TO ALSO HEAR IT.
I TALKED WITH HER. SHE SAID IT WAS OKAY.
IS THAT RIGHT TO READ THAT? SHE LIVES IN OKEMOS.
I CAN NEVER PRONOUNCE HER LAST NAME.
BORIS SWESKI AND BOTH OF US SUPPORT THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
SOME OF THE REASONS THAT BOTH OF US ARE VERY INTERESTED IN THIS SUPPORTING IT IS THAT ONE, THE OPERATING COSTS FOR A FULL SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER ARE ESTIMATED TO BE 2.5 TIMES HIGHER THAN THOSE FOR THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
B, BUILDING COSTS ARE ESTIMATED TO BE ROUGHLY 500 SQUARE FEET, $500 PER SQUARE FOOT.
$10,000 SQUARE FOOT WOULD UTILIZE THE ENTIRETY OF THE $5,000,000 GRANT THAT WE'VE BEEN PROVIDED.
GREATLY EXPANDING THE CENTER'S FOOTPRINT WOULD GRAVELY NECESSITATE HIGHER FEES AND TAXES.
C, PERSONNEL REQUIREMENTS FOR A COMPLETE SENIOR CENTER COMMUNITY CENTER ARE ESTIMATED TO BE 10.3 POSITIONS VERSUS 3.8 FOR A STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
D INCOME PROJECTIONS FROM 100% PROGRAM SPACE USAGE HAVE NO REAL WORD BASIS.
FINALLY, SENIORS HAVE REPEATEDLY RAISED CONCERNS ABOUT ENTRYWAYS AND PARKING.
THE FULL SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER CONCEPT DOES NOT SPECIFICALLY NOR ADEQUATELY ADDRESS THOSE CONCERNS.
>> THANK YOU. STEVE AGNOSI AND THEN BARBARA KELLY.
>> WITH YOUR FORMATION, I READ TO GO AFTER BARBARA IN TERMS OF WHAT THE COMMENTS ARE SO THERE'S NO CONFUSION.
>> THANK YOU. I'M BARBARA KELLY FROM 2576 WOOD HILL DRIVE.
I'M A MEMBER OF THE ADVISORY BOARD TO THE CURRENT MERIDIAN SENIOR CENTER.
AS YOU'VE HEARD, AND I HOPE HAVE READ IN AN EMAIL I SENT LAST WEEK.
THE ADVISORY BOARD SUPPORTS THE CONCEPT OF A STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
FURTHERMORE, WE OPPOSE THE COMMUNITY CENTER AS IT'S BEEN PRESENTED BY THE SCC TASK FORCE.
THE ADVISORY BOARD MET AGAIN YESTERDAY, AND WE HAVE A SPECIFIC REQUEST.
WE ASK THE TOWNSHIP BOARD TO CHARGE THE STAFF AND THE CONSULTANTS TO BRING YOU AT THE NEXT MEETING REVISED PLANS FOR THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER AND THE COMBINED SENIOR CENTER OR COMBINED COMMUNITY CENTER WITH TWO CHANGES.
FIRST, THE COMMUNITY CENTER SHOULD BE CONSOLIDATED INTO A RECTANGLE.
AS I THINK YOU'LL SEE LATER TONIGHT WHEN THE CONSULTANTS MAKE THEIR PRESENTATION.
THE L-SHAPED SENIOR PORTION WOULD MEAN THAT USERS OF THE COMMUNITY MEETING ROOMS WOULD NEED TO GO THROUGH THE SENIOR CENTER
[00:10:02]
TO GET TO THEIR ROOMS OR ELSE MAKE A VERY AWKWARD DETOUR AROUND PART OF THE SENIOR CENTER IN ORDER TO GET TO THE COMMUNITY MEETING ROOMS. SECOND, THE COMMUNITY CENTER SHOULD HAVE A SEPARATE ENTRANCE FROM THE SENIOR CENTER WITH PARKING RECONFIGURED.THE ADVISORY BOARD AND OUR MEMBERS SENIOR CENTER MEMBERS WOULD BE VERY HAPPY TO MEET WITH THE POLICE AND TO HEAR THEIR CONCERNS REGARDING HAVING TWO ENTRANCES AND DISCUSS WAYS TO ADDRESS THE PROBLEMS. WE NOTE THAT PLANS CALL FOR ENTRY TO THE SENIOR CENTER TO BE VIA KEY CARD, AND THE STAFF WILL BE PRESENT TO MONITOR THAT ENTRANCE WHENEVER THE SENIOR CENTER IS OPEN.
PRESUMABLY SEPARATE COMMUNITY CENTER STAFF WOULD BE PRESENT WHENEVER THEIR ACTIVITIES IN THAT PORTION.
OVERSIGHT OF TWO ENTRANCES WOULD SEEM QUITE DOABLE WITH THE PROPOSED PERSONNEL.
WE VERY MUCH HOPE THAT WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH THE TOWNSHIP STAFF AND THE CONSULTANTS ON REFINING PLANS FOR BOTH THE EXTERIOR FOOTPRINT AND THE INTERIOR SPACE OF A NEW SENIOR CENTER, WHETHER IT'S STAND ALONE FOR NOW OR AS PART OF A COMBINED SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER.
I'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS TONIGHT OR INDIVIDUALLY LATER.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION AND FOR WORKING ON PROVIDING A NEW SENIOR CENTER FOR US.
>> THANK YOU. STEVE AGNOSI AND BETH BECHTEL.
>> STEVE AGNOSI FROM RIVERWOOD PARK AND OKEMOS.
I WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT I'M SPEAKING AT THIS POINT FOR MYSELF AND NOT REPRESENTING THE SENIOR BOARD.
I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE ADDITIONAL COST OF THE COMMUNITY CENTER IN ADDITION TO THE SENIOR CENTER.
THE BUILDING COST IS 3.5 TIMES WHAT THE COST OF A STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER IS.
IT IS ESTIMATED BASED ON THE INFORMATION THAT YOU HAVE IN YOUR PACKET.
THAT THE BUILDING COST FOR A COMBINED CENTER AND SENIOR CENTER WILL BE SOMEWHERE $27-30 MILLION.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, THE OPERATING BUDGET FOR THE COMBINED CENTER IS 2.5 TIMES THAT OF THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER OR ABOUT $850,000 A YEAR.
THE COMBINED CENTER GENERATES ABOUT TWO TIMES THE INCOME, BUT THE COST IS MUCH HIGHER.
WE ALSO AS EVERYBODY WATCHED THE STOCK MARKET TODAY, THE ECONOMIC OUTLOOK IS NOT ROSY IN THIS COUNTRY RIGHT NOW.
WE HAVE A $5,000,000 GRANT THAT HAS A TIME CLOCK RUNNING, WE CAN'T AFFORD IN THIS ENVIRONMENT TO LET THAT LAPSE.
MY PERSONAL RECOMMENDATION IS THAT WE PROCEED NOW WITH ONLY THE SENIOR CENTER, AND REVISIT THE COMBINED COMMUNITY CENTER ADDITION IN THE FUTURE.
THE AMOUNT OF COST THAT WE'LL TAKE TO OPERATE THE COMBINED CENTER.
I AM NOT CONVINCED THAT THE VOTERS OF MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP WILL APPROVE, AND WE CAN'T RISK SENIOR CENTER WITHOUT A HOME. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. BETH BECHTEL, AND THEN CECILIA KRAMER.
>> BETH BECHTEL, HASLETT, MICHIGAN.
DEAR MERIDAN TOWNSHIP BOARD MEMBERS.
FIRST, I WANT TO AGAIN COMMEND AND THANK THE BOARD FOR BEING FISCALLY AND FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE TO THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS LAST AUGUST 8TH, 2024, WHEN THE BOARD VOTED NO ON THE VERY LARGE AND EXTREMELY EXPENSIVE YONKERS COMMUNITY CENTER AT APPROXIMATELY 40,000 TOTAL FINISHED SQUARE FEET, APPROXIMATELY TWO MILLION ANNUAL OPERATING COSTS PER YEAR, AND APPROXIMATELY 78 MILLION IN TOTAL INITIAL COST OVER 20 YEARS.
SECOND, I RESPECTFULLY ASK THAT THE BOARD CONTINUE BEING FISCALLY RESPONSIBLE TO THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS WITH THEIR UPCOMING DECISION REGARDING THE TWO TASK FORCE PROPOSAL.
PLEASE KEEP IN MIND FROM USHOUSINGDATA.COM OUT OF THE TOTAL 83 MICHIGAN COUNTIES THAT INGHAM COUNTY HAS THE HIGHEST PROPERTY TAX RATE,
[00:15:02]
ADDITIONALLY FROM TAX RATES STATS, ROORG, ''INGHAM COUNTY HAS ONE OF THE HIGHEST MEDIAN PROPERTY TAXES IN THE UNITED STATES, AND HAS RANKED 222ND OF 3,143 COUNTIES IN THE ORDER OF MERIDIAN PROPERTY TAXES''.SINCE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP IS LOCATED WITHIN INGHAM COUNTY, WHETHER OWNING A HOME OR RENTING, MERIDIAN AND TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS ARE BEARING THE HEAVY FINANCIAL BURDEN OF THE HIGHEST INGHAM COUNTY PROPERTY TAXES TAX RATES IN THE STATE OF MICHIGAN.
ADDITIONALLY, FROM LAST MONTH MARCH 18TH, MERIDIAN AND TOWNSHIP BOARD MEETING PACKET, SPECIFICALLY ON THE LAST PAGE 338, MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP IS CURRENTLY AT 8.0629 TAX MILLS, WHICH IS ALMOST AT THE 10 TAX MILLS UPPER LIMIT.
EXCLUDING DEBT. PLEASE NOTE AS WELL WITH THE ECONOMIC REALITY OF ONGOING INFLATION OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS, AND THAT CONTINUES OUR PROPERTY TAX ASSESSMENTS HAVE RISEN BY THE MAXIMUM 5% FOR 2023 AND 2024 CALENDAR YEARS.
BEFORE THAT, 3.3% IN 2022 CALENDAR YEAR AND JUST RECENTLY, 3.1% IN THE 2025 CALENDAR YEAR.
THESE HIGH INFLATION RATE MULTIPLIERS ON OUR PROPERTY ASSESSMENTS HAVE PLACED A VERY HEAVY FINANCIAL TAX BURDEN ON THE MERIDIAN AND TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS THESE LAST FOUR YEARS.
AS A RESULT, KEEPING IN MIND, ALL THESE PROPERTY COST FACTORS, MERIDIAN AND TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS HAVE BEEN AND ARE VERY, CURRENTLY OVERWHELMED WITH OUR OVERALL HIGH AND EXORBITANT PROPERTY TAXES.
UPCOMING DECISION WITH THE TWO TASK FORCE PROPOSALS, THIS NEWLY CONSTRUCTED FACILITY WILL FOREVER SIGNIFICANTLY FINANCIALLY IMPACT THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS NOW AND INTO THE FUTURE FOR PERPETUITY.
I ASK THE BOARD TO CHOOSE AN OPTION THAT IS LOWEST IN THE COST.
PLEASE, NO MORE MILLAGES BECAUSE THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS ARE CURRENTLY VERY OVERWHELMED WITH THEIR VERY HIGH PROPERTY TAXES AND CANNOT BEAR THESE RISING PROPERTY TAX FINANCIAL BURDENS.
AGAIN, I RESPECTFULLY ASK THE BOARD MEMBERS TO PLEASE REMAIN STEADFAST AND CONTINUE TO PLACE PRIMARY AND UTMOST IMPORTANCE ON BEING FISCALLY AND FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE TO THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. CECILIA KRAMER AND THEN KATHY YENSICH.
>> GOOD EVENING. I RISE THIS EVENING TO TALK ABOUT ACTION ITEM NUMBER 12, WHICH IS THE REZONING OF THE ADOBE ROAD PARCEL.
YOU'LL HAVE TO HELP ME OUT HERE BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEFORE YOU THIS EVENING AN ORDINANCE DEALING WITH THE FORMER FAITH LUTHERAN CHURCH PARCEL NOW OWNED BY FA DEVELOPMENT.
THIS ORDINANCE DEALS WITH THE REZONING OF THE PARCEL.
TO ME, THE ZONING OF A PARCEL QUESTION DEALS WITH A REQUEST ON HOW THE PARCEL MIGHT BE DEVELOPED THAT WOULD AUGMENT THE MASTER PLAN THAT THE TOWNSHIP HAS.
THE QUESTION BEFORE YOU SHOULD BE, HOW WILL THE PROPOSED ZONING CHANGE MEET THE GOALS OF THE TOWNSHIP AS OUTLINED IN THE MASTER PLAN.
BUT AT THIS POINT, IT SEEMS TO ME WE HAVE DRIFTED WAY OFF INTO SITE PLAN REVIEW LAND.
ISSUES OF SIZE OF EASEMENTS, NUMBER OF BUILDINGS, THEIR HEIGHTS, LOCATIONS, ETC.
THAT BEING SAID, AMONG ONE OF THE CONCERNS BROUGHT UP WAS THE ISSUE OF STORMWATER RUNOFF.
THE CONCERNS THAT THE SENECA NEIGHBORS MAY HAVE PROBLEMS WITH STORMWATER RUNNING INTO THEIR BACKYARDS, WITH THE ADDITION OF THE ADDITIONAL HARDSCAPE IN THE PROJECT.
STORMWATER RUNOFF CONCERNS HAVE RESULTED IN A REDESIGN ON A SKETCH PLAN FOR THE PROPERTY TO REMAIN IN THE SPRAS DRAIN DRAINAGE DISTRICT, AND HAVE A POSITIVE OUTLET INTO A STORM SYSTEM VIA PIPE.
FAITH LUTHERAN CHURCH HAS AGREED TO ENTERTAIN AN EASEMENT PROPOSAL ACROSS THE BACK CORNER OF OUR PARCEL THROUGH THE WOODS FOR THIS PURPOSE.
BUT BACK TO MY EARLIER POINT, WHAT YOU, THE BOARD, I HAVE BEFORE YOU IS THE CONCEPT OF HOW THE LAND IS BEST TO BE USED IN THE FUTURE TO MEET THE TOWNSHIP'S GOALS AS DEFINED BY THAT MASTER PLAN.
THE LOCATION IS WALKABLE, NEAR SHOPPING, TOWNSHIP PATHWAY SYSTEM, ADJACENT TO A BUS STOP, ACCESSIBLE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEMS, LOCATION ON A MAJOR ROADWAY, AND MOST IMPORTANT ADJACENT TO AND KITTY CORNER FROM MULTIPLE HOUSING ZONINGS AND DENSITY THAT MAKES IT A NATURAL PARCEL TO BE A MULTIPLE HOUSING RD DENSITY ZONING. THANK YOU.
[00:20:02]
>> KATHY YENSICH, THEN JULIE STAFFER.
I LIVE AT 809 PIPER ROAD IN HASLETT, AND I AM TOTALLY IN SUPPORT OF A STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER, AND SO ARE MY FRIENDS THAT ARE HERE TONIGHT. THANK YOU.
>> I'M JULIE STAFFER, 2370 SHAWNEE TRAIL.
I'M IN SUPPORT OF THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
AS PRICES CONTINUE TO RISE THROUGHOUT OUR COUNTRY, IT IS IMPERATIVE TO KEEP THE FEES AND PROPERTY TAXES AT A LOWER RATE FOR THOSE WHO STRUGGLE FINANCIALLY.
MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP NEEDS TO BE FISCALLY RESPONSIBLE TO ITS CITIZENS. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. JERRY FEEDLAND, AND PAUL SHIMKZ.
>> GOOD EVENING, BOARD MEMBERS.
I'M HERE BEFORE YOU THIS EVENING IN SUPPORT OF THE DOBIE ROAD REZONING.
LAST TIME, WHEN WE MET IN MARCH, AND YOU ALL VOTED 4-3 TO APPROVE THIS.
I WENT HOME AND THE NEXT DAY, WE HIRED CIVIL ENGINEER, AND WE HIRED THE SURVEYORS.
WE HAVE A SURVEY FOR THE PLAN.
WE HAVE A GENERAL PLAN FOR THE SITE, AND WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON FLOOR PLANS AND TRYING TO GET THIS WHOLE THING TOGETHER TO PRESENT.
I HAD HEARD THAT REALLY WASN'T THE VOTE.
HOPEFULLY THE FOUR THAT HAD VOTED FOR IT, ARE STILL FOR IT, AND POSSIBLY THE ONES THAT DIDN'T MAY DECIDE TO VOTE FOR IT ONLY BECAUSE THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE A UNANIMOUS DECISION.
I WOULD HOPE THAT. I WOULD JUST SAY TO STAND YOUR GROUND AND IF THAT YOU THINK THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION DID THE RIGHT THING.
WE CERTAINLY THINK THE PLANNING COMMISSION DID THE RIGHT THING, AND WE THINK THAT YOUR VOTE IN LATE MARCH WAS THE RIGHT DECISION, AND IT BRINGS IN POSSIBLY 32 NEW HOMES, RENTAL UNITS INSIDE THE TOWNSHIP THAT IS CLOSE TO THE WALKABLE COMMUNITY, THE BUS STOP, ALL THE UTILITIES.
WHENEVER YOU'RE WORKING WITH AN INFILL PROJECT, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE NEIGHBORS.
WE UNDERSTAND THAT IF YOU'RE A NEIGHBOR NEXT DOOR, THAT YOU DON'T WANT FOR US TO CHANGE.
BUT WE HAVE AGREED TO STAY SUBSTANTIALLY AWAY FROM THE BACK PROPERTY LINE AND ONLY HAVE TWO STORIES FOR THE BACK TWO BUILDINGS.
WE WELCOME THE NEIGHBORS TO PARTICIPATE IN THAT BUT YOU WILL FIND THAT WE ARE A FRIENDLY AND WORKABLE DEVELOPER THAT WILL MAKE SURE THAT WE SATISFIED MOST PEOPLE'S CONDITIONS AND SITUATION, AND I KNOW THAT YOU'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT IT.
>> GOOD EVENING. I'M PAUL SHIMKZ.
I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF MYSELF AND MY WIFE TO SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT SENIOR CITIZEN SENIOR CENTER. THANK YOU.
I LIVE AT 2019 LOCH DUMONT, AND HASLETT.
I AM A REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE SENIOR ADVISORY BOARD HERE IN MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP.
WE HAVE SPENT A LOT OF TIME TALKING ABOUT DIFFERENT PLANS, HAVING DISCUSSIONS WITH DIFFERENT PEOPLE.
THE BOARD OR OUR COMMITTEE IS FIRMLY IN FAVOR OF A SINGLE BUILDING AT THIS TIME.
[00:25:05]
WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT THERE'LL BE AN ADDITIONAL ENTRANCE WITH THE PARKING SO THAT IF IN THE FUTURE, THAT THERE IS MONEY TO HAVE A COMMUNITY CENTER THAT IT CAN BE ADDED ON, AND IT WOULD NOT BE EVERYBODY COMING THROUGH ONE ENTRYWAY.THAT IT WOULD BE WISER AND SPEND LESS MONEY IF YOU COULD DO THAT AT THIS TIME.
ALSO, WE WOULD LIKE TO BE INVOLVED IN THE PLANNING OF THE INDIVIDUAL ROOMS FOR WHICH DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES ARE PLANNED AND TO BE ABLE TO SIT IN ON THAT BEFORE THE PLANS ARE FINALIZED.
WE WANT TO BE CONTINUED TO BE INVOLVED WITH EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING ON.
WE FEEL IT'S VERY IMPORTANT FOR THE COMMUNITY TO HAVE THIS.
ONE CONCERN AND QUESTION THAT I HAVE PERSONALLY IS THAT WHEN I MOVED HERE OVER 20 YEARS AGO, I WAS SO PROUD OF MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP THAT YOU HAD A RULING ABOUT PRESERVATION OF LAND OF WETLANDS.
I LOOK AROUND NOW OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS, AND THE WETLANDS ARE DISAPPEARING.
WHEN PEOPLE BUY UP THE PROPERTY, SUCH AS COSTCO OR OTHER PLACES.
THERE IS NO PROVISION IN THERE TO PREVENT ANY DECIMATION OF THE ANIMALS LIFE THAT'S AROUND THERE.
I WISH YOU WOULD PLEASE TAKE ANOTHER LOOK AT THAT.
IF YOU'VE DONE AWAY WITH THAT, I WOULD LIKE YOU VERY MUCH TO CONSIDER PRESERVING THE WETLANDS AND THE BEAUTIFUL LAND THAT WE HAVE ALL AROUND US.
BUT THANK YOU FOR LETTING US SPEAK.
THAT IS THE LAST CARD I HAVE, IF ANYONE ELSE WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK, PLEASE FILL OUT A CARD AND GET IT TO US VERY QUICKLY.
>> ONE OF THINGS I LEARNED AS YOU GET OLD IS NOT FOR SISSIES.
THINGS HAPPEN TO YOU. THINGS HURT THAT NEVER HURT BEFORE.
MEMORIES THAT YOU HAD REALLY GO BACK A LONG TIME AGO, BUT YESTERDAY MIGHT NOT BE THERE.
ONE OF THE PLACES THAT I'VE ENJOYED SINCE I'VE LIVED HERE, AND I'VE LIVED HERE FOR FIVE YEARS AT 5702 WOODMONT AND HASLETT IS THE SENIOR CITIZENS.
WE PLAY EUCHRE ON WEDNESDAY, WE PLAY OTHER GAMES DURING THE WEEK.
WE HAVE A PLACE WHERE WE CAN BELONG AND PEOPLE UNDERSTAND US.
THEY DON'T LAUGH BECAUSE I WALK FROM HERE.
WE NEED TO TAKE CARE OF THE SENIORS, AND THE ONES WHO BUILT THIS COUNTRY. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. BONNIE JORDAN.
>> I'M BONNIE JORDAN, AND I'M NOT EVEN A MEMBER OF THIS TOWNSHIP.
I'M ON THE BOARD OF A CONDOMINIUM COMPLEX THERE.
I HAVE TALKED TO 29 PEOPLE TODAY, AND I COULD TALK TO MORE.
ALL OF THE PHONE NUMBERS ON HERE, AND ALL OF THE NAMES ARE IN PIE SUPPORT OF THE STANDALONE SENIOR CENTER.
I KNOW ONE LADY WHO'S JUST GONE TO WILLIAMSTON.
SHE'S COMING BACK TO US AGAIN.
I KNOW ANOTHER SENIOR WHO I PAY EXTRA.
I PAY MORE THAN WHAT TWO PEOPLE PAY. SHE DOES, TOO.
SHE COMES FROM 15 MILES WAY OVER AT THE AIRPORT.
SHE'S THE CAR THAT PICKS HER UP LATE, SOMETIMES, BRINGS HER THERE EARLY, SOMETIMES, BUT SHE CAN FIT RIGHT INTO THE JAZZERCISE GROUP THAT'S GOING WATCHING US.
I DO JAZZERCISE, TWO DAYS A WEEK, YOGA ONE DAY A WEEK. WE HAVE EUCHRE.
I WAS THERE BACK IN THE '90S WHEN WE DID TRAMPOLINE ON THE REBOUNDING.
ALL OF THESE PEOPLE, I COULD NAME ALL OF THEM.
IT'S LIKE, I KNOW THEM LIKE BROTHERS AND SISTERS.
I SIMPLY THINK THAT RIGHT NOW I'M NOT PAYING THE TAXES, BUT ALL OF THESE PEOPLE, THERE ARE ONLY FOUR OF THEM OUT OF THE 29 WHO AREN'T MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS, AND THEY ALL VOICED CONCERNS ABOUT TAXES AND NOT EVEN HAVING SUPPLIES TO DO THIS ONCE IT GETS STARTED, AND THE MONEY IS THERE NOW, SO THEY FEEL STRONGLY THAT NEEDS TO BE THE STANDALONE SUPPORT OF THE SENIOR CENTER.
BUT IT IS THEIR WISH THAT IT WOULD BE A STANDALONE.
>> I'M SO GLAD THAT THE OKEMOS HIGH SCHOOL HAVE HAD US THERE FOR AS LONG AS THEY HAVE BECAUSE IT IS TRULY LIKE FAMILY.
[00:30:03]
>> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE WISHING TO ADDRESS THE BOARD AT THIS TIME? SEEING NON PUBLIC COMMENT IS CLOSED AT 6:30 PM.
[NOISE] NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS ITEM 6,
[6. TOWNSHIP MANAGER REPORT]
THE TOWNSHIP MANAGER, MANAGER DEMPSEY.>> THAT'S ALL. GOOD EVENING, BOARD MEMBERS.
JUST ONE ITEM TO BRING UP THIS EVENING, AND THAT'S THE JOINT MEETING THAT'S SCHEDULED FOR APRIL 29TH.
WHEN WE SCHEDULED THAT, WE DIDN'T REALIZE THE COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS ADJUSTED THEIR ENTIRE APRIL SCHEDULE TO BE SHIFTED A WEEK.
THERE'S A CONFLICT WITH THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS MEETING.
RATHER THAN RESCHEDULE THE MEETING BECAUSE WE'RE ALREADY GETTING OUR SVPS FROM OUR OTHER GOVERNMENTAL PARTNERS AND SCHOOL DISTRICT PARTNERS.
WE'LL CONTINUE TO HAVE THAT MEETING, AND THEN WE'LL ESTABLISH PROBABLY A SECOND MEETING TO MEET WITH OUR BOARD OF COMMISSION MEMBERS SEPARATELY.
THAT'S AGREEABLE TO EVERYBODY. THAT'S OUR PLAN.
I'LL HAVE MICHELLE REACH OUT TO EVERYONE TO PULL PEOPLE, BUT JUST WANTED TO MAKE YOU AWARE OF THAT.
OTHER THAN THAT, I WAS AN ATTENDEE THIS WEEK AT THE MICHIGAN TOWNSHIPS ASSOCIATION CONFERENCE FOR A COUPLE OF DAYS, PICKED UP SOME GOOD TIPS ALONG, I'M SURE SOME OF THE BOARD MEMBERS WHO ARE THERE ARE GOING TO COMMENT ON THAT.
BUT IN SESSION, WE GOT TO CONNECT WITH A LOT OF PEOPLE AND LEARN ABOUT SOME INNOVATIVE THINGS THAT MAYBE WE CAN ADOPT OR BORROW, AS WE SAY IN THE INDUSTRIES. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. BOARD MEMBERS, ANY QUESTIONS FOR MANAGER DEMPSEY? YES, CHRISTIANS.
>> THANK YOU. SUPERVISOR, MANAGER, I WANTED TO ASK A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS, EITHER YOU OR MAYBE THIS MIGHT BE BETTER FOR MR. OSIMER WHO WITH PUBLIC WORKS, BUT SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO THE INCIDENT OUTSIDE OF CAMPUS HILL APARTMENTS ON TUESDAY AND REALLY JUST HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING FOR BOTH MYSELF AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC ABOUT WHAT EXACTLY OUR ROLE AS A TOWNSHIP GOVERNMENT IS IN THAT.
AGAIN, IF YOU DO TANTRA OR DAN, WITH THIS BEING A STATE ROAD, I HAD HEARD FROM RESIDENTS PRIOR TO THIS HAPPENING THAT THEY WERE INTERESTED IN SOME ADDITIONAL PROTECTIONS BEING PUT IN FOR PEDESTRIANS, CONSIDERING THE PRIDE WE TAKE WITH THEM, STAYBRIDGE TRAIL, WHICH IS RIGHT THERE.
CAN YOU, SOMEWHAT QUICKLY, I KNOW WE'VE A LONG MEETING HERE, EXPLAIN WHAT EXACTLY THE LIMITATIONS WE HAVE AS A TOWNSHIP.
>> WE ARE HAPPY TO DO THAT. BRIEFLY, ESPECIALLY BOILS DOWN TO, AS YOU INDICATED, THIS IS A STATE TRUNK LINE.
MICHIGAN DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION DOES CONTROL IT.
IN TERMS OF ANY IMPROVEMENTS, THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH THEIR STANDARD PROCESSES, WHICH CAN BE QUITE DETAILED.
THEY HAVE A STANDARD SET OF SPECIFICATIONS FOR EVERYTHING FROM LANE WIDTHS TO ROAD CROSSINGS, SIGNALIZATION, ALL OF THAT IS VERY PRESCRIBED.
HOWEVER, THE TOWNSHIP CAN POTENTIALLY INFLUENCE THAT GOING THROUGH THEIR PROCESSES TO RECOMMEND CERTAIN IMPROVEMENTS.
THEY TYPICALLY DO VERY ROBUST STUDIES TO MAKE SURE IT MEETS THEIR CRITERIA.
EXAMPLE OF THAT WOULD BE OUR QUARTER OR IMPROVEMENT AUTHORITY HAS LOOKED AT WHAT ARE KNOWN AS RFPS.
THOSE ARE THE RECTANGULAR SIGNS THAT YOU SEE FOR PEDESTRIANS THAT HAVE THE RAPID FLASHING BEACONS.
THOSE ARE TOOLS THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THROUGH OUR CIA TO ADD AS AN ELEMENT OF SAFETY MEASURE ON [NOISE] THE CORRIDOR.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN IN THE WORKS.
BUT AGAIN, THAT WE WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH AN EXPENSIVE PROCESS.
AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE MICHIGAN DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION WILL HAVE TO APPROVE THAT.
WE ARE VERY LIMITED IN THAT AGAIN FOR DIRECT CONTROL, BUT THERE IS A PROCESS THAT AGAIN WE CAN FOLLOW AND GO THROUGH TO HOPEFULLY ADD ADDITIONAL SAFETY MEASURES.
>> I APPRECIATE THAT EXPLANATION AS SOMEONE WHO HAS UNFORTUNATELY BEEN HIT ON A WALL ON A BICYCLE BY A COUPLE OF VEHICLES OVER THE YEARS.
IT IS A SCARY SITUATION, AND I KNOW WE AND THE BOARD ARE ALL WISHING THE BEST FOR THE YOUNG LADY WHO WAS HIT, AND REALLY ANYTHING WE CAN DO, EVEN IF IT IS JUST TRYING TO COMPEL I'M DONE.
I THINK WE SHOULD REALLY LOOK INTO THOSE AVENUES, SO I APPRECIATE THAT.
>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? SEEING NONE.
BOARD MEMBER REPORTS OF ACTIVITIES AND ANNOUNCEMENTS.
[7. BOARD MEMBER REPORTS OF ACTIVITIES AND ANNOUNCEMENTS]
BOARD MEMBERS WITH REPORTS OF ACTIVITIES AND ANNOUNCEMENTS FROM BETWEEN OUR LAST MEETINGS, TRUSTEE WILSON.>> I ATTENDED IT WAS LAST TUESDAY, ALONG WITH MANAGER DEMPSEY AND TREASURE DHAN, THE CAPITOL AREA DISTRICT LIBRARY COMMUNITY MEETING, WHICH WAS REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO KNOW WHAT PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY LIKED ABOUT THEIR COMMUNITY FIRST,
[00:35:03]
AND THEN ABOUT THEIR LIBRARY.THEY'LL BE PUBLISHING INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT THEIR NEW STRATEGIC PLAN LOOKS LIKE WITHIN THE NEXT FEW MONTHS, AND I'M GLAD WE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO GIVE SOME FEEDBACK TO THAT GROUP.
>> IN THE INTEREST OF, AGAIN, THIS LONG MEET, I WON'T GO INTO EVERYTHING I LEARNED OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF DAYS AT THE MTA CONFERENCE, BUT I DID WANT TO POINT OUT THAT LAST WEEK, I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH TO SPEND A FULL DAY WITH TRI COUNTY REGIONAL PLANNING COMMISSION, WHICH I SERVE AS A COMMISSIONER ON THROUGH THIS BOARD, AND TRULY ONLY RECEIVED GOING REVIEWS ABOUT MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP.
EVERYONE HERE IN THIS ROOM, I GUESS I'LL LET YOU KNOW THAT AS FAR AS AN ENVIRONMENTAL COMMUNITY, WE ARE THE GOLD STANDARD IN THIS AREA.
WHEN IT COMES TO TRANSPORTATION AND CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS, CONSIDERING THE LIMITATIONS ON TOWNSHIPS.
I LEARNED PLENTY OF THINGS, BUT IT WAS ENCOURAGING TO HEAR THAT MERIDIAN IS DOING WHAT WE CAN TO BE A GREAT COMMUNITY, SO I WAS REALLY FORTUNATE TO DO THAT.
THANK YOU TO MY BOSS FOR LETTING ME TAKE THE DAY OFF TODAY TO BE A GOOD BOARD MEMBER.
>> OTHER BOARD MEMBERS. TRUSTEE, DUCHENE.
>> YES. ALSO, I WANT TO MENTION A LIBRARY MEETING WAS A VERY GOOD MEETING, LOTS OF FEEDBACK FROM CATTLE.
GOOD AND BAD, AND THEY WERE CURIOUS ABOUT THE COMMUNITY AS A WHOLE, LOTS OF PEOPLE TO SHARE IT ABOUT THE LARGER RADIAN COMMUNITY.
MTA CONFERENCE WAS VERY USEFUL AGAIN THIS YEAR.
THERE WERE APPROXIMATELY 10 DIFFERENT SEMINARS ABLE TO ATTEND OUR MEETINGS ABLE TO ATTEND.
GOOD INFORMATION ON TOWNSHIP GOVERNMENTS, GOVERNANCE, FINANCE, AND EVEN A ZONING REGULATIONS THAT WE SHOULD CONSIDER.
AS MANAGER DEMPSEY SAID, TOWNSHIPS ARE VERY FREE TO BORROW FROM EACH OTHER AND WE HEARD LOTS OF IDEAS WE MIGHT WANT TO BORROW IN THE FUTURE.
AS APPROPRIATE, WE'LL BE SHARING THOSE WITH THE REST OF THE BOARD. THANK YOU.
>> OTHER BOARD MEMBERS, TRUSTEE DENISE.
>> LAST WEEK, I ATTENDED THE COMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION ALONG WITH MANAGER DEMPSEY, AND JUST A COUPLE OF DISCUSSION ITEMS. WE DISCUSSED TALKING ABOUT UNIVERSAL CONNECTIVITY IN MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP, LOOKING AT THOSE AVENUES, AND THEN GOING OVER THE COMMUNICATIONS, THEIR POLICIES AND PROCEDURES. THAT'S IT.
>> TERRIFIC. THANK YOU. TRUSTEE SUMMERLAND.
>> YEAH, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO AND I DID ATTEND THE MICHIGAN TOWNSHIP ASSOCIATION MEETING AS WELL.
IT'S ALWAYS SO NICE TO BE ABLE TO JUST CONNECT WITH OTHER PEOPLE AND OTHER TOWNSHIPS AND GET THEIR PERSPECTIVE ON GROWTH AND WHERE THEY'RE GOING ABOUT IDEAS THEY HAVE.
IT WAS SO JUST BENEFICIAL TO LISTEN AND GAIN THAT INFORMATION, SO I JUST WANTED TO SAY.
>> VERY GOOD. OTHERS? SEEING NONE, WE'LL MOVE ON TO OUR NEXT AGENDA ITEM.
OUR NEXT AGENDA ITEM IS ITEM 8 APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA.
[8. APPROVAL OF AGENDA]
I WOULD ASK WHOEVER MAKES THE MOTION THIS EVENING TO CONSIDER MOVING ITEM 13D UP TO 13B SO THAT OUR APPLICANTS WHO ARE HERE ON BEHALF OF ITEM 13D DO NOT NEED TO SIT THROUGH OUR DISCUSSION ON OUR INTERNAL POLICY DOCUMENTS AS THAT COULD PROVE LENGTHY.IF I WOULD ASK FOR CONSIDERATION FOR THAT, IF WE COULD.
WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE AGENDA THIS EVENING. TRUSTEE, WILSON.
>> I MOVE THE AGENDA WITH THE ADDENDUM THAT WE MOVE 13D UP ABOVE 13B.
>> SUPPORTED BY TRUSTEE TREZISE.
ANY DISCUSSION ON THE AGENDA? SEEING NONE, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE AGENDA AS AMENDED, PLEASE SAY AYE.
>> ANY OPPOSED? THE MOTION CARRIES.
NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS ITEM 9, THE CONSENT AGENDA.
[9. CONSENT AGENDA]
WE HAVE A NUMBER OF ITEMS ON OUR CONSENT AGENDA THIS EVENING, INCLUDING COMMUNICATIONS WITH THE BOARD.FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO DID COMMUNICATE WITH THE BOARD, AS I KNOW, A NUMBER OF YOU DID AFTER FRIDAY WHEN THE PACKET WAS CREATED, THOSE COMMUNICATIONS WILL BE INCLUDED IN OUR NEXT PACKET.
PLEASE YOU CAN WATCH OUT FOR THOSE IN OUR NEXT PACKET BEFORE OUR APRIL 15 MEETING.
ONE THAT IS OUR MARCH 18, 2025 REGULAR TOWNSHIP MINUTES.
BUT WE ALSO HAVE IN FRONT OF US CLOSED SESSION MINUTES FROM OUR DECEMBER 14, 2023 MEETING.
[00:40:04]
BOARD MEMBERS, IF YOU'D LIKE TO TAKE A MOMENT TO REVIEW THOSE IF YOU HAVE NOT ALREADY, PRIOR TO VOTING ON THE CONSENT AGENDA, THIS WOULD BE A GOOD TIME.WE'LL COLLECT THOSE AFTER THE VOTE.
WE ALSO HAVE OUR BILLS, SOME REAPPOINTMENTS TO THE LAKE LANSING ADVISORY COMMITTEE, AND A LEASE OF EASEMENT FOR LIBRARY 1802, PAGE 79 AND LIBRARY 1802, PAGE 80.
ANY MOTION ON THE CONSENT AGENDA. TRUSTEE WILSON.
>> SUPPORTED BY TRUSTEE LENTZ.
ANY DISCUSSION ON THE CONSENT AGENDA? SEEING NONE, DEPUTY CLERK GORDON, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. BOARD MEMBERS AT THIS TIME, IF YOU COULD PLEASE PASS YOUR MANILLA FOLDERS OVER TO THE CLERK.
MAKE SURE WE'VE GOT SEVEN OF THOSE.
NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS ITEM 10.
QUESTIONS FOR THE ATTORNEY. WE HAVE NONE.
[12.A. Ordinance 2025-03 – Rezone vacant Dobie Road (parcel ID #33-0202-22-454-003) from RAA, One-Family, Low Density Residential, to RD, Multiple Family Residential, up to 8 units per acre, Subject to a Conditional Rezoning Agreement-Final Adoption]
HEARINGS, WE HAVE NONE.THAT BRINGS US TO ITEM 12A, OUR FIRST ACTION ITEM OR ONLY ACTION ITEM OF THE EVENING, WHICH IS ORDINANCE 2020 503, REZONED VACANT ROAD PARCEL ID NUMBER 30 202-224-5403 RAA, ONE FAMILY LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL RD, MULTI FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, UP TO EIGHT UNITS PER ACRE SUBJECT TO A CONDITIONAL REZONING AGREEMENT FOR FINAL ADOPTION.
WITH US THIS EVENING, WE HAVE DIRECTOR SCHMITT.
BUT HAVE YOU GOT FOR US, DIRECTOR SCHMITT.
>> NOTHING SPECIFIC TO ADD TO THE PREVIOUS DISCUSSION AS DIRECTED BY THE BOARD.
WE DID PUBLISH NOTICE OF INTENT TO ADOPT IN THE NEWSPAPER.
THIS IS ABLE TO BE APPROVED FOR FINAL ADOPTION THIS EVENING.
AS A REMINDER, THE TWO CONDITIONS OF APPROVAL ON THIS WOULD LIMIT THE DENSITY ON THE SITE TO A TOTAL OF FOUR BUILDINGS, 32 UNITS, AND IT WOULD INCREASE THE REAR YARD SETBACK.
ADJACENT TO THE NEIGHBORING RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY TO 100 FEET FOR THE BUILDINGS.
I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS IF THERE ARE ANY.
THAT'S WHERE I WOULD LEAVE IT THIS EVENING.
>> COURT MEMBERS. A DISCUSSIONS OR MOTIONS TO BE MADE AT THIS TIME.
WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS. TRUSTEE TREZISE.
>> I MOVE TO ADOPT THE RESOLUTION APPROVING ORDINANCE 2025-03, AND ORDINANCE TO REZONE A VACANT PARCEL ON DOBIE ROAD, PARCEL ID 33-0202-22-454-003 FROM RAA, ONE FAMILY LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL TO RD, MULTIPLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL UP TO EIGHT UNITS PER ACRE, SUBJECT TO A CONDITIONAL REZONING AGREEMENT.
>> IT'S BEEN MOVED BY TRUSTEE TREZISE. DO WE HAVE A SECOND?
>> SUPPORTED BY TRUSTEE WILSON.
ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION, TREASURER DESCHAINE.
>> QUESTION FOR DIRECTOR SCHMITT.
THE RESIDENTS WHO HAVE BEEN OPPOSED TO THIS HAVE BEEN OPPOSED TO IT BECAUSE OF THE ISSUES THAT BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT DRAINAGE, CONCERNED ABOUT DENSITY, CONCERNED ABOUT TRAFFIC.
BUT I THINK THE ONE THAT REALLY IS THE HARDEST FOR THEM TO SWALLOW IS THE PROCESS THAT'S INVOLVED HERE.
WHAT CAN WE DO IN THE FUTURE TO MAKE SURE WE DON'T EVER DO THIS AGAIN, CERTAIN PARTIES GET A CHANCE TO COMMENT, AND OTHER PARTIES ARE NOT INFORMED THAT THIS IS A DISCUSSION TOPIC THAT WILL IMPACT THEM AS HAPPENED HERE?
>> ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
THAT'S A PROBLEM THAT PLANNERS HAVE STRUGGLED WITH SINCE THE DAWN OF TIME IS GETTING PEOPLE TO COME OUT AND TALK ABOUT THINGS WHEN THEY'RE NOT DIRECTLY ADJACENT TO THEIR BACKYARD.
CERTAINLY WITH THE NEXT MASTER PLAN UPDATE, WE'LL TAKE ANOTHER CRACK AT PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT AND FURTHER ENHANCE THAT TO TRY AND GET MORE PEOPLE INVOLVED.
OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR YOU BECAUSE IF I DID, I'D BE THE RICHEST PLANNER IN THE WORLD.
BUT THAT'S REALLY WHERE IT STARTS, WE NEED MORE PEOPLE TO BE INVOLVED IN THE ACTUAL PLANNING PROCESS.
BUT THE PEOPLE WHO WEREN'T INFORMED THIS TIME, DID A BUTT AGAINST THEIR PROPERTY OF OF SENECA, AND THEY WERE NOT INFORMED, CORRECT?
>> TYPICALLY, THERE IS NOT A IT'S UNIQUE THAT WE HAD A VERY FINITE NUMBER OF CHANGES TO OUR FUTURE LAND USE MAP THAT WE COULD OUTLINE IN SUCH SPECIFICITY IN THE PLAN.
TYPICALLY, THERE'S CHANGES ALL OVER THE PLACE AND YOU'RE CHANGING DESIGNATIONS, AND YOU'RE REALLY DOING BROADER BASE PLANING.
I THINK THE UNIQUE SITUATION HERE WAS BECAUSE IT WAS COMING OUT OF COVID, WE DIDN'T DO A WHOLE LOT OF CHANGES.
NORMALLY, I WOULD TELL YOU THAT OKAY, WELL, NOTIFYING EVERYONE THAT THIS AFFECTS WOULD BE ABOUT HALF THE TOWNSHIP BECAUSE YOU'RE CHANGING THIS DESIGNATION AND IT AFFECTS PROPERTIES THROUGHOUT THE TOWNSHIP.
[00:45:02]
CERTAINLY, IN THIS CASE, WE COULD HAVE REACHED OUT DIRECTLY TO THE NEIGHBORS.THAT'S CERTAINLY SOMETHING WE COULD HAVE DONE.
IN THE FUTURE, IF THERE ARE SPECIFIC CHANGES LIKE THIS, THAT'S CERTAINLY SOMETHING THAT WE WILL CONSIDER.
>> IT MAKES THE WHOLE PROCESS I SUSPECT OF THESE NEIGHBORS THAT THE TWO PARTIES THAT ARE GOING TO BENEFIT FROM THIS HAD FULL ACCESS, AND THE OTHERS WEREN'T EVEN INFORMED OF THE DISCUSSION.
>> TO BE CLEAR, EVERYONE IN THE TOWNSHIP HAD FULL ACCESS.
ANYWAY, THE PROCESS STAKES IN THIS CASE.
I UNDERSTAND THE RESIDENTS BEING REALLY UPSET NOT WITH THE DECISION, BUT THE WAY WE GOT TO THE DECISION THAT THEY FELT EXCLUDED FROM IT. THANK YOU.
>> BOARD MEMBERS. FURTHER DISCUSSION. TRUSTEE WILSON.
>> WHEN WE COME TO THE JUNCTURE OF SITE PLAN REVIEW, WHAT IS THE NOTIFICATION PROCESS FOR THAT? ARE ANY OF THE ADJACENT NEIGHBORS NOTIFIED?
>> I DON'T KNOW SPECIFICALLY YET BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE SPECIFIC SQUARE FOOTAGES OF BUILDINGS TO TELL YOU WHAT THE PROCESS IS GOING TO BE.
I CAN TELL YOU THAT IF IT DOES TRIGGER THE SQUARE FOOTAGE REQUIREMENT FOR A SPECIAL USE PERMIT, THEN EVERYONE WILL BE NOTIFIED WITHIN 300 FEET AS IS NORMALLY THE CASE.
IF IT DOES NOT TRIGGER THAT, THERE IS NO PUBLIC NOTIFICATION REQUIREMENT.
>> WHAT IS THE SQUARE FOOTAGE REQUIREMENT?
>> IF IT COMES UNDER 25,000, THERE'S NO NOTICING REQUIREMENT?
>> IF IT'S OVER, IT WOULD COME BACK TO THIS BOARD.
>> IT WOULD COME BACK TO THIS BOARD.
>> I BELIEVE THE SITE PLAN AND THE AVAILABILITY TO REVIEW IT ARE PUBLISHED.
THEY JUST AREN'T DIRECTED INDIVIDUALLY TO PROPERTY.
>> FROM A SITE PLANNING PERSPECTIVE, THERE'S NO PUBLIC NOTICE REQUIREMENT FOR BASIC SITE PLAN.
>> YOU DON'T POST IT ON THE WEBSITE.
>> WE TRY TO POST EVERYTHING ON THE WEBSITE.
YES. AS A GENERAL RULE PRACTICE, WE DO, BUT THERE'S NO REQUIREMENT.
>> I THINK TO TREASURER DESCHAINE'S POINT, I UNDERSTAND THAT IF WE MAKE DOZENS OF CHANGES TO THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP, IT'S IMPRACTICAL TO TRY TO REACH OUT TO EVERY NEIGHBOR FOR EVERY CHANGE.
IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, GIVEN THE SENTIMENT THAT THE PUBLIC IS EXPRESSING, WHILE THERE IS NO NOTICING REQUIREMENT, PERHAPS, WHEN THE SITE PLAN REVIEW IS SCHEDULED, WE COULD NOTIFY THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOOD TO THE 300 FEET OR WHATEVER THE STANDARD IS FOR OTHER NOTICING, LIKE FOR THIS REZONING.
THAT THERE IS A SITE PLAN OCCURRING SO THAT THEY CAN HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO BE A PART OF THAT PROCESS.
COULD WE DO THAT AS A MATTER OF PRACTICE, NOT REQUIREMENT FOR THIS PARTICULAR ONE?
>> YES. I WOULD LIKE TO THINK ABOUT HOW THAT WORKS BECAUSE IT'S JUST AN INTERNAL PROCESS.
JUST MY GUYS SITTING AT THEIR DESK DOING THEIR JOBS.
THERE'S NOT LIKE A MEETING THAT WOULD HAPPEN.
>> REALLY? I FEEL LIKE IN THE PAST, THERE HAVE BEEN IN PREVIOUS ITERATIONS SOME KIND OF A PUBLIC MEETING RELATING TO SITE PLAN REVIEW, IS THERE NOT?
>> THERE WAS, AND THAT WAS REMOVED FROM THE ORDINANCE AS PART OF THE REDEVELOPMENT READY COMMUNITIES UPDATE IN 2023.
I SEE. I CAN CERTAINLY NOTIFY AND STAFF WILL UNDERSTANDING THE SENTIMENT, WE WILL COME UP WITH A SOLUTION FOR THIS PROPERTY.
>> I THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO REBUILD SOME OF THE TRUST WITH THE NEIGHBORS THAT I THINK.
TREASURE DESCHAINE WAS HINTING AT WAS BENT AT THE VERY LEAST AS A PART OF THE PROCESS.
UNDERSTANDING, OF COURSE, THAT EVERYONE IS WELCOME, AND IN FACT, IN TO TAKE PART IN THE MASTER PLAN, BUT ALSO UNDERSTANDING THAT THEY MAY NOT HAVE REALIZED THAT IT WAS AFFECTING A PARCEL NEAR THEM. TRUSTEE LENTZ.
>> THANK YOU. THINKING ABOUT THE, TIMES AND LIVES OF EVERYONE IN THIS ROOM, AND IN THE TOWNSHIP WHO DOESN'T, ALWAYS KEEP UP WITH EVERYTHING THAT THE TOWNSHIP IS POSTING.
CAN YOU ILLUMINATE A LITTLE BIT AS A NEW TRUSTEE THE TIMELINE THAT A MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC WOULD BE ABLE TO SEE A CONSIDERATION FOR A MASTER PLAN CHANGE AND VOICE THEIR SUPPORT OR DISPLEASURE AT EITHER TO THIS BOARD OR TO THE COMMISSION THAT MIGHT BE DOING THE ROUGH DRAFT PROCESS?
>> CERTAINLY THAT'S WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION EXISTS FOR US TO TAKE THAT FEEDBACK AT ANY TIME AND HAVE IT READY FOR WHEN WE DO DO AN FORMAL UPDATE OF THE PLAN.
I MEAN, WE HAD PEOPLE COMING TO US PRIOR TO THE MASTER PLAN ACTUALLY BEING OPEN, IF YOU WILL.
[00:50:01]
IN THEORY, YOU CAN DO AN UPDATE TO THE MASTER PLAN AT ANY POINT.PRACTICALLY IN MICHIGAN, NO ONE DOES THEM ANYMORE UNTIL THE FIVE YEARS IS UP BECAUSE WHEN THE STATE LAW WAS CHANGED, THE PROCESS FOR MAKING AN UPDATE TO THE PLAN BECAME SOMEWHAT CUMBERSOME.
UNDER STATE LAW, TECHNICALLY, YOU NEED TO DO IT EVERY FIVE YEARS.
WE WILL BE LOOKING AT OUR PLAN AGAIN IN 2028, CONSISTENT WITH THE EXPIRATION OF OUR 2023.
>> UPDATE. AS I'VE STATED MULTIPLE TIMES TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE BOARD AND THE PUBLIC, THAT THAT'S LIKELY TO BE A MUCH LARGER OVERHAUL.
BECAUSE WE WILL BE WELL CLEAR OF THE PANDEMIC BY THEN.
I THINK BY THEN, WE WILL SEE THAT WE ARE LARGELY A BROWNFIELD COMMUNITY AT THAT POINT.
THERE'LL BE LITTLE TO NO GREENFIELD DEVELOPMENT LEFT.
COMMUNITIES IN THAT NATURE, IN THAT REALM, NATURALLY HAVE DIFFERENT PLANNING EFFORTS THAN COMMUNITIES THAT ARE JUST BUILD THE NEXT SUBDIVISION THING.
THE NEXT REALISTIC UPDATE IS PROBABLY KICKING OFF IN FALL OF 28.
>> THANK YOU. I THINK ALSO AS A BOARD, CONSIDERING THAT WE'LL BE A YEAR THAT IN THROUGH, WE WILL ALL STILL BE ON THIS BOARD, THINKING AHEAD TO OUR TOWNSHIP BOARD GOALS OF 2028 AND MAKING SURE THAT COMMUNICATION IS STILL KEY AND HIGH UP ON THAT LIST OF GOALS WOULD ONLY BENEFIT US AND THE TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS.
>> I WOULD ONLY ADD JUST TO FOLLOW UP ON ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT THE PUBLIC DID MENTION, THAT IF THE MAKER OF THE MOTION WOULD JUST BE CLEAR THAT THE EXPECTATION IS THAT THIS WOULD BE FOR A TWO-YEAR PERIOD AND THAT IT WAS PART OF OUR PREVIOUS MOTION, JUST TO MAKE IT PART OF THIS MOTION AS WELL AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ON THE SAME PAGE.
>> I WOULD AMEND THE MOTION AND SEEK SUPPORT TO ADD INFORMATION IN THE MOTION THAT THIS IS A TWO-YEAR REZONING.
IF CONSTRUCTION HAS NOT BEGUN WITHIN THAT TWO-YEAR PERIOD, THEN IT WILL REVERT BACK TO OUR A, SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL.
>> WELL, WE'LL TAKE IT AS AN ACTUAL AMENDMENT THEN.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE AMENDED MOTION, PLEASE SAY AYE.
>> ANY OPPOSED? THE MOTION HAS BEEN AMENDED, AND NOW ON THE MAIN MOTION.
THE MOTION BEFORE US IS TO REZONE THE PARCEL IN QUESTION ON DOBIE ROAD, MAA8 TO RD, WITH A CONDITIONAL REZONING AGREEMENT AND A TWO-YEAR CLOCK.
DEPUTY CLERK GORDON, WILL YOU PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
>> THE MOTION CARRIES FOUR TO THREE.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE'RE ABOUT TO GET INTO A SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER.
THAT MIGHT BE A DECENTLY LONG PRESENTATION.
WITHOUT OBJECTION, WE'LL TAKE A FIVE-MINUTE RECESS AND BE BACK HERE AT 7:00.
NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS ITEM 13A,
[13.A. Senior/Community Center]
THE SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER.I'M GOING TO START WITH A BRIEF DISCUSSION BECAUSE WE DID NOT HAVE OUR FINAL PRESENTATION FROM THE SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER TASK FORCE.
WHEREUPON, I WILL TURN THINGS OVER TO DIRECTOR SCHMITT AND OUR TWO CONSULTANTS WHO ARE HERE FROM PROGRESSIVE, WHO WILL TALK TO US A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE SITE AND THE PROGRAM.
THEN I BELIEVE DEPUTY MANAGER OSIMER AND DIRECTOR BZINSKI ARE FLOATING AROUND TO TALK ABOUT THE OPERATIONS AND STAFFING PLANS AS THEY'VE BEEN PRESENTED AS WELL.
HOPEFULLY, I DIDN'T LEAVE ANYONE OUT.
WE ALSO, FOR THE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC AND THOSE AT HOME, WE DO HAVE A NUMBER OF LARGE EASELS AND PICTURES FOR YOU TO PERUSE.
IF YOU DO CHOOSE TO DO SO DURING OUR DISCUSSION, I'LL ASK THAT YOU PLEASE DO SO QUIETLY SO THAT WE CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE OUR BOARD DISCUSSION AND TRY TO BE AS NON-DISRUPTIVE AS POSSIBLE.
THE SENIOR CENTER TASK FORCE HAS BEEN MEETING SINCE SEPTEMBER OF LAST YEAR.
THEY HAVE MET MONTHLY, WHICH MEANS THEY'VE MET 1, 02, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 TIMES OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST SEVEN MONTHS TO GO OVER A NUMBER OF TOPICS THAT RESULTED TO THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THEY
[00:55:05]
MADE TO THE BOARD AT OUR MARCH MEETING.WE CONSIDERED, I THINK, 12 SITES, MAYBE 14 SITES BEFORE WINNOWING DOWN TO THE CENTRAL FIRE STATION SITES, WHICH IS WHAT YOU CAN SEE ON THE DIAGRAMS AROUND THE ROOM.
THEY CONSIDERED WHAT HOURS THE BUILDINGS MIGHT BE OPEN IN EITHER A SENIOR OR SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER PLAN.
WE DID A COUPLE OF DESIGN CHARADES BOTH HERE IN THE TOWNSHIP HALL ROOM AND OVER AT THE CURRENT SENIOR CENTER TO LEARN WHAT PROGRAMS AND PROGRAMMING THAT THOSE PUBLIC MEMBERS WOULD BE INTERESTED IN SEEING.
WE ALSO HEARD FROM OUR TOWNSHIP STAFF AS TO WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO STAFF AND OPERATE THOSE BUILDINGS.
AT OUR LAST MEETING, THE TASK FORCE DID RECOMMEND SEVERAL RECOMMENDATIONS.
I RECOMMENDED THE SITE OF CENTRAL FIRE STATION, WHICH, BY THE TIME WE GOT TO MARCH WAS THE ONLY REMAINING SITE AVAILABLE.
WE RECOMMENDED THE OPERATIONS PLANS AND STAFFING PLANS AS PROVIDED BY DEPUTY MANAGER SOMER AND DIRECTOR BZINSKI.
WE ALSO RECOMMENDED ONE OF THE TWO CONCEPT PLANS, AND THAT'S WHAT YOU SEE IN THE PICTURES AROUND THE ROOM HERE TODAY AND IN OUR PACKET.
THERE WAS ANOTHER OPTION WITH THE SENIOR CENTER ON THE NORTHERN SIDE OF THE BUILDING, AND THE TASK FORCE DECIDED THAT THAT WAS NOT THE IDEAL POSITIONING THAT WE WERE HOPING TO SEE ON THE SITE.
THEN WE RECOMMENDED THE PROGRAM, WHICH IS ESSENTIALLY THE SQUARE FOOTAGE AND ROOMS DISTRIBUTION FOR A SENIOR CENTER ONLY PROPOSAL, WHICH DID PASS UNANIMOUSLY, AND A SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER PROGRAM PROPOSAL, WHICH PASSED BY A VOTE OF EIGHT TO ONE, I BELIEVE.
WHAT WE SEE BEFORE US IN OUR PACKET TONIGHT ARE THE RESULTS OF THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS AND THOSE SEVEN MONTHS OF WORK.
I DO WANT TO CAUTION US ON A COUPLE OF THINGS.
OUR INTENT IS FOR THIS NOT TO COME UP FOR A VOTE AT THIS MEETING OR OUR NEXT MEETING, BUT BRING IT FOR A FINAL VOTE AT OUR FIRST MEETING IN MAY, WHICH IS MAY 8TH.
PLEASE BE AWARE OF THAT AS A MATTER OF PLANNING AS WE MOVE FORWARD.
WE'RE NOT MAKING A DECISION FOR THE FOLKS IN THE ROOM TODAY.
WE'RE NOT MAKING A DECISION TODAY.
WE'LL HAVE FURTHER DISCUSSION ON OUR APRIL 15TH MEETING, AND THEN A FINAL DECISION ON MAY 8TH, WHICH IS A THURSDAY AGAIN.
I WILL MAKE ONE MORE POINT OF CAUTION.
THE PICTURES THAT WE SEE AROUND THE ROOM AND IN THE PACKET ARE FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSES ONLY.
THEY ARE CONCEPT PLANS, AND THEY ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE.
BE VERY CAREFUL NOT TO GET READ TO WHAT WE SEE HERE IN THE PICTURES.
WHAT THE BOARD WILL HAVE TO DO IS DECIDE WHETHER TO MOVE FORWARD WITH BASICALLY THE SIZE AND SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE BUILDINGS ON THIS SITE BECAUSE THEY DO INCUR SOME COSTS TO BUILD AND OPERATE.
THEN WE'LL HAVE TO MAKE A DECISION ABOUT HOW WE FUND THIS PROJECT MOVING FORWARD, AND THAT'S PART OF THE DISCUSSION THAT WE'LL GET INTO OVER THE NEXT SEVERAL MEETINGS AS WELL.
BUT THE LAYOUTS OF THIS BUILDINGS SPECIFICALLY IN THE PICTURES THAT YOU SEE BEFORE YOU ARE ALL FUNGIBLE UNTIL BASICALLY SHOVELS GO IN THE GROUND IF WE CHOOSE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH EITHER OF THESE TWO PROJECTS.
SO PLEASE BE AWARE OF THAT AS WE'RE DISCUSSING THIS AS WELL.
AND WITH THAT, I'LL TURN THINGS OVER TO DIRECTOR SCHMITT AND OUR STAFF TO WALK THROUGH THE MEMO AND THE PRESENTATION.
>> THANK YOU. IN DISTILLING DOWN THE SEVEN MONTHS OF WORK THAT THE TASK FORCE AND STAFF OR CONSULTANTS PUT IN.
I FUNCTIONALLY TRIED TO STRUCTURE THIS IN A WAY THAT WE CAN REVIEW IT IN ESSENTIALLY SIX PODS OF INFORMATION.
SO THE BUILDING SITE ITSELF, AND THEN THE BUILDING LAYOUT ON THAT SITE AND THE BUILDING PROGRAM, WHAT'S IN THE BUILDING.
THEN PROGRAMMING, REVENUE AND OPERATIONS AND STAFFING ARE INTER LINKED.
THEY GET TALKED ABOUT TOGETHER.
I'M GOING TO KICK US OFF WITH THE BUILDING SITE BECAUSE CANDIDLY,
[01:00:03]
IT TURNED OUT TO BE THE EASIEST IN THE LONG RUN.AS THE SUPERVISOR MENTIONED, WE DID REVIEW, WELL, AT LEAST A DOZEN SITES PUBLICLY AND INTERNALLY, WE'VE REVIEWED A LOT MORE.
WE HAVE ENSURED THAT THERE IS NOT A STONE LEFT UNTURNED IN TRYING TO EVALUATE POTENTIAL LOCATION FOR THIS SENIOR CENTER OR SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER, DEPENDING ON WHICH PATH WE WENT.
AS THE SUPERVISOR MENTIONED, THE ULTIMATE DECISION OF THE TASK FORCE'S RECOMMENDATION WAS THE SPACE BETWEEN THE FIRE STATION, THE POST OFFICE ON CENTRAL PARK DRIVE, AND THAT'S WHAT THE LAYOUTS IN THE PACKET SHOW.
THAT IS A SPACE WE HAD PREVIOUSLY DONE A WETLAND DELINEATION ON.
WE KNEW WE HAD ENOUGH UPLAND SPACE THERE TO DO IT.
THE OTHER SITES THAT WERE DISCUSSED WERE ELIMINATED LARGELY AT THE OCTOBER MEETING OF THE TASK FORCE, WHERE WE DISCUSSED THEM AT LENGTH.
WE DID MAKE AN OFFER TO PURCHASE ONE OF THE SITES AT AN AGGRESSIVE MARKET RATE BASED ON AN APPRAISAL WE ORDERED.
THEY CHOSE NOT TO ACCEPT OR RESPOND TO OUR OFFER IN ANY TANGIBLE WAY AS THEY BELIEVE IT'S WORTH SUBSTANTIALLY MORE.
WE MOVED ON FROM THAT SITE AS IT WAS NO LONGER FINANCIALLY VIABLE.
WE ENDED UP WITH THE SITE THAT ORIGINALLY WAS PURCHASED FOR THIS TYPE OF USE.
IF YOU GO BACK THROUGH THE HISTORY OF THE TOWNSHIP, THIS PROPERTY WAS ACTUALLY PURCHASED FOR LIBRARY COMMUNITY CENTER TYPE USE.
IT'S A BIT OF A FULL-CIRCLE MOMENT FOR US HERE.
ONCE WE SETTLE ON THAT, THAT IS WHEN PROGRESSIVE AND OUR PARTNERS, BRENDAN AND ADAM, WERE ABLE TO REALLY GET INTO THE NUTS AND BOLTS.
HOW DO WE LAY THIS OUT ON THE SITE? THIS IS THE POINT WHERE I TURNED IT OVER TO THE GENTLEMAN STANDING BEHIND ME TO TALK ABOUT THE BUILDING LAYOUT IN THE BUILDING PROGRAM.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MY NAME IS BRENDAN OUZOONIAN.
I'M WITH PROGRESSIVE COMPANIES, AND WE'RE HONORED TO BE HERE AGAIN TO PRESENT THIS TO YOU.
A COUPLE OF THINGS, AGAIN, AND I GREATLY APPRECIATE THE INTRO AS FAR AS THESE BEING CONCEPTUAL.
I WANT TO REITERATE THAT FACT AS WELL, AGAIN, HERE, THAT PART OF OUR PROCESS, THE DESIGN PROCESS THAT WE WORK THROUGH IS WE HAVE TO GO BACK AND FORTH AS WE'RE WORKING THROUGH PROGRAMMING.
WHAT NEEDS THE SPACE, THE WANTS AND THE NEEDS THAT GO INTO THE SPACE, AND THEN MARRY THAT UP WITH POTENTIAL OVERALL BUDGETS, WHAT THE SITE LOOKS LIKE, WHAT THE SITE PARAMETERS WILL ALLOW YOU TO DO, HOW MUCH CAN YOU BUILD ON OR HOW CAN THAT WORK? THEN REALLY THEN WORK THAT ALL TOGETHER INTO AN OVERALL PLAN, WHICH IS, AGAIN, VERY CONCEPTUAL, AND IT'S GOING TO CHANGE.
THERE ARE GOING TO BE CHANGES ON THIS MOVING FORWARD.
REGARDLESS OF WHICH ONE IS CHOSEN, AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT'S GOING TO MOVE.
THE SITE'S GOING TO MOVE AROUND.
THERE ARE CERTAIN ELEMENTS THAT WE CANNOT MOVE, BUT THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO ADJUST AND MAKE ADJUSTMENTS WITH.
CERTAINLY THE BUILDING AS WELL, IS GOING TO DO THE EXACT SAME THING.
PLEASE KEEP THAT IN MIND AGAIN AS WE ARE TALKING THROUGH THIS.
FROM AN OVERALL, WHEN WE WORK THROUGH THE PROGRAMMING STATEMENT, IF YOU GO TO THE PROGRAMMING STATEMENTS.
THE SENIOR CENTER ONLY, AS WE HAD GONE IN THROUGH THAT, THERE ARE A FEW HIGHLIGHTS THAT I WANTED TO JUST HIT ON THAT ONE.
THERE'S A GREETING RECEPTION AREA, AND THIS IS GOING TO BE THE SAME FOR BOTH.
IT WILL GROW A LITTLE BIT IN, WHEN THERE'S A LARGE SPACE AND WHEN WE HAVE A LARGER BUILDING.
BUT THERE IS THAT TYPE OF AN ACTIVITY IN BOTH.
THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICES THAT, AGAIN, IT'S RIGHT SIZE FOR EACH DIFFERENT TYPE.
THEN WE HAD MANY DIFFERENT INPUT SESSIONS THAT WE WERE ABLE TO GET A LOT OF DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES SOURCES THAT ARE IN THE PACKET THERE.
AGAIN, I'M NOT GOING TO BELABOR THE POINT TO GO DOWN EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THEM, BECAUSE WE DID THAT THROUGH THE TASK FORCE AND REALLY WORKED HARD AT WHICH ONES NEED TO BE, WHERE THEY NEED TO BE AND GETTING PUBLIC INPUT AND ALL THAT.
THOSE DIFFERENT TYPES OF ACTIVITY SPACES, WHETHER THEY'RE WELLNESS FOCUSED OR SMALL GROUP MEETINGS AND DIFFERENT TYPE VERY SPECIALIZED THINGS AS WELL THAT ARE ALL IN THERE.
THAT BUILDING SQUARE FOOTAGE AGAIN CAME UP TO, AND IT'S A VERY PRECISE NUMBER ON HERE, WHICH AGAIN, IT'S SUBJECT TO CHANGE.
BUT IT WAS 15,000 ROUGHLY 600 SQUARE FEET AT THE END OF THAT ONE.
THE SECOND PROGRAM THAT YOU SEE WHICH ADDS THE COMMUNITY CENTER.
THEN ACTUALLY ADDS A BIG CHUNK OF THAT IS ADDING A GYM THAT ADDS A LOT OF SQUARE FOOTAGE,
[01:05:01]
OBVIOUSLY, THAT COMES INTO PLAY WITH THAT PIECE OF IT.THEN THERE WAS ALSO A YOUTH ACTIVITY AREA THAT ADDS ANOTHER LARGE SECTION OF SQUARE FOOTAGE IN THERE, AND THEN A LOT OF THE OTHER TYPES OF SPACES.
THEN THAT ONE GREW TO JUST UNDER 54,000 SQUARE FEET, AS YOU'VE SEEN YOUR PACKETS THERE.
I THINK WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO IS HAVE ADAM GO THROUGH A LITTLE BIT ON THE SITE PLANS TO SHOW YOU WHERE THIS HAS LANDED AND ON THE SITE.
PLEASE AS WELL NOTE THAT THERE'S A BIG HORSESHOE, IF YOU WILL, OF THERE'S 100-YEAR FLOODPLAIN THAT MORE OR LESS ENVELOPS THE LOWER HALF OF THE SITE THAT ADAM WILL PROBABLY TALK ABOUT A LITTLE BIT.
THERE ARE SOME BOUNDARIES THAT WE HAVE TO WORK WITHIN SOME PARAMETERS, AS WELL AS THE POST OFFICE AND THE FIRE STATION IN GETTING THIS INTO THE SPACE THAT'S HERE.
THEN WE'VE ALSO LOOKED AT THE STORMWATER THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF ON THE SITE, AND WE'VE TAKEN THAT INTO ACCOUNT BECAUSE THERE IS A, AND I'LL GET TO THAT A LITTLE BIT FURTHER ON, THE COST IMPLICATION IN WHAT WE HAVE TO DO IN ORDER TO TAKE CARE OF STORMWATER.
SO WE'VE ALREADY INCLUDED THAT INTO THE PLANNING HERE AS WELL AT A CONCEPTUAL LEVEL BECAUSE WE STILL HAVE TO DO ALL THE CALCULATIONS AND WORK THINGS THROUGH.
>> THANK YOU. MY NAME IS ADAM HOPKINS.
I'M WITH PROGRESSIVE COMPANIES, I'M A SENIOR DESIGN ARCHITECT.
THE PLAN THAT'S ON THE SCREEN IS THE CONCEPTUAL PLAN THAT WE HAVE DEVELOPED WITH THE COMMITTEE FOR THE SENIOR-ONLY SPACE.
IF WE CAN ZOOM UP A LITTLE BIT MORE, TIM? IN THIS CONCEPT, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE SENIOR-ONLY BUILDING IS SET BACK AWAY FROM THE ROAD CLOSER TO THE DESIRABLE VIEWS OF THE WETLAND AND IN A MORE QUIET SCENARIO THAN IF IT WAS UP NEAR THE ROAD.
THAT WAS ONE OF THE DIRECTIONS THAT THE COMMITTEE WAS VERY KEEN ON.
ANOTHER ASPECT OF THIS IS HAVING MORE, AS WE LOOK AT THE PARKING, YOU CAN SEE AND FROM THE GRAPHICS THAT ARE SPRINKLED THROUGHOUT THE ROOM, THE BOARDS, WE'RE SHOWING WHERE CAN A PLACEHOLDERS FOR FUTURE EXPANSION OF PARKING AND IF THERE'S A COMMUNITY CENTER INCLUDED, WHERE THOSE MIGHT BE.
WHAT WE'VE GOT IS PARKING THAT'S FOR THE SENIOR CENTER THAT HAS SOME SIDEWALKS THAT REACH OUT INTO THE PARKING ON BOTH SIDES, THE TOP AND BOTTOM.
THEN WE'VE HEARD FROM THE GROUP OF SENIORS THAT HAVING PARKING DIRECTLY ADJACENT TO THE BUILDING WOULD BE PREFERRED.
WE ADJUSTED PARKING, AND AGAIN, THIS IS STILL VERY CONCEPTUAL.
BUT IN THIS LAYOUT, WE BROUGHT A BUNCH OF PARKING UP VERY CLOSE TO THE BUILDING SO THAT A PERSON THAT PARKS CAN STEP OUT OF THE VEHICLE AND DIRECTLY ONTO A SIDEWALK AND UP TO THE DOOR WITHOUT HAVING TO CROSS THE PARKING LOT.
MORE THAN HALF OF THE PARKING SPACES IN THE LOT DO HAVE THAT ABILITY TO JUST GET OUT OF A VEHICLE ONTO A SIDEWALK, AND THEN TO THE DOOR.
AS BRENDAN MENTIONED, THE AREA THAT SHOWS UP IN BLUE ON THE PLAN IS STORMWATER MITIGATION, OR BASICALLY TAKING WATER FROM THE SITE AND CREATING A FEATURE ON THE SITE WHERE WE WOULD HAVE WETLAND PLANTS AND THEN LIKELY STANDING WATER FOR A POND.
GO AHEAD AND ZOOM TO THE PLAN.
THE WAY THE BUILDING IS ORGANIZED, IT HAS THE ADMINISTRATIVE FUNCTIONS RIGHT UP AT THE FRONT DOOR WHERE THEY'RE DIRECTLY ADJACENT TO THE MAIN ENTRY.
THERE'S A PATIO THAT GIVES A VIEW INTO THE WETLAND.
THERE'S INDOOR AND OUTDOOR SPACE THAT HAS VIEW TO THE WETLAND, AND THEN THE FIRST ACTIVITIES GOING THROUGH THE LAYOUT ARE THE LARGE GROUP ACTIVITIES FOR CARDS, AND IT'S LISTED.
THERE YOU GO. YOU JUST CIRCLE IT.
EVEN THOUGH THESE BUBBLES ARE INDIVIDUAL SPACES,
[01:10:06]
FOR EXAMPLE, THE FIRESIDE ROOM, ACTIVITY LOUNGE LIBRARY.THAT WHOLE ZONE IS LIKELY TO BE MORE OF AN INDIVIDUAL ROOM OR SPACE.
AT A PREVIOUS MEETING, I MENTIONED, SIMILAR TO THE WAY THIS ROOM IS SET UP, WHERE YOU HAVE THE BOARD IN ONE AREA AND THE PUBLIC IN ANOTHER AREA AND THE SPEAKER IN ANOTHER AREA, IF WE DREW THAT IN A BUBBLE DIAGRAM, THIS ROOM MIGHT LOOK LIKE THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT BUBBLES.
SIMILARLY, THESE CONCEPT PLANS DON'T NECESSARILY MEAN THAT EACH BUBBLE IS ITS OWN ROOM.
THEY MAY BE WORKING TOGETHER TO CREATE A MORE COHESIVE SPACE.
THAT BEING SAID, THE ACTIVITY SPACES UP THAT YOU FIRST ARRIVE AND INTERACT WITH WOULD BE THE MOST COMMONLY USED SPACES, AND THEN SOME OF THE ACTIVITIES THAT ARE FURTHER FROM THE DOOR ARE THE WELLNESS RELATED ACTIVITIES, AND THE SPACES THAT GENERATE A LITTLE MORE NOISE WITH TABLE TENNIS AND BILLIARDS, THE FUREST FROM THE QUIET ZONE.
WE HAVE RESTROOMS APPROPRIATE FOR EVERYONE IN THE BUILDING AND EXITING BOTH OUT TO THE PARKING LOT AND TO A PATIO, CONCEPTUALLY HAVING A PATIO THAT OVERLOOKS THE WETLANDS.
THAT'S THE LARGE GROUP OR THE SENIOR EXCLUSIVE SENIOR-ONLY BUILDING.
IN THIS PLAN, YOU'LL SEE, AND I THINK MANY OF THE PEOPLE IN THE HERE TONIGHT HAVE SEEN, AND IT HAS CERTAINLY BEEN MADE A PUBLIC DOCUMENT.
AGAIN, CONCEPTUALLY, HOW WE MIGHT CONNECT A COMMUNITY CENTER AND A SENIOR CENTER TOGETHER.
THE LARGEST SQUARE THAT YOU SEE THERE IS A TWO-STATION GYMNASIUM THAT WOULD GIVE THE ABILITY TO HAVE BASKETBALL AND UP TO SIX INDOOR PICKLEBALL COURTS.
AT THE TOP OF THE PLAN, CLOSEST TO THE ROAD, IS THE YOUTH SPACE.
THE YOUTH AND FAMILY SPACES ARE UP ON THE TOP PART OF THE PLAN, AND THEN THE SPACES THAT SUPPORT THOSE COME DOWN AND CONNECT ADMINISTRATIVELY, THE SENIORS ADMINISTRATION AND COMMUNITY ADMINISTRATION CONNECT, AND THEN THE SPACES THAT YOU SEE PLAN SOUTH OF THE GYM, EXCUSE ME, ARE LOCKER ROOMS AND LARGE GROUP SPACES.
THE INTENT HERE IS TO MAKE THE CONCEPT PLAN VERY EASY TO NAVIGATE AND UNDERSTAND.
IF YOU'RE COMING TO THE FACILITY, WHERE WOULD YOU GO COMING THROUGH THE FRONT DOOR? YOU MIGHT TAKE A LEFT TO GO TO THE SENIOR CENTER AND A RIGHT TO GO TO THE GYMNASIUM OR THE COMMUNITY CENTER.
>> WE HOLD UP FOR QUESTIONS UNTIL THEY GET THE FULL GAM, I THINK.
>> ONE OTHER THING THAT WE HAD DONE IN TRYING TO COME UP WITH JUST SOME COST BENCHMARKING IS THAT WE HAD WORKED THROUGH A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT SENIOR CENTERS THAT HAVE BEEN RECENTLY CONSTRUCTED AND ACTUALLY, THERE'S A GREENVILLE YMCA, WHICH IS VERY SIMILAR TO THIS AS FAR AS THE TYPES OF SPACES THAT ARE IN THERE.
WE PULLED THE INFORMATION THAT WAS OUT OF THERE.
WE TOOK IT WHEN IT WAS BUILT, WE ESCALATED IT UP TO THIS YEAR, BUT THEN WE ALSO ADDED ANOTHER YEAR OF ESCALATION.
WE'RE TRYING TO ACCOMMODATE A START OF NEXT YEAR OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
IF IT'S BEYOND THAT, THEN EVERY YEAR, THERE'S MORE ESCALATION THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDED ON.
BUT WE HAVE TRIED TO ACCOMMODATE AS MUCH AS WE CAN WITH THAT, AND THEN ANOTHER ONE IS DOWN IN PORTAGE, JUST SOUTH OF KALAMAZOO, THE ZANG SENIOR CENTER.
THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT LENSES HERE.
THERE'S DIFFERENT TYPES OF BUILDING MATERIALS BECAUSE THE OVERALL BUDGET CAN BE IMPACTED BY THE TYPES OF CONSTRUCTION THAT YOU UTILIZE, AS WELL AS THE TYPE OF MATERIALS AND FINISHES THAT YOU PUT INTO A PROJECT.
WE'RE TRYING TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF A RANGE HERE TO KNOW THAT IT CAN FALL SOMEWHERE IN HERE.
YOU CAN CERTAINLY GO A LITTLE BIT FURTHER, INSIDE OR OUTSIDE OF THERE TOO, IF YOU GO MORE SPARSE WITH FINISHES AND THE CONSTRUCTION TYPE,
[01:15:05]
OR YOU ADD ON TO THE AND GO A BIT MORE ON THE HIGHER END OF FINISHES AND THAT KIND OF THING, AND AMENITIES THAT ARE [INAUDIBLE] ALSO, WE TALKED A LOT ABOUT THE SITE WITH THE SITE THAT'S THERE.WE HAVE ADDED ABOUT $1.9 MILLION-ISH GUESTIMATE, AGAIN, AT THIS POINT, TO ACCOMMODATE FOR ALL THE SITE WORK THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN ON THE SITE, THE LOCATION, AND THE STORMWATER, AND OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT.
WE ARE TRYING TO BE GOOD STEWARDS HOLISTICALLY TO GIVE YOU THE BEST INFORMATION POSSIBLE SO THAT YOU HAVE A GOOD FEEL FOR A RANGE ON WHERE THESE PROJECTS COULD COME IN AT.
THAT'S IT ON THE BUDGET SIDE OF IT.
YOU'VE GOT TWO DIFFERENT RANGES AS YOU SEE AT THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE SHEETS THAT ARE THERE, IF IT'S JUST THE SENIOR CENTER ONLY OR THE COMMUNITY CENTER, AND AGAIN, THERE'S A LOT THAT CAN GO INTO THESE THAT CAN ADJUST THESE NUMBERS, UP AND DOWN.
BUT THESE ARE GOOD BALLPARK FIGURES TO AT LEAST MAKE A CONCEPTUAL DECISION AT THIS POINT.
>> THANK YOU. THAT'S ALL SITE-RELATED STUFF.
NOW TO GET INSIDE THE BUILDING, DIRECTOR BZINSKI IS GOING TO GO OVER SOME GENERALIZED PROGRAMMING AND REVENUE INFORMATION, AND THEN DIRECTOR DEPUTY MAJOR WILL ALSO TALK ABOUT THE NUTS AND BOLTS OF THE COSTS AND STAFFING.
>> GOOD EVENING, BOARD. WE'LL MOVE ON INTO TYPES OF PROGRAMS. LOOKING AT WHAT OUR EXISTING SENIOR CENTER PROGRAMS, THEY HAVE A VERY A GREAT MANAGER THAT DOES A REALLY GREAT JOB OF ASSESSING THE NEEDS OF THE MEMBERS, AS WELL AS PROGRAMMING AS FULL AS THEY CAN WITHIN THE SENIOR CENTER THEY HAVE.
THEIR EXISTING PROGRAMMING IS FANTASTIC, BUT I COULD EXPECT THAT IN A NEW BUILDING, THEY COULD EXPAND SOME OF THAT PROGRAMMING AND MAYBE ADD SOME TO THAT AS WELL.
WHERE IT GETS A BIT DIFFERENT IS IF WE LOOK AT A COMBINED COMMUNITY AND SENIOR CENTER WHERE THAT OPENS UP A LOT OF OPPORTUNITY THAT WE CURRENTLY DON'T HAVE HERE IN MERIDIAN.
SOME MAY KNOW, AND I THINK A LOT HAVE HEARD ME TALK ABOUT OUR RECREATION SPACE IS VERY LIMITED IN THE SENSE OF FIELDS AND ATHLETICS.
WE HAVE MINIMAL AMOUNT OF BASEBALL FIELDS, WE HAVE ZERO INDOOR FACILITIES, BUT WE PARTNER WITH OUR SCHOOLS.
WE HAVE TWO SCHOOL DISTRICTS THAT WE PARTNER WITH CONSISTENTLY.
WE ALSO WORK WITH EAST LANSING.
BUT MOST OF OUR BASKETBALL COMES THROUGH HAZLETT SCHOOLS, AND OKEMOS WE SHARE BASEBALL FIELDS AND SOCCER FIELDS WITH.
WITH THE CURRENT RECONSTRUCTION OF CHIPPEWA MIDDLE SCHOOL, WE ARE CURRENTLY DOWN FIVE ADDITIONAL BASEBALL FIELDS AS WELL AS TWO SOCCER FIELDS.
THAT'S BEEN A LITTLE CHALLENGING.
AS WELL AS BASKETBALL, WE ONLY HAVE CERTAIN AMOUNT OF GYMS IN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME.
LOOKING AT THAT, AS THIS IS HOW WE'VE BEEN FUNCTIONING, AND IT'S BEEN WORKING WELL.
THERE IS A SIGNIFICANT NEED FOR INTERIOR SPACE, IF AVAILABLE.
FOR EXAMPLE, IF WE HAVE A GYM THAT HAS TWO FULL-SIZE BASKETBALL COURTS, SIX PICKLEBALL COURTS, AND TWO VOLLEYBALL COURTS, THAT ALLOWS FOR A LOT MORE PROGRAMMING.
NOW, REMEMBER THOSE LAY ON TOP OF EACH OTHER, SO THEY'RE NOT ALL HAPPENING AT THE SAME TIME.
BUT RIGHT NOW WE HAVE TWO PARKS THAT HOLD PICKLEBALL COURTS, ONE AT HILLBROOK, ONE AT TOWNER.
THOSE PICKLEBALL COURTS ARE FULL, AS LONG AS THEY'RE OUT THERE RIGHT NOW.
THEY'VE BEEN OUT THERE LAST WEEK.
THEY WAIT FOR THE ICE TO COME OFF THE COURTS.
IT'S A VERY AGGRESSIVE GROUP THAT REALLY ENJOYS THEIR SPORT.
THEY WOULD PREFER, AND I'VE BEEN ASKED MULTIPLE TIMES, IF WE HAD ANY INDOOR SPACE.
I KNOW THAT WE WOULD BE ABLE TO FILL THAT SPACE WITH PROBABLY PICKLEBALL ONLY.
WE'LL BE CAREFUL AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE EQUITABLE.
ALSO, LOOKING AT BASKETBALL, WE WORK REALLY HARD TO NOT TURN AWAY ANY KIDDO.
BUT WHEN WE ONLY HAVE A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF SPACE, SOMETIMES WE HAVE TO LIMIT OUR ENROLLMENT.
IF WE HAD A BASKETBALL, WE COULD RUN LEAGUES, APPROXIMATELY 300 PLAYERS IN A BASKETBALL THROUGH DECEMBER THROUGH APRIL.
[01:20:05]
VOLLEYBALL, WE CURRENTLY DON'T HAVE ANY INDOOR VOLLEYBALL LEAGUES BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE FACILITIES.WE DO HAVE OUTDOOR SAND VOLLEYBALL LEAGUES THAT ARE VERY POPULAR.
WE COULD ADD IN THOSE VOLLEYBALL AS WELL.
SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE DON'T OFFER BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE SPACE ARE CAMPS AND CLINICS, SO NEW SPORTS OR SPORTS THAT AREN'T SOMETHING THAT WE REGULARLY PROGRAM, RUGBY, CRICKET, SOME OF THOSE ACTIVITIES COULD HAVE SOME DROP-IN CAMPS AVAILABLE.
CURRENTLY, SPORTIES FOR SHORTIES.
I KNOW EVERYBODY'S HEARD OF THIS.
SPORTIES FOR SHORTIES, VERY POPULAR, AND WE DO NOT PROGRAM IN THE WINTER, BUT WE COULD PROGRAM ALL WINTER LONG JUST FOR SPORTIES ALONE.
LIKELY UPWARDS OF 5-600 KIDDOS, IN ADDITION TO WHAT WE DO ALL SUMMER LONG.
THAT WOULD BE OUR ATHLETIC FACILITIES AND THE NEED FOR THE ATHLETIC FACILITIES.
THERE'S ONE OTHER GROUP THAT WE WORK WITH REGULARLY IS OUR 55-PLUS FITNESS PROGRAM, AND IT IS A GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS THAT MEET AT CENTRAL PARK PAVILION DURING THE SUMMER THREE DAYS A WEEK.
IN THE WINTER, WE HELP THEM COORDINATE THEIR ACTIVITIES WITHIN THE MERIDIAN HALL.
TO HAVE AN INDOOR FACILITY FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO WORK THEIR PROGRAMS, THEY'RE VERY PRO-INDOOR FACILITY.
SOMETHING ELSE TO CONSIDER FOR A NEED IN THE TOWNSHIP IS MEETING SPACE.
WE CURRENTLY STRUGGLE WITH HAVING MEETING SPACE FOR THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY.
OUR CENTRAL FIRE COMMUNITY ROOM IS WELL ATTENDED.
I DID SAY SOME PRELIMINARY NUMBERS, BUT IT'S UPWARDS OF 30 MEETINGS PER MONTH IN THAT FACILITY.
THERE IS MUCH MORE OF A NEED FOR THESE COMMUNITY ROOMS TOO, SO I WANT TO SHARE THAT I MEAN, THERE IS A LIST OF HOAS, ALL THE WAY TO YOUTH, I KNOW ROTARY AND CONAS.
THERE'S MSU, THERE'S AN ALL-GARDEN CLUB.
THERE'S ALL KINDS OF ORGANIZATIONS THAT ARE CURRENTLY NOT ABLE TO FIND MEETING SPACE WITHIN THE TOWNSHIP.
THAT IS WHERE WE'RE AT WITH THE ACTUAL PROGRAMMING THERE.
FOR THE YOUTH AREA THAT'S LOCATED ON THE CONCEPT PLAN.
ANOTHER THING THAT OUR PARKS AND REC DEPARTMENT DOES NOT CURRENTLY DO IS ANY ENRICHMENT TYPES OF PROGRAMS. WE DON'T HAVE ANY DROP IN KIDS CLASSES FOR ART OR FOR, LET'S SAY, ESPORTS OR SOME OF THE OTHER ACTIVITIES THAT WE WOULD NEED INDOOR SPACE AND SUPPLIES.
I'LL STOP THERE THAT IS THE TYPE OF PROGRAMMING THAT WE WOULD EXPECT, AND EITHER THE SENIOR ONLY CENTER WOULD STAY SIMILAR, BUT WOULD ALSO PROBABLY HAVE MUCH OPPORTUNITY TO EXPAND AND THEN ADDING IN THE NEED OF THE ATHLETICS, AS WELL AS THE COMMUNITY MEETING SPACE WITH A COMBINED COMMIT SENIOR CENTER.
>> GOOD EVENING, SUPERVISOR HENDRICKSON AND BOARD MEMBERS.
I'M JUST GOING TO GIVE A BRIEF OVERVIEW OF THE OPERATIONS COST MODEL THAT WE PUT TOGETHER FOR THE TASK FORCE AND IS SUMMARIZED IN YOUR PACKET THIS EVENING.
SO THE FIRST THING THAT WE DID WAS WE LOOKED AT ALL OF THE COSTS THAT WE WOULD INCUR DURING THE FIRST TWO YEARS IN WHICH THE FACILITY IS BEING CONSTRUCTED.
THOSE COSTS WOULD COMPRISE GAS AND ELECTRIC, WATER AND SANITARY SEWER AND INSURANCE, AND WE WOULD UTILIZE THE FUND BALANCE FOR ANY GROUNDS MAINTENANCE AND THE INITIAL NETWORK HARDWARE THAT WOULD BE PURCHASED FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE BUILDING, AND THEN WE LOOKED AT YEARS THREE THROUGH 20, ONCE WE PRESUME WE'RE OPERATING A SENIOR CENTER OR A SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER AND SO ON PAGE 4 OF YOUR MEMO.
THERE ARE FIVE BUCKETS OF COSTS.
WE'VE KIND OF BROKEN IT OUT INTO THOSE FIVE CATEGORIES.
UTILITIES AND INSURANCE, IT EQUIPMENT AND INFRASTRUCTURE.
IT EQUIPMENT AND INFRASTRUCTURE IS GOING TO BE EVERYTHING FROM THE INTERNET SERVICE FOR THE BUILDING, TO THE WORKSTATIONS AND TABLETS FOR THE PERSONNEL, TO THE BACKUP NETWORK CONNECTIONS,
[01:25:01]
HOSTING AND SAFELY STORING OUR SERVERS REMOTELY AT A SERVER FARM, AND THEN WE HAVE THE PERSONNEL, WHICH THE PERSONNEL ARE DETAILED ON PAGE 3 FOR BOTH OPTIONS.THEN WE HAD THE MOTOR POOL BUILDINGS AND GROUNDS MAINTENANCE.
REALLY, THINK OF THAT CATEGORY AS ALL THE COSTS TO KEEP THE FACILITY AS CLOSE TO ITS CONDITION ON DAY 1 AS WE POSSIBLY CAN, BUT ALSO CUSTODIAL SERVICES, SANITARY SUPPLIES, WHICH CAN BE SURPRISINGLY COSTLY AT A FACILITY OF THIS NATURE.
GROUNDS MAINTENANCE, SNOW REMOVAL, AND THEN EVERYTHING THAT GOES INTO THE BUILDING FROM HVAC PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE TO FILTER CHANGES TO ELECTRICAL ISSUES OR PLUMBING ISSUES.
THE MOTOR POOL CONTRIBUTION WOULD BE SUPPORTING THE ADDITIONS TO OUR FLEET FOR THE PERSONNEL THAT ARE DETAILED ON PAGE 3, PREDOMINANTLY A VAN FOR PROGRAMMING AND MOVING PROGRAMMING SUPPLIES, VEHICLES FOR THE UTILITY WORKERS AND AN ADDITIONAL MOWER FOR THE FLEET FOR MOWING THE GROUNDS.
THEN LASTLY, YOUR FIFTH BUCKET THERE IS OFFICE SUPPLIES, COMMUNITY AND EVENT PROMOTION AND PROGRAMMING SUPPLIES.
THE LION'S SHARE OF THAT IS GOING TO BE, YOUR GYMNASIUM COSTS.
ALL OF THE EQUIPMENT THAT NEEDS TO BE REPLACED FROM VOLLEYBALLS, TO BASKETBALLS TO VOLLEYBALL NETS, AND EVERYTHING THAT GOES INTO A GYM THAT RECEIVES A LOT OF WEAR AND TEAR THAT NEEDS REPLACEMENT.
GENERALLY SPEAKING, THAT IS THOSE ARE THE FIVE BROAD CATEGORIES OF COSTS IN YOUR PACKET ON PAGE 4, AND SO TOTAL OPERATING COST FOR THE SENIOR CENTER OPTION, WE ARE LOOKING AT AROUND 570,000 AND TOTAL COST FOR THE SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER, WE ARE LOOKING AT JUST OVER 1.4 MILLION FOR AN ANNUAL OPERATING BUDGET ONCE THE FACILITY HAS OPENED TO THE PUBLIC.
I'M MORE THAN HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT THE BOARD MAY HAVE WHEN WE GET TO THAT PORTION OF THE AGENDA ITEM.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I JUST WANT TO WRAP UP BY SAYING THAT IS A LOT OF INFORMATION, AND I'M SURE THERE'S A TON OF QUESTIONS, BUT I JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT AND EVERYBODY'S KIND OF HIT ON THIS, BUT I WANT TO POINT OUT A COUPLE OF THINGS BEFORE WE START INTO THE FURTHER DISCUSSION.
ONE, EVERYTHING WE'VE DONE IS VERY CONSERVATIVE ON THE FINANCIAL SIDE.
WE'RE TRYING TO PLAN FOR EVERY SCENARIO POSSIBLE AND AS A PLANNER, IT MAKES MY HEART PROUD THAT WE'RE TRYING TO PLAN FOR EVERYTHING.
THE IDEA HERE IS THAT WE HAVE TRIED TO STRUCTURE THIS IN SUCH A WAY, SO WE KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THIS WILL TAKE SO THAT WE CAN ATTEMPT AS BEST AS POSSIBLE TO MAKE THIS GENERAL FUND NEUTRAL, BECAUSE THE GOAL IS NOT TO HAVE THIS IN A SITUATION WHERE IT RELIES ON ANNUAL GENERAL FUND CONTRIBUTIONS, IF AT ALL POSSIBLE, BECAUSE IN THE LONG RUN, IN OTHER COMMUNITIES, YOU SEE THIS, THAT THIS IS A DIFFICULT THING TO KEEP OPEN IF THINGS GET REALLY BAD.
WE WANT TO, IF WE'RE GOING TO BUILD THE CROWN JEWEL OF THE COMMUNITY, LET'S MAKE SURE THE CROWN JEWEL OF THE COMMUNITY IS ABLE TO OPERATE IN PERPETUITY AND THAT'S WHAT ALL OF THE PROJECTIONS THEY ARE TRYING TO DO IS GET TO THAT IDEA, AND AGAIN, JUST TO STRESS, WE ARE STILL THERE'S STILL A LONG PROCESS WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH TO GET THIS TO CONSTRUCTION.
ONCE WE CUT LOOSE FULL ENGINEERING ON THE SITE.
WE'LL GO THROUGH OUR NORMAL PROBABLY HAS TO GO THROUGH A SPECIAL USE PERMIT, HAS TO GO THROUGH A WETLAND USE PERMIT PROCESS.
THERE'S STILL A LOT OF PUBLIC INPUT THAT NEEDS TO BE GATHERED AS TO HOW THIS ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY STARTS TO TAKE SHAPE AND SO I JUST WANTED TO REITERATE THAT, I KNOW THE SUPERVISORS POINTED OUT, WE'VE ALL POINTED OUT, BUT IT'S AN IMPORTANT THING TO POINT OUT THAT THERE'S AT LEAST OFF TOP OF MY HEAD, THREE MORE PUBLIC HEARINGS ON THIS, PROBABLY A FOURTH BEFORE WE EVEN GET TO THE POINT OF SAYING, LET'S BUILD IT.
LET'S DO CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS TO BUILD IT.
WITH THAT, EVERYONE IS AVAILABLE FOR ANY QUESTION YOU MIGHT HAVE.
THANK YOU. BEFORE WE DIVE INTO QUESTIONS, SOMETHING THAT I MADE SURE TO MENTION AT, I THINK ALMOST EVERY SENIOR CENTER TASK FORCE MEETING THAT WE HAD WAS THAT, YOU KNOW, WE WERE VERY FORTUNATE TO HAVE RECEIVED THE $5 MILLIONAP PROPRIATION IN THE STATE BUDGET A NUMBER A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, THANKS TO OUR STATE REPRESENTATIVES AND OUR STATE SENATOR.
[01:30:01]
HOWEVER, WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT NO MATTER REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE CHOOSE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH A SENIOR ONLY PLAN OR A SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER ONLY PLAN, THAT $5 MILLION WILL NOT BE ENOUGH TO COVER THE TOTAL EXPENSE AND SO IT IS IMPORTANT FOR US AND THE PUBLIC AND EVERYONE WHO'S, BEING AWARE OF THIS, THAT REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE CHOOSE TO GO WITH SENIOR ONLY OR SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER, THERE IS LIKELY GOING TO NEED TO BE A BALLOT QUESTION PLACED ON THE BALLOT TO ASK THE VOTERS FOR MONEY TO PUT INTO THIS PROJECT, BOTH FOR THE BUILD FOR THE INITIAL CONSTRUCTION AND FOR OPERATING COSTS ONGOING.OBVIOUSLY, THE SIZE OF THAT REQUEST, IT WILL DEPEND ON THE DECISIONS THAT THIS BOARD MAKES OVER THE NEXT MONTH, BUT IT IS IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE THAT THERE'S NO WAY AROUND HAVING SOME KIND OF REQUEST OF THE VOTERS COMING UP IN AUGUST, IF WE HOPE TO MOVE FORWARD ON THIS IN THE TIME FRAME THAT WE CAN USE THAT $5 MILLION FROM THE STATE.
I JUST WANT TO BE UPFRONT ABOUT THAT.
AS I'VE TRIED TO BE AT EVERY TASK FORCE MEETING THAT WE'VE HAD ABOUT THIS, THAT THERE WILL LIKELY NEED TO BE SOME AMOUNT OF GAAP FUNDING.
OF COURSE, WE DO INTEND TO PURSUE ANY PHILANTHROPIC FUNDING THAT WE CAN IN ORDER TO REDUCE THE COST TO VOTERS AND IT'S MY HOPE THAT WE CAN FIND WELL GENEROUS BENEFACTORS WHO WILL ASSIST US TO BRING THE OVERALL COST DOWN SO THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO LEVY ANY FULL AMOUNT OF WHAT WE DECIDE TO DO, BUT I WANTED TO AT LEAST MAKE SURE WE'VE MENTIONED THAT PRIOR TO GETTING INTO THE FULL DISCUSSION SO THAT WE CAN HAVE THAT IN OUR PACKETS AS WELL FOR INFORMATION.
QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE OF THE TEAM THAT'S HERE BEFORE US.
YES, I DON'T KNOW IF BRENDAN AND ADAM ARE GOING TO NECESSARILY BE ABLE TO BE AVAILABLE TO US AT EACH OF OUR NEXT TWO MEETINGS SO IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS FOR THEM, THIS WOULD BE A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO.
TO THAT POINT, OUR INTENTION WAS TO FOCUS ON ANY BUILDING LAYOUT PROGRAMMATIC LAYOUT QUESTIONS THIS EVENING WHILE WE HAVE THEM HERE SO THAT WE CAN THEN MOVE MORE TOWARDS CONVERSATION ON THE FINANCIAL SIDE WITH STAFF AT OUR UPCOMING MEETINGS.
OUR INTENTION IS ONLY TO HAVE THEM AVAILABLE THIS EVENING, OBVIOUSLY.
IF WE NEED THEM, I'M SURE WE CAN MAKE IT WORK, BUT HOPING TO HANDLE THE BUILDING SITE RELATED THINGS TONIGHT. THANK YOU.
>> MEMBERS, WHAT QUESTIONS DO WE HAVE? I'LL OPEN THE FLOOR.
>> TRUSTEES. I LISTEN AND I TRY TO LISTEN TO AS MANY OF THOSE SENIOR CENTER TASK FORCE MEETINGS AS I COULD OVER THE PAST SIX MONTHS, AND I FIRST AND FOREMOST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO'S INVOLVED IN THAT.
THAT IS PUBLIC SERVICE RIGHT THERE.
THE QUESTION I HAD SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO SOME OF THE CONCERNS OF THE SENIOR CENTER MEMBERS HERE.
COULD YOU ILLUMINATE A LITTLE BIT ABOUT AND I DON'T KNOW IF DAN IS BACK THERE, I BELIEVE HE SPOKE PREVIOUSLY.
YOU SAY FINE. YEAH. ABOUT ONE ENTRANCE VERSUS TWO ENTRANCE, SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO PUBLIC SAFETY.
>> WELL, I'LL START IF TEPE MAJOR ALSO WANTS TO JUMP IN.
FUNDAMENTALLY, THIS BUILDING IS PROBABLY GOING TO HAVE SEVEN ENTRANCES WHEN IT COMES RIGHT DOWN TO IT, BECAUSE THE BUILDING CODE HAS CERTAIN PROVISIONS THAT YOU CAN ONLY BE SO FAR AWAY FROM AN ENTRANCE OR EXIT? THE ONES THAT WE FOCUS OUR AMENITIES ON AND MAKE THEM THE PRIME ENTRANCES, I THINK IS WHAT'S BEEN SOME OF THE DISCUSSION.
THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WILL ALWAYS SAY, THEY WILL REITERATE THAT IT IS SAFER TO HAVE ONE POINT OF ENTRY FOR THE PUBLIC TO ANY GIVEN BUILDING.
YOU'RE ABLE TO SEE EVERYONE THAT COMES IN, YOU'RE ABLE TO CONTROL THAT ACCESS POINT.
WE HAVE SOMEONE THAT SOMEONE PUTS EYES ON EVERYONE THAT COMES INTO A BUILDING.
POLICE'S DEFAULT POSITION WILL BE THAT.
IF THE BOARD DIRECTS US TO DESIGN IT IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE ESSENTIALLY HAVE TWO ENTRANCES.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO, AND I THINK WE CAN MITIGATE SOME OF THE POLICE CONCERNS WITH KEY CARD ACCESS OR CAMERAS, OR CANDIDLY, THE MODELS WE HAVE RIGHT NOW BUILD IN TO ADMINISTRATIVE ASSISTANCE FOR THE FRONT DESKS, THERE IS A MODEL THAT YOU CAN ADD ADDITIONAL STAFF TO BE ABLE TO FUNCTIONALLY HAVE TWO FRONT DESKS.
I THINK WE CAN DO IT EITHER WAY, AND IF THAT IS THE STRAW ON THE CAMEL'S BACK, WE CAN TAKE THAT STRAW OFF VERY EASILY AND MAKE IT WORK WITH TWO ENTRANCES.
[01:35:02]
IT'S REALLY PUBLIC SAFETY AND OPERATIONS WOULD ALWAYS DRIVE US TOWARDS ONE IF WE CAN.>> I DID NOTICE THE KNOW ABOUT THE ADDITIONAL STAFF NEEDS WITH ANOTHER ENTRANCE TO, WHICH, OF COURSE, OUR COSTS AS MUCH AS ANYTHING ELSE.
SO I APPRECIATE EXPANDING ON THAT.
I LISTEN TO IT AS I WAS WALKING MY DOG AND, YOU KNOW, BEAUTY OF HOME TV, BUT THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. I WILL POINT OUT THAT THE SENIOR AND COMMUNITY CENTER DIAGRAM, WHICH, AGAIN, I DID TELL EVERYONE TO TAKE WITH A GRAIN OF SALT DOES ACTUALLY SHOW TWO ENTRANCES ON THERE.
IT'S ACTUALLY MORE THAN THAT, BUT AS MR. SCHMITT POINTS OUT, BUT THERE'S THE EMPTY ASTERISK THAT WOULD DENOTE SORT OF THE MAIN ENTRY.
AND THEN THERE'S AN ADDITIONAL FILLED IN ASTERISK NORTH OF THAT, WHICH ENTERS INTO A SECONDARY LOBBY NEXT TO THE YOUTH RECREATION AREA.
I DO JUST WANT TO POINT THAT OUT TOO THAT THAT DOES ACTUALLY SHOW ALREADY ON THE DIAGRAMS THAT ARE IN THE PACKET AND SO THAT IS CONTEMPLATED FROM A DESIGN STANDPOINT AT LEAST.
WHETHER WE'RE READY TO STAFF THAT OR NOT IS SOMETHING THAT WE'LL HAVE TO GET INTO OVER TIME, BUT THAT IS SOMETHING THAT'S ALREADY BEEN CONSIDERED.
>> NO. I APPRECIATE SUPERVISOR HENDRICKSON'S POINT.
>> GOOD. QUICK QUESTION FOR DR. BZINSKI.
IF YOU TURN TO THE ROOM RENTAL OR REVENUE PAGE.
>> IT'S A LITTLE BIT FURTHER UP.
>> THERE WE GO. HAVE YOU TALKED TO OTHER COMMUNITY CENTERS AND HAVE THEY GIVEN YOU SIMILAR NUMBERS FOR MEETING ROOMS? WE ARE FULL AT 500,000 A YEAR, 60%, 334 A YEAR.
IN PARTICULAR, IF YOU TALK TO PORTAGE OR EAST LANSING OR EVEN FARMINGTON HILLS, ALL OF WHOM HAVE A NEW COMMUNITY CENTER?
>> I HAVE DONE A CROSS REFERENCE CHECK WITH BOTH SENIOR ONLY CENTERS AND SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTERS.
YES, SORRY I'LL BE 50 THIS YEAR.
>> OSCEOLA COMMUNITY CENTER PORTAGE, COMMUNITY CENTER FARMINGTON HILLS, FOSTER, EAST LANSING PRIMETIME, WHICH IS THEIR SENIOR WITHIN HANNAH WILLIAMSTON, HOLT STOCKBRIDGE BATH AND PORTAGE COMMUNITY CENTER, AS WELL AS PORTAGE SENIOR CENTER.
I DID REACH OUT, DID SOME RESEARCH, TRIED TO COLLECT AS MUCH INFORMATION AS THEY HAD.
SOME OF THE VARIABLES THAT I LOOKED AT WAS, LIKE, SQUARE FOOTAGE, HOW MANY DAYS OF WEEK ARE YOU OPEN? HOW MANY HOURS PER DAY ON AVERAGE ARE YOU OPEN? WHAT WAS YOUR STAFFING LOOK LIKE? THEN WHAT'S THE ANNUAL MEMBERSHIP COST AND THEN LOOKING FOR ANY ANNUAL OPERATING COST.
I DID GATHER A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF INFORMATION.
AGAIN, THESE ARE ASSUMPTIONS ABSOLUTELY.
BUT THEY'RE SOMEWHAT GUIDED ASSUMPTIONS BASED ON THAT.
>> IF YOU WOULD CHECK BACK WITH THEM, AT LEAST FOR THE MENTIONED OSCEOLA PORTAGE, FARMINGTON, AND EAST LANSING, ABOUT THE MEETING ROOMS, BECAUSE THAT NUMBER SEEMS WILDLY HIGH TO ME RIGHT NOW AND SEE WHAT THEIR ACTUAL NUMBERS ARE.
YOU MENTIONED GROUPS USING THESE CENTERS.
YOU'RE RIGHT, THERE'S A WOOD CARVING GROUP THAT MEETS EVERY SATURDAY MORNING IF IT HAS A LIBRARY.
CHARGING THEM $75 AN HOUR, THEY WOULD PROBABLY MOVE ELSEWHERE.
SOME CAN AFFORD THAT RENTAL, MANY CAN'T, AND WE WOULDN'T WANT TO PUSH THEM OUT BECAUSE THEY CAN'T AFFORD IT.
I THINK THE NUMBER IS PROBABLY BASED ON A LOT OF WEDDING OR FORMAL EVENTS THAT PEOPLE COME IN AND HOLD AT THE CENTER, WHERE THEY'D LIKE A NICE NEW FACILITY.
THE PROBLEM WITH THAT IS WE DON'T HAVE A FOOD FACILITY, THE WAY A HOTEL MIGHT BE OFF FOR THAT, SO WE'RE NOT GOING TO TO COMPETE WITH THOSE PEOPLE.
I REALLY THINK WE'RE ABOUT $250,000 HIGH IN THAT MEETING ROOM RENTAL, EVEN AT 65%.
IF YOU GET SOME ACTUAL DATA FROM THEM AS TO WHAT THEY'RE COMING IN, BECAUSE WE'VE ALSO LEARNED THAT THE BRAND NEW FACILITY IS LOSING LIKE 600,000 A YEAR.
THAT COULD BE THAT THEY ESTIMATED A HIGHER METING ROOM RENTAL THAN THEY'RE GETTING.
EAST LANSING DOWN A MILLION A HALF HAVING TO PUT A MILLION AND A HALF INTO THEIR COMMUNITY CENTER.
I HEARD THAT FARMINGTON HILLS IS ACTUALLY LOSING 4 MILLION A YEAR ON THEIR COMMUNITY CENTER.
THEY BUILD A VERY LARGE FACILITY.
>> THERE IS THE TAJ MAHAL OF COMMUNITY CENTER.
[01:40:03]
I TOOK THAT WITH A VERY GREAT ASSAULT BUT THEY DO OFFER A LOT OF THE ADDITIONAL YOUTH PROGRAMMING THAT I WANTED TO INQUIRE ABOUT.TREASURER DESCHAINE, TO YOUR POINT, I CERTAINLY WILL GET SOME MORE HARDER NUMBERS.
I ALSO LOOKED AT OUR PAVILION RENTALS.
OUR PAVILIONS ARE RENTED ALL SUMMER LONG, BOOKED UP AND WE DO CHARGE A FEE FOR THOSE.
I AGREE AND I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
THE OTHER THING THAT WANT TO MAKE VERY CLEAR, THIS IS ALL ASSUMPTIONS.
WE WOULD NEVER EXPECT TO USE THE REVENUE AS PART OF OPERATING THE FACILITY.
LOOKING MORE AT WHAT DOES THAT REVENUE LOOK LIKE IN 2, 03, 4 YEARS? THEN DO WE LOOK AT IT AS A LONG TERM OPERATING REVENUE OR KNOWING WHERE IT'S GOING, WE COULD PUT IT INTO A FUND SO THAT WE HAVE SOME BUILDING FUND UNTIL WE HAVE SOME BETTER IDEA OF HOW THAT MIGHT LOOK LONG TERM.
>> THANK YOU FOR THAT. I APPRECIATE GETTING THE HARD DATA BACK FOR WHAT THEY'RE GETTING THE [OVERLAPPING]
MR. SCHMITT DID HIT ON THE NOTION THAT THE FINANCIAL MODELS THAT WE'LL BE SEEING THAT OUR NEXT MEETING, WERE ALL CONSTRUCTED AROUND THE NOTION THAT THAT THERE WILL BE ZERO REVENUE COMING IN.
WE OSTENSIBLY WOULD NOT LOSE MONEY ON THIS BY EXPECTING REVENUE AND NOT COMING IN.
THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN WHAT OUR REGIONAL PARTNERS AND OTHER AREAS HAVE NOT DONE.
>> I HAVE A QUESTIONS, [INAUDIBLE] WILSON.
>> IF WE WERE TO LOOK AT THE SENIOR CENTER ONLY, DO WE HAVE ANY PROJECTIONS, KNOWING THAT WE HAVE 16.5 THOUSAND SENIORS IN [INAUDIBLE] AND TOWNSHIP.
DO WE HAVE ANY PROJECTIONS ABOUT MAXIMUM USE? ARE WE RIGHT SIZING THIS BUILDING, DO WE THINK? I'M JUST CURIOUS AS TO HOW WE CAME UP WITH OUR TOTAL SPACE HERE.
>> I HAVE REVIEWED OUR USAGE METRICS OVER THE LAST YEAR, AND IT'S HARD TO QUANTIFY HERE.
I DO HAVE SOME NUMBERS. [NOISE] BUT WE DO HAVE A LOT OF USAGE, AND WE HAVE A LOT OF ACTIVITIES ARE VERY POPULAR.
HOWEVER, WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT FROM A DAY LONG PERSPECTIVE, NO EVERY COMPONENT OF THAT FACILITY WOULD BE USED ALL DAY LONG.
WE DO HAVE BILLIARDS AND THEN WE DO HAVE JAZZ EXERCISE.
THOSE ARE HAPPENING A COUPLE OF TIMES A WEEK.
NOT DAILY LIKE MAYBE A BASKETBALL CAMP OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
THE USE OF THE TYPES OF ROOMS ARE THERE.
ALL OF THOSE ROOMS BE USED ACCORDING TO HOW WE ARE PROGRAMMING NOW ALL DAY EVERY DAY? NOT LIKELY.
>> I'M JUST TRYING TO THINK WHETHER YOU PUT SOME CAPACITY AROUND THIS.
WHAT IF ONE THIRD OF OUR SENIORS, THAT'S PROBABLY A LITTLE HIGH, 25% OF OUR SENIORS DECIDED TO JOIN THE SENIOR AND USE IT, WOULD WE HAVE SUFFICIENT SPACE TO HAVE THAT MANY PEOPLE?
>> TWENTY FIVE PERCENT INCREASE, LET'S SAY, WE'RE AT 500, SO YES.
>> [INAUDIBLE] DO THE PROGRAMMING, BUT WE HAVE A GREAT PROGRAMMERS, BUT YES, A 25% INCREASE, I THINK WOULD ACTUALLY USE THE FACILITY A LOT MORE.
>> WE HAVE 16,000 SENIORS HERE, AND WE DO HAVE PEOPLE FROM OUTSIDE OF THE AREA.
SAY 25% OF THOSE FOLKS DECIDED TO JOIN THE SENIOR CENTER, I HAVE RESIZED THIS CORRECTLY? I'D HATE TO SEE IT BURST AT THE SEAMS, IF YOU WILL, OR WE'D HAVE TO CURTAIL MEMBERSHIP.
>> THAT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION.
WHAT I COULD SPEAK TO IS THAT THE MEMBERSHIP OVER TIME HAS STAYED PRETTY STATIC.
I MEAN, IT WENT DOWN DURING COVID AS EXPECTED.
BUT IT STAYED PRETTY STATIC AND THE MANAGER AND THE ADVISORY BOARD ARE ALWAYS LOOKING TO INCREASE MEMBERSHIP.
BUT GIVEN THAT, MAYBE WITH A NEW FACILITY, WE COULD HAVE THAT, BUT CURRENTLY, WE'RE NOT SEEING THAT TREND.
>> IT STAYED AT ONE POINT, ABOUT FOUR YEARS AGO, IT WAS 275 MEMBERS, AND NOW IT'S CLOSER TO 500.
[01:45:01]
COULD YOU TELL ME WHAT YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT AND HAVING THE FACILITY OPEN EIGHT HOURS A DAY? IF WE WERE SENIOR CENTER ONLY.>> THE FACILITY'S CURRENTLY OPEN SEVEN HOURS A DAY.
EXTENDING THAT PART OF THE BARRIER THERE IS THE STAFFING.
WE HAVE ONE FULL TIME AND ONE HALF TIME.
TO HAVE THAT STAFFED THAT'S PART OF IT, AND IT'S CURRENTLY IN A SCHOOL.
WORKING AROUND THE TIMING OF SCHOOL AS WELL.
>> YOU'D HAVE NO UTILIZATION ON THE WEEKENDS FOR ANY OTHER PURPOSE BECAUSE THEY DO READ IN THE NOTES THAT MEETING ROOMS WOULD NOT BE AVAILABLE TO ANYONE ELSE.
>> THAT IS, IF WE WERE TO USE THIS FACILITY AS WE DO WITH OUR CURRENT FACILITY.
CURRENTLY, WE'RE NOT OPEN ON THE WEEKENDS, AND OUTSIDE OF MEMBERS THAT ARE NOT ALLOWED TO USE THAT FACILITY, OR NOT ABLE TO USE THAT FACILITY.
THAT'S WHATEVER THE BOARD DECIDES WE CAN CERTAINLY ACCOMMODATE, BUT I WAS JUST USING WHAT WE CURRENTLY ARE PROGRAMMING.
>> I WOULD JUST ADD PART OF THE REASON THAT THAT'S WHAT WE WENT WITH, WAS ONE OF THE DECISIONS THE TASK FORCE DIRECTED US ON WAS EARLY ON, WE ASKED THEM, WE NEEDED NO ROUGH HOURS OF OPERATION SO THAT WE COULD START BUILDING THIS MODEL.
THE MODEL THAT WE BUILT WAS BASED ON SENIOR CENTER WAS FIVE DAYS A WEEK, EIGHT HOURS A DAY.
SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER WAS SIX DAYS A WEEK, 14 HOURS, ACTUALLY 12 HOURS A DAY.
THAT'S OBVIOUSLY FUNGIBLE AS WELL, BUT WE JUST HAD TO ESTABLISH A BASELINE FOR HOW WE BUILT EVERYTHING FROM THAT POINT UP.
>> IF WE WERE TO DO THE COMBINED CENTER, YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE EXTENDED HOURS.
YOU HAVE POTENTIAL REVENUE SOURCE.
WE'RE MEETING THE NEEDS OF EVERY AGE BAND IN THIS COMMUNITY.
THAT'S WHY THAT CONCEPT, I THINK, IS VERY ATTRACTIVE BECAUSE WE'RE DELIVERING BENEFIT TO EVERY AGE BAND FROM BABIES TO SENIORS.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT OUR COMMUNITY REALLY WOULD LIKE TO SEE. THANK YOU.
>> OTHER BOARD MEMBERS WITH QUESTIONS. [INAUDIBLE]
>> I DID HAVE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT PARKING LOT SIZE.
I'M NOT SURE WHO MIGHT BE THE BEST PERSON TO ANSWER THAT.
FROM LOOKING HERE, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S 61 SENIOR PARKING AND THEN IN THE EXPANDED WITH 149 TOTAL PARKING SPOTS.
I'M READING THAT CORRECT? CAN YOU EXPLAIN THE METHODOLOGY OF THAT? I'M JUST CURIOUS WITH THE MAYBE SHORT USAGE OF SOME PARTS OF THE FACILITY SOMETHING MAYBE PARENTS DROPPING OFF KIDS FOR A BASKETBALL CAMP, LET'S SAY, OR EVEN IF THEY STUCK AROUND, I'M IMAGINING BASKETBALL DOESN'T RUN FOR SIX HOURS STRAIGHT OR CHILD LABOR WAS OR SOMETHING, BUT I GUESS I'M JUST CURIOUS PARKING LOT SIZE.
>> THE PARKING NUMBERS CAME OUT OF PROGRAMMING AND DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT WOULD BE PREFERRED FOR THE SENIOR CENTER, WHAT WOULD BE PREFERRED FOR THE COMMUNITY CENTER.
THEN, FRANKLY, IT'S ALSO WHAT IS AVAILABLE FOR SPACE ON THE SITE.
THERE COULD BE ADDITIONAL PARKING MOVING AWAY FROM THE BUILDING.
BUT PART OF WHAT WE WERE SHOWING IS HERE'S A MAXIMUM PARKING WITH A GIVEN BUILDING LAYOUT BASED ON PROPERTY SETBACKS.
THEN, AS THIS PLAN IS INDICATING, WE COULD HAVE ADDITIONAL PARKING GOING TOWARDS THE MALL OR TOWARDS THE MERIDIAN MALL.
BUT WE COULD CERTAINLY HAVE LESS PARKING IF IT WAS DECIDED.
>> I'M CURIOUS ABOUT I THINK THE PATIENT NUMBERS WILL STARTING TO BOARD TOGETHER, BUT IT LOOKED LIKE IT WAS ABOUT 1.9 MILLION FOR SITE PREP AND CLEARING, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, ABOUT HOW MUCH OF THAT IS PARKING, AND I'M THINKING, LIKE, IF YOU WERE TO TAKE OUT THAT TOP SECTION OF 24 PARKING SPOTS NEXT TO THE YOUTH PROGRAM AREA, IT IS JUST 24 SPOTS.
ABOUT HOW MUCH DOES THAT COST RIGHT THERE, THAT CHUNK?
>> NO, AS WELL, SO THAT 1.9 IS ACTUALLY MORE FOR THE SITE PREP AND FOR SITE UTILITIES, THE STORMWATER MITIGATION, ALL THE WORK THAT HAS TO HAPPEN JUST TO GET THE SITE READY SO THAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY PUT A BUILDING ON THERE.
IN THE OTHER COSTS, LIKE AT THE PORTAGE AND THE GREENVILLE, YMCA, THOSE COSTS ARE COMPLETE PROJECT COSTS, WHICH INCLUDE PARKING LOTS IN THOSE COSTS.
THAT'S ALREADY BUILT INTO THAT PIECE OF IT RIGHT THERE.
THE SITE HERE, THAT 1.9 IS REALLY JUST TO GET THIS TO
[01:50:02]
A POINT TO WHERE YOU CAN PUT SOMETHING THERE, JUST AS AN FYI.THEN TO A LITTLE BIT MORE POINTEDLY TO YOUR QUESTION, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF SAVINGS THERE BECAUSE REALLY, YOU'VE GOT TO DEVELOP THE MAJORITY IF YOU DO THE SENIOR ONLY CENTER, THAT IS IN ORDER FOR THERE TO BE EXPANSION, FURTHER TO THE NORTH THERE AND TO HAVE THAT TO BE ABLE TO GROW, WHERE YOU'RE PUTTING THAT, YOU'VE GOT TO DO A LOT OF THE DEVELOPMENT ALREADY AND HAVE IT AS A SPACE THAT'S READY FOR THAT TO HAPPEN DOWN THE ROAD.
THE PARKING LOTS AND ALL THAT KIND OF THING.
YOU'RE ALREADY REALLY GETTING IT TO A POINT TO WHERE WHAT YOU NOW NEED TO DO IS JUST TAKE OFF THE TOP SOIL AND THEN PUT A LAYER IN THE PARKING LOT ITSELF AND THEN STRIPE IT AND ALL THAT.
THERE ISN'T A HUGE SAVINGS THERE.
IF I COULD CERTAINLY COME UP WITH A NUMBER, KNOW THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE FLUCTUATING DAILY AND GOING UP AND DOWN.
I CAN ONLY HOLD THAT FOR TWO DAYS.
>> I UNDERSTAND AND I APPRECIATE THAT.
THIS IS WHY YOU HAVE YOUR JOB, AND I ASKED YOU THAT QUESTION.
I DIDN'T THINK ABOUT THE EFFECT OF BUILDING JUST THE SENIOR CENTER.
THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD WOULD PROBABLY BE EITHER FOR TIM OR COURTNEY, IF YOU DON'T MIND. UNLESS YOU HAD SOMETHING
>> WELL, I WAS GOING TO, [INAUDIBLE] JUST MENTIONED SOMETHING.
I MEAN, THIS WOULD BE A GOOD TIME SINCE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COST REDUCTIONS A LITTLE BIT.
BRENDAN COULD JUST BRIEFLY TALK ABOUT THE REASON AND THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE TWO TYPES OF CONSTRUCTION THAT YOU SEE IN THE PACKET.
ONE OF THEM IS MORE PREFAB, NOT IN A PRE MANUFACTURED WAY, BUT THERE ARE DIFFERENT TYPES OF CONSTRUCTION.
THAT'S WHY YOU SEE A DIFFERENCE IN THE COST, BRENDAN CAN JUST TALK ABOUT THAT BRIEFLY SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND WHY THERE IS SUCH A RANGE, BECAUSE IT'S $100 PER SQUARE FOOT RANGE BETWEEN THE TWO.
>> ALL GOOD. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE GREENVILLE YMCA, WHEN WE LOOK AT THAT ONE, AS YOU LOOK AT THE IMAGES ON THERE, THERE'S A LARGE SECTION OF THAT BUILDING THAT'S A PRE ENGINEERED BUILDING.
THAT IT ACTUALLY WAS MARRIED UP TO AN EXISTING PORTION OF THE YMCA IN THERE.
WHAT YOU HAVE PRE ENGINEERED BUILDINGS ARE MEANT TO MOVE LET'S PUT IT THIS WAY.
THEY'RE DESIGNED TO THE BARE MINIMUM OF THE CODE.
THEY'RE INTENDED TO MOVE A LOT MORE.
THE MATERIALS THAT YOU PUT ON THE BUILDING, YOU CAN'T HAVE NEARLY AS RIGID OF MATERIALS BECAUSE, FOR INSTANCE, A LOT OF MASONRY OR WHATEVER ELSE, REALLY TALL EXPANSES OF THAT, BECAUSE THE BUILDING IS GOING TO WANT TO TRY TO MOVE AND RACK.
OUR MATERIAL SELECTIONS THEN LOWER DOWN IN AS FAR AS WHAT WE CAN PUT ON THERE.
BUT IT'S ALSO YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENTIAL, AND WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE IMAGES OF THAT PROJECT, VERSUS THE PORTAGE SENIOR CENTER, WHICH HAS A MUCH DIFFERENT LOOK THAN THE OTHER.
THAT'S WHY THERE'S A PRICE DIFFERENTIAL THERE AS WELL THAT WE HAD TALKED ABOUT EARLIER ON.
THIS IS A CONVENTIONAL STEEL BUILDING, AND YOU CAN SEE THE WOOD LAMINATED TRUSSES THAT ARE IN THERE.
AGAIN, THERE ARE CHOICES THAT CAN BE MADE THAT WILL DRIVE THE COST UP.
THERE ARE ALSO CHOICES THAT YOU CAN MAKE THAT, WELL, THAT YOU CAN HAVE A LOOK LIKE THIS, BUT IT'S NOT EXACTLY THAT, AND IT'LL KEEP IT MORE IN THE MIDDLE RANGE ON THESE THINGS.
THERE'S ALSO MATERIALITY CHOICES.
WE LIKE TO COME AT PROJECTS, ESPECIALLY SOMETHING THAT'S A COMMUNITY CENTER, WHETHER IT'S A COMMUNITY CENTER OR A SENIOR CENTER, DOESN'T MATTER.
YOU WANT MATERIALS THAT ARE DURABLE, THEY'RE GOING TO LAST A LONG TIME, THEY'RE GOING TO LOOK GOOD FOR A LONG TIME.
THEY'RE NOT FADS KIND OF A THING, AND THEY'RE GOING TO HOLD THEIR VALUE AND REALLY LAST FOR A GOOD PERIOD OF TIME WITH AS LOW MAINTENANCE AS POSSIBLE.
THERE ARE SOME REALLY HIGH END EXPENSIVE MATERIALS THAT YOU CAN GO WITH THAT ARE GOING TO LAST FOREVER, A THING, BUT YOU'RE GOING TO PAY A LOT OF MONEY FOR THOSE.
THEN THERE'S ALSO SOME THAT ARE RIGHT IN THAT MIDDLE RANGE THAT I THINK THIS PROJECT WOULD BE RIGHT FOR. I'M GETTING INTO THE WEEDS.
ONE LAST THING I WANT TO SAY ON THIS,THOUGH, IS THAT YOU CAN PUT YOUR MONEY INTO CERTAIN MATERIALS AND CERTAIN ASPECTS OF THE BUILDING WHERE YOU REALLY WANT TO FOCUS IT, AND THEN OTHER AREAS THAT YOU CAN SAY, OKAY, WE CAN BRING THESE MATERIALITIES DOWN, THE COST DOWN HERE, AND WE REALLY WANT TO ACCENTUATE THESE OTHER AREAS.
THERE'S A LOT OF DECISIONS THAT WE CAN MAKE CONCEPTUALLY MOVING FORWARD.
>> COULD YOU STILL GOING WITH THAT?
>> NO. I APPRECIATE THE VERY THOROUGH EXPLANATION.
>> HOW WOULD YOU PULL UP THE SENIOR ONLY PLAN FOR ME ENLARGE IT A LITTLE BIT?
[01:55:05]
I THINK WE'VE LOOKED AND I WAS PART OF THE FIRST COMMUNITY CENTER TASK FORCE AND WORK WITH FINE FOLKS CONSULTANTS.APPRECIATE THE WORK YOU'VE DONE FOR US.
I THINK WE MIGHT HAVE BEEN TOO NARROW IN THAT WAY IF WE LOOK AT THIS.
THE COMMUNITY CENTER SENIOR CENTER WOULD COST ABOUT 3.5 TIMES WHAT A SENIOR ONLY CENTER IS.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE SENIOR CENTER IS IS IT RIGHT NOW, IT'S A BUILDING THAT'S GOING TO BE USED 8:00-4:00 EVERY DAY.
MOST OF THE COMMUNITY CENTER NEEDS ARE GOING TO BE AFTER 5:00 IN THE EVENINGS ON THE WEEKENDS WHEN THE SENIOR CENTER IS CLOSED.
WE LOOK AT THIS OUTDOOR PATIO AREA WITH VIEWED TO THE WETLANDS, A LOT OF SPACE THERE.
OBVIOUSLY, TO ENCLOSE, THAT'S GOING TO BE A FEW MILLION DOLLAR.
BUT IF WE TURN THAT INTO A MULTIPURPOSE SPACE THAT WE USED FOR COMMUNITY GATHERING, WE'VE GOTTEN TO ME, THE ESSENCE OF A COMMUNITY CENTER, A SPACE FOR THE COMMUNITY TO MEET.
THE REST OF THE SENIOR CENTER, THAT'S THE SENIOR CENTER.
THIS BECOMES THE COMMUNITY SPACE THAT WE NEED.
THE GYM, I THINK IS SURE WE MIGHT ATTRACT SOME MORE LEAGUES, BUT THAT NEED IS BEING MET RIGHT NOW BY THE SCHOOLS.
THANKS TO YOUR GOOD COORDINATION.
IT'S JUST A LUXURY, IF YOU WILL, TO HAVE OUR OWN GYMS. WE DO HAVE A NEED FOR COMMUNITY SPACE, AND WE DO HAVE A NEED FOR A DEDICATED SENIOR SPACE.
BY CONVERTING THIS OUTDOOR PATIO SPACE INTO MEETING SPACE, WE COULD HAVE THAT AT WHAT WOULD BE A THIRD OF THE COST OR ABOUT THAT OF THE FOUR BLOWN COMMUNITY CENTER SENIOR CENTER.
WE LOSE THE GYM, BUT I THINK THE GYM HAS FALLEN INTO THE CATEGORY OF A SWIMMING POOL.
YOU ADD A GYM, YOU ADD A LOT MORE COSTS, AND IT'S A LUXURY THAT I DON'T THINK WE CAN AFFORD, RIGHT NOW.
I'LL TALK MORE ABOUT THE FINANCES NEXT MEETING WHEN WE GET INTO THAT.
WE DON'T HAVE ANY NUMBERS NOW, BUT WE KNOW THAT THIS SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER IS GOING TO BE 3.5-4 TIMES THE COST.
IF WE COULD ADD A COMMUNITY ELEMENT TO THIS FACILITY THAT WOULD COULD BE USED BY THE COMMUNITY AND IT'S NOT BEING USED BY THE SENIORS FOR A FEW MILLION DOLLARS RATHER THAN THREE AND A HALF TIMES MORE DOLLARS, I THINK IT'S A WORTHY OPTION SHOULD CONSIDER.
>> APOLOGIES FOR THE INTERRUPTION.
BECAUSE WE'VE GONE THAT IDEA HAS GONE BACK AND FORTH A COUPLE OF TIMES OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST TWO YEARS, EVEN AS TO WHERE THAT SPACE THAT YOU TALK ABOUT GOES.
THE SENIOR ONLY FACILITY AT ROUGHLY 10 MILLION SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER, JUST UNDER 30.
SO JUST UNDER THREE TIMES THE COST AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT BECAME THE LINCHPIN AS WE GOT THROUGH THIS PROCESS WAS WE HEARD FROM THE SENIORS MULTIPLE TIMES THAT THEY WERE, JUST REPLACE WHAT WE GOT, GET DOWN CLOSE TO 10,000.
WHAT ENDED UP BEING THAT LINCHPIN WAS TAKING THAT SPACE OUT OF THE SENIOR CENTER, GOT IT TO WHERE EVERYONE WANTED TO BE ON THE SENIOR CENTER, AND THEN PUTTING THAT IN THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER, GOT THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER TO WHERE EVERYBODY WANTED TO BE ON THAT.
THAT'S SOME OF THE THINKING BEHIND WHY THAT IS WHAT YOU SEE THERE, BECAUSE THE FEEDBACK WE WERE GETTING WAS THAT THAT IS WE DIDN'T WANT THAT NURSE SENIOR CENTER, WE WANTED A 10,000 SQUARE FOOT REPLACEMENT FOR WHAT WE HAVE NOW.
THAT'S CERTAINLY ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT, FROM THE BOARD'S PERSPECTIVE, WE'VE EVALUATED IN MULTIPLE DIFFERENT WAYS.
IF THAT'S THE DIRECTION WE GO, MY FRIENDS BEHIND ME, WILL CERTAINLY BE ABLE TO PIVOT TOWARDS THAT BECAUSE I THINK WE PROBABLY HAVE A CONCEPT SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINES THAT HAS IT.
>> I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE COST FOR THAT.
IF YOU ASK THE COMMUNITY, DO YOU WANT THE TAX SHEET $10 MILLION OR ESSENTIALLY THROUGH AN OPERATION COST, THE TAX INCREASE MIGHT BE 25 MILLION FOR THE SENIOR CENTER, 80-YEAR OR 90 MILLION OVER 20 YEARS FOR THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER, GIVE THEM THE TWO OPTIONS, AND TELL THEM YOU'LL STILL GET YOUR COMMUNITY SPACE, BUT YOU'RE GOING TO BE TAXED ABOUT ONE-THIRD LESS COURT THAN YOU ARE WITH THE FULL-BLOWN CENTER.
OUR RESIDENTS WHO ARE AT THIS POINT ARE FEELING VERY OVERTAXED, ARE GOING TO TAKE THE LESS EXPENSIVE OPTION.
THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER OUT CONCEPT HERE IS A BEAUTIFUL ONE IN DIFFERENT ECONOMIC TIMES.
I MIGHT BE FOR IT, RIGHT NOW, ANYTHING THAT'S GOING TO BE A SIGNIFICANT TAX INCREASE SCARES ME, AND I THINK WE NEED TO BE PRUDENT ABOUT THIS.
ANYWAY, WE CAN ACHIEVE BOTH GOALS WITH THE SAME FLOOR PLAN, WE SHOULD BE CONSIDERING IT.
>> BALLPARK TO ADD THAT SPACE BACK INTO THIS $1.2 MILLION, OFF TOP OF MY HEAD, JUST TO GIVE YOU A NUMBER.
>> THAT LOOKS LIKE IT WOULD BE ABOUT HOW MANY SQUARE FEET.
>> THAT'S ASSUMING IT 2,000 SQUARE FOOT SPACE. I'M JUST TRYING TO DO A ROUGH MAP.
[02:00:03]
>> WHETHER OR NOT IT'S THAT BOX OR NOT, AGAIN, NOT WEDDED TO ANY OF THESE BOXES, JUST TRYING TO FIND THAT COMMUNITY SPACE, ROUGHLY 2,000.
>> WE ACTUALLY GO DOWN THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER DIAGRAM FOR A MOMENT.
BECAUSE, ESSENTIALLY, WHAT YOU'RE SUGGESTING IS DRAW A STRAIGHT LINE WHERE THE BUILDING TURNS AND CUT IT THAT INCLUDES THE MULTIPURPOSE ROOM THAT'S 120 PEOPLE.
THE WARMING KITCHEN AND WE MAY NOT HAVE IT BEING LABELED THAT.
BUT CUT IT INTO AN EXACT RECTANGLE.
THAT, ACTUALLY, ADDS UP TO ABOUT 5,000 SQUARE FEET ALL OF THAT IN.
>> THEN YOU'RE THREE MILLION ROUGHLY.
>> FIVE THOUSAND SQUARE FEET OF COMMUNITY SPACES MEET A CERTAIN NEED.
WE WOULDN'T NEED TO RELY ON A LOT OF INCOME FROM IT.
AGAIN, THE TIMES THAT WE USE ARE THE EXACT OPPOSITE ARE VERY MUCH IN SYNC WITH THE TIMES THAN THE SENIORS WANT TO USE IT, WHICH IS THE DAY 8:00-4:00.
THE COMMUNITY WOULD THEN USE IT IN THE EVENINGS ON THE WEEKENDS.
I THINK IT'S THE PRUDENT THING TO DO TO LOOK AT IT MUCH LOWER TO INCLUDE THE COMMUNITY ELEMENTS.
I AGREE THAT WE NEED TO THINK OF THE COMMUNITY.
BUT TO ME, THERE'S NO GOOD REASON THAT I'M SEEING RIGHT NOW WHY WE COULDN'T TAKE THIS FOOTPRINT FOR THE SENIOR CENTER AND TURN INTO MORE THAN THAT.
>> I'M HEARING A LOT THAT THERE'S A NEED FOR COMMUNITY SPACE.
LOOKING AT THIS PATIO, IF WE WERE TO MAKE IT JUST A SENIOR CENTER ONLY, I'M TRYING TO WRAP MY HEAD AROUND WHAT COMMUNITY SPACE WOULD BE USED FOR THE PATIO.
WHAT CAN BE PUT THERE? WOULD THERE BE ROOMS FOR PEOPLE TO MEET? IS THAT ENOUGH FOR OUR COMMUNITY? WE NEED PLACES TO STORE FACILITIES.
FOR MY PERSPECTIVE, I THINK THAT THE COMMUNITY CENTER HAS A LOT MORE SPACE FOR PEOPLE TO USE THE CENTER, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT OUR RESIDENTS HAVE ADVOCATED FOR.
WHY NOT LOOK AT THAT POSSIBILITY AND LEAVE IT UP TO THE VOTERS TO DECIDE IF THEY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A COMMUNITY CENTER.
>> I'LL ADD THAT TO DIRECTOR SCHMITT'S POINT THE ROOM THAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING OVER WHERE THE PATIO IS, THIS IS THE 120 PERSON MEETING ROOM.
THIS IS THE ONE THAT HAS A PLATFORM, A STAGE LIKE AREA, A WARMING KITCHEN ON THE BACK.
WE GOT SIGNIFICANT PUSHBACK FROM THE SENIORS WHEN IT RELATED TO THE OVERALL SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE SENIOR CENTER OPTION.
I THINK SOMETHING IN THE BALLPARK OF 20,000 SQUARE FEET.
WE GOT A NUMBER OF EMAILS THAT SAID, WELL, THAT'S A LOT MORE THAN WE NEED.
WE NEED TO TRIM THE FAT ON THIS.
THAT WAS THE LOW HANGING FRUIT IN TERMS OF WHAT IT IS THAT WE CAN PULL OUT TO GET US DOWN TO A MORE REASONABLE NUMBER IN TERMS OF PROGRAMMABLE SQUARE FOOTAGE.
I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THE DESIRE TO INCLUDE THIS.
I'M NOT SURE I NECESSARILY AGREE THAT HAVING ESSENTIALLY ONE SPACE MAKES A COMMUNITY CENTER.
I DO THINK IT DOES HELP TO ALLEVIATE SOME OF THE MEETING ROOM CONCERNS THAT WE'RE ALL AWARE OF.
THIS ROOM IS USED MORE THAN PROBABLY ANY OTHER IN THE COMMUNITY.
BUT I DO THINK THERE IS VALUE TO HAVING SOME OF THE OTHER BENEFITS THAT THE OTHER SPACES DO PROVIDE.
ONE OF THE GROUPS THAT WE HEARD, THROUGHOUT THE DESIGN CHARRETTE, WAS THE 55 PLUS.
THAT'S THE WORD I WAS LOOKING FOR.
THEY WERE DESPERATELY ASKING FOR MORE INDOOR SPACE FOR RECREATION FOR THEIR WORKOUT ACTIVITIES.
THE GYM IS SOMETHING THAT THEY WOULD LOVE TO USE.
THEY WOULD LOVE TO BE ABLE TO USE THE INDOOR PICKLE BALL AS AN OPTION.
THE SPORTIES FOR SHORTIES, THAT PROGRAM THAT'S WILDLY POPULAR UNDER OUR PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT.
YES, WE COULD PROGRAM IT THROUGHOUT THE WINTER.
BUT ALSO, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THERE'S NOT A WHOLE LOT OF BACKUP IF IT RAINS.
I'M PRETTY SURE I'VE HAD MY KID RAINED OUT OF SPORTS FOR SHORTIES PREVIOUSLY.
THIS MODEL, WHICH HAS A YOUTH RECREATION AREA ALSO ALLOWS FOR THE POSSIBILITY THAT A RAIN DAY,
[02:05:04]
SPORTIES FOR SHORTIES DURING THE SUMMER COULD BE MOVED INTO THAT YOUTH RECREATION AREA.I UNDERSTAND THAT, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A COST.
EVERYTHING COMES AT A COST AND A BUILDING OF THE SIZE THAT WE'RE DESCRIBING HERE WOULD COME AT A HEFTY PRICE TO THE TAXPAYERS, AND ONE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO CONSIDER IF WE PUT IT FOR THEM AT THE BALLOT BOX.
BUT I WILL ALSO POINT OUT THAT AS OUR DESIGNERS HAVE INCLUDED IN THE COMPARISONS TO OTHER CENTERS THROUGHOUT THE STATE THOSE PRICES ESCALATE EACH AND EVERY YEAR.
THIS PROJECT WOULD ONLY EVER GET MORE EXPENSIVE IF WE CHOSE TO DO IT AT A LATER TIME.
THERE'S A COST BENEFIT TO SAYING, LET'S DO A SENIOR CENTER WITH A ROOM NOW, AND MAYBE WE'LL CONSIDER THIS AT ANOTHER TIME OR A ANOTHER ECONOMY OR WHATEVER.
BUT IT'S ONLY GOING TO BE MORE EXPENSIVE.
PRICES ARE ONLY GOING TO CONTINUE TO GO UP IF WE DO THIS LATER AS OPPOSED TO NOW. I'M SORRY.
>> I'LL COME BACK TO YOU JUST A SECOND.
I DID HEAR A FAIR AMOUNT OF FOLKS ASKING ABOUT WHETHER THIS WAS A NEED OR A WANT.
I THINK THAT WE ABSOLUTELY KNOW THAT IT'S A WANT.
IT'S APPEARED IN THE TOP THREE ITEMS THAT OUR COMMUNITY HAS RESPONDED TO IN OUR SURVEYS, OF THE TWO LAST TRIANNUAL SURVEYS, AS A THING THAT WOULD BE OF VALUE TO THEM HERE IN THE TOWNSHIP.
DR. BZINSKI HAS GONE THROUGH THE VARIOUS NEEDS THAT WE HAVE SEEN FOR RECREATION SPACE THAT DON'T CURRENTLY EXIST.
THAT'S JUST THE THINGS THAT WE KNOW ABOUT THAT WE CAN'T ACCOMMODATE.
WE'RE ALREADY OVER RELYING ON OUR PARTNERS IN THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS FOR ALL INTERIOR RECREATION SPACE AND A LOT OF EXTERIOR RECREATION SPACE AS WELL.
WE HAD BOTH SUPERINTENDENT HOOD AND SUPERINTENDENT MALLY HERE ON THE TASK FORCE.
THEY WERE REITERATING THAT THOSE SPACES ARE ALSO OVERTAXED IN TERMS OF THE USAGE THAT THEY'RE HAVE.
NOT ONLY WOULD HAVING A COMMUNITY RECREATION SPACE AVAILABLE TO US GIVE US MORE CAPACITY.
IT ALSO GIVES THE SCHOOLS MORE CAPACITY TO OFFER ADDITIONAL PROGRAMMING IN THEIR RECREATION SPACE AS WELL.
IT HAS ADDITIONAL TRICKLE DOWN BENEFITS.
THEN ALSO TWO MORE ROOMS. THIS BLOCK OF ACTIVITY SLASH MEETING ROOMS. AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THIS IS SPACE THAT CAN BE MODULAR SPACE THAT CAN BE USED IN DIFFERENT SIZES AND FORMATS BASED ON THE NEED.
I THINK THAT IT'S ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY TO ADD MORE THAN WE HAVE TODAY.
I THINK THAT TO TRUSTEE WILSON'S POINT, THIS IS SOMETHING FOR EVERYONE MODEL.
IN THE SAME WAY THAT I HEAR MY COLLEAGUES CONCERN ABOUT A POSSIBLE MILLAGE FOR A COMMUNITY CENTER; THE COMMUNITY CENTER IS SOMETHING THAT EVERYONE CAN BE A PART OF.
THE SENIORS HAVE BEEN VERY PROTECTIVE OF THEIR SPACE AND RIGHTFULLY SO AT THE SENIOR CENTER, AND THEY'VE BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT OTHER FOLKS COMING INTO THEIR SPACE.
I UNDERSTAND THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT IN FRONT OF VOTERS.
IF IT IS A SENIOR CENTER ONLY, AND IT IS EXPRESSLY SO THAT YOU CAN THAT NO ONE ELSE IS GOING TO GET TO USE THIS UNLESS YOU ARE A SENIOR.
I WORRY THAT THE VOTERS ARE GOING TO BE EQUALLY AS CONCERNED THE YOUNGER VOTERS, ESPECIALLY, THAT THEY'RE VOTING ON SOMETHING THAT THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO USE FOR MAYBE 2, 03, 4 DECADES.
I WOULD BE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT AS WELL.
WE'RE NOT MAKING FINAL DECISIONS HERE TODAY, OBVIOUSLY.
BUT THAT'S JUST WHERE I'M STARTING FROM HAVING BEEN STEEPED IN THIS FOR A LONG TIME OVER THE LAST SEVEN MONTHS. I SAW TRUSTEE.
>> THAT'S FROM THE TREASURE DESCHAINE.
>> I'M JUST COMING BACK TO TREASURE DESCHAINE'S DISCUSSION OF A NEED OR A WANT.
>> FOR A SMALL GROUP OR RELATIVELY SMALL GROUP OF CITIZENS THAT WOULD BE HAVE ACCESS TO A SENIOR CENTER.
THERE COULD BE A LARGE GROUP OF CITIZENS WHO SAY, "WELL, THAT'S A WANT.
[02:10:04]
I DON'T NEED IT. I CAN'T USE IT. I'M NOT GOING TO SUPPORT IT." THAT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING FOR ANYBODY.I THINK, AND I'M NOT SOLD ON ONE OR THE OTHER AT THIS POINT BECAUSE I HAVEN'T SEEN THE NUMBERS THAT WE WOULD NEED TO GENERATE IN EITHER CIRCUMSTANCE.
BUT WE COULD END UP LOSING THE FIVE MILLION DOLLARS BECAUSE THEY VOTED DOWN THE SENIOR CENTER ALONE.
THERE ARE A LOT MORE VOTERS THAT ARE ELIGIBLE TO USE THE SPACE.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE WE'RE GOING.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBERS ARE AS FAR AS WHAT KIND OF MILLAGE SUPPORT WE WOULD NEED.
BUT IN EITHER CASE, WE'RE GOING TO NEED SOME TAX SUPPORT FOR OPERATIONS AND CONSTRUCTION.
UNTIL WE KNOW WHAT THAT IS, AND THEN MAYBE THAT ONE OF THEM IS SO EXPENSIVE THAT WE CAN'T EVEN GET IT WITHIN OUR CAP, THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO LOOK AT.
[NOISE] NOT THERE YET, BUT I DO FEAR THAT IF WE FOCUS ON A SENIOR CENTER ONLY, REDUCE A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF VOTERS.
THAT WOULD BE PAYING THOSE TAXES FOR A LOT OF YEARS BEFORE THEY'RE ELIGIBLE TO USE THE SPACE.
MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THE ATTORNEYS HAVE BEEN CONSULTED ON THAT PARTICULAR QUESTION, AND WE CAN SEPARATE THE DEBT BUILDING COST AND THE OPERATING COST INTO TWO SEPARATE.
>> UNDERSTAND THE OPERATING COSTS WOULD BE IN THE CAP.
>> OPERATING COSTS WOULD BE SEPARATED WITHIN THE CAP, BUT THE DEBT BUILDING COST.
>> THOSE TWO WOULD HAVE TO BE TIED BARRED TOGETHER SO THAT ONE CAN'T PASS WITHOUT THE OTHER.
I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT TRUSTEE DESCHAINE AND THEN TRUSTEE LENTZ, TRUSTEE CENTER.
>> TRUSTEE CAN YOU GO BEFORE ME. I SHOULDN'T HAVE SPOKEN YET.
>> WELL, I'M JUST GOING TO SAY THAT I'M LOOKING AT THIS PICTURE HERE, AND THERE'S THE MULTI PURPOSE ROOM.
LIKE IF YOU ADDED THE SMALLER PART DID NOT GO WITH ALL THE GYMNASIUMS AND STUFF LIKE THAT, PERHAPS WE COULD CALL THIS A COMMUNITY CENTER INSTEAD OF THE SENIOR CENTER.
LIKE JUST NOT THE GYMNASIUMS AND ALL THE LOCKER ROOMS AND I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S AN EITHER OR THING, IS WHAT I'M SAYING.
I THINK THAT IF WE HAD A MULTIPURPOSE ROOM WHERE WE COULD HOST LIKE LUNCHEONS, AND WARMING KITCHENS AND THAT WE HAVE THE ACTIVITY LOUNGES AND BILLIARDS AND STUFF, WE COULD STILL HAVE A SMALLER BUILDING MAYBE NOT SO MUCH COST INVOLVED, BUT WE WOULDN'T HAVE THE GYMNASIUMS AND THAT THING.
I'M JUST OFFERING THAT UP FOR AN OPTION.
>> YOU'RE SUGGESTING THAT WE HAVE ESSENTIALLY THE SENIOR CENTER PLUS THE ADDITIONAL WARMING THE [OVERLAPPING]
>> UNDERSTOOD. I GUESS WHAT I'M TRYING TO ASK IS YOU'RE SUGGESTING OPENING THAT UP SO IT IS NOT SENIORS ONLY TO THE WHOLE SPACE?
>> HAVING IT BE AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE TO COME IN THERE?
>> PERHAPS NOT HAVING THAT HUGE GYMNASIUM.
>> NO. I'M JUST SAYING THE RECTANGLE THERE AND NOT PRECLUDING THE SENIORS IN INTO THAT.
>> RIGHT. ONLY I THINK THAT WE WOULD STILL WANT TO CALL IT A COMMUNITY CENTER.
WHY WOULDN'T YOU BILLIARDS AND TABLE TENNIS? WHY COULDN'T THE KIDS COME IN AND DO THAT, TOO? I'M JUST SAYING, I MIGHT BE OFF BASE.
>> IT CERTAINLY IS A POSSIBILITY.
WHAT I'LL SAY IS THAT I DON'T SPEAK FOR THE SENIOR ADVISORY BOARD AT THE SENIOR CENTER, BUT I IMAGINE THAT WOULD GO OVER PRETTY BADLY.
THEY WERE VERY PROTECTIVE OF THEIR SPACE, AND THEY WERE NOT INTERESTED IN HAVING OTHER FOLKS IN THEIR AREAS.
I'LL LET THEM SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES AS THEY'VE DONE WELL THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE PROCESS.
BUT I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WOULD BE A PROSPECT THAT WOULD BE WELCOMED BY THE CURRENT USERS OF THE SENIOR CENTER.
TREASURY D SHANE AND THE TRUSTEE WINS.
>> I THINK WE CAN CALL THIS A COMMUNITY CENTER AND SEGREGATE THE SENIOR ONLY AREA.
I DON'T HAVE TO BE JOINT SPACE THAT'S USED.
WE CAN HAVE AREAS THAT'S USED BY THE SENIORS DURING THEIR TIME AND COMMUNITY SPACE THAT'S SEPARATE USED THE OTHER TIMES.
WE HAVE NOT SEEN A GROUNDSWELL OF SUPPORT FOR COMMUNITY CENTER.
THIS HAS BEEN A DISCUSSION FOR TWO YEARS.
NOW, THIS ACTIVE OVER 50 GROUP HAS COME OUT FOR IT, BUT THEY'RE ALSO USING THEM ALL IN THE WINTER.
THEY DO HAVE INDOOR SPACE FOR RECREATION.
[02:15:01]
ANOTHER SIGN THAT THERE'S NOT A STRONG COMMUNITY SUPPORT FOR THIS IS WE'VE RECEIVED NO DONATIONS FOR THIS.WE TRIED. THE FORMER MANAGER REACHED OUT AND TRIED AND GOT NO TAKERS.
PORTAGE RAISED $5.7 MILLION FOR THEIRS IN PRIVATE MONEY.
WE TRIED, WE HAVEN'T REACHED IT.
THE POINT IS THE COMMUNITY REALLY THIS IS A IDEA THAT THE BOARD IS LIKE STAFF LIKES A LOT, BUT IT'S NOT REALLY A GROUNDSWELL OF SUPPORT WHERE THERE'S NOT A LOT OF COMMUNITY SUPPORT COMING OUT FOR IT.
WHAT WE'RE HEARING FROM THE COMMUNITY IS TAXES ARE HIGH AND BUILD A SENIOR ONLY CENTER.
NOW, WE MIGHT ALL THINK WE'RE SMARTER THAN RESIDENTS, AND WE THINK THEY WANT A TAX INCREASE.
WE THINK THEY DON'T MIND THAT, BUT I THINK WE SHOULD NOT IGNORE WHAT WE'RE HEARING FROM THE PUBLIC, WHICH IS THEY WANT A SENIOR ONLY FACILITY.
WE CAN HAVE IT BOTH WAYS, IN SOME SENSES BY CREATING A COMMUNITY SPACE WITHIN THE SENIOR CENTER THAT'S SEPARATE FROM.
WELL, BACK TO THE COMMUNITY CENTER FOR A SECOND.
WE GOT TO REMEMBER, WE ARE A SEMI RURAL TOWNSHIP.
WE CAN'T BE ALL THINGS TO ALL PEOPLE.
WE HAVE 19 PARKS, AND WE HAVE 1,500 ACRES IN LAND PRESERVE.
THAT'S A PHENOMENAL ACHIEVEMENT.
WE DON'T ALSO HAVE TO HAVE A COMMUNITY SPACE FOR THE INDOOR JAM AND PICKLEBALL COURTS.
WE'RE A MEDIUM SIZE OR A LARGE TOWNSHIP, BUT WE ALSO HAVE A RURAL ELEMENT TO OUR TOWNSHIP AS WELL.
I DON'T THINK WE CAN AFFORD A SENIOR CENTER. WE GOT THIS EMAIL.
WE ALL READ IT FROM LUCY THOMPSON.
THIS IS ON MARCH 8TH. WHAT SHE SAID IS REALLY STRIKING.
SHE SAYS, "OUR PROPERTY TAXES ARE NOW AT AN ASTOUNDING AND UNSUSTAINABLE RATE.
IF THE TOWNSHIP IS TRYING TO PUSH US OUT OR PUSH OUT REGULAR PEOPLE, IT'S WORKING.
I'M A LIBERAL. I'M A COLLEGE PROFESSOR, AND I'M IN FAVOR OF TAXES WHEN SPENT APPROPRIATELY, BUT I AM SHOCKED BY THE TOWNSHIP IS RAISING TAXES SO IN SUCH TOUGH FINANCIAL TIMES.
I AM BECOMING VERY AFRAID THAT I WILL LOSE MY HOUSE BECAUSE MY SALARY IS NOT KEEPING UP WITH THE RISING COST OF LIVING HERE.
SPECIFICALLY, PROPERTY TAXES ARE BECOMING UNBEARABLE.
THESE ARE MUCH MORE, MUCH HIGHER THAN IN MOST OF THE REST OF THIS AREA, AND IT'S ABSOLUTELY CRIPPLING.
PLEASE CONSIDER IT A PRIORITY TO LOWER THE COST OF LIVING, ESPECIALLY PROPERTY TAXES FOR MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS, ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO DO NOT HAVE A LARGE HOUSEHOLD INCOME.
I DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH LONGER I CAN SURVIVE HERE." WE'RE BANNING ABOUT COMMUNITY CENTER VERSUS A SENIOR CENTER.
WE KNOW COMMUNITY CENTER IS GOING TO COST THREE TIMES AS MUCH AND THREE TIMES AS MUCH TO OPERATE, AND IT'S GOING TO TAKE TAX REVENUE TO DO THAT.
ACT IT FOR THE VOTERS, AND THEY MAY APPROVE IT.
IT DOESN'T MAKE THE TAX BURDEN ANY LESS FOR THE REST OF OUR COMMUNITY.
THIS EMAIL REALLY STRUCK OUT TO ME.
THESE ARE OUR LIBERAL PROGRESSIVE VOTE FOR MILLAGE SUPPORTERS WHO ARE SAYING YOU'VE GONE TOO FAR.
YOU'VE GOT TO STOP. WE CAN'T TAKE ANY MORE.
NOW, THIS PROBLEM IS EXACERBATED BY THE COUNTY.
THE COUNTY THREW ANOTHER MILL AND A THIRD AT AS ALL ADDING RESIDENTS LAST YEAR. WE DIDN'T DO THAT.
WE CUT IT BACK BY TWO TENTHS OF A MILL, BUT WE HAPPEN TO HAVE THE FORTUNE OR BAD FORTUNE OR GOOD FORTUNE YOU LIVED IN THE HIGHEST TAXING COUNTY IN THE STATE OF MICHIGAN AS A PREVIOUS PERSON SPOKE.
NO ONE LEVIES MORE TAXES THAN COUNTY.
WE HAVE THIS HUGE COUNTY BASE TO BEGIN WITH, AND THEN WE'VE GOT AND WE'RE THE HIGHEST TAXING TOWNSHIP IN THE COUNTY.
JUST REACH A POINT WHERE EVEN OUR SUPPORTERS, EVEN PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN PROGRESSIVE THINGS LIKE WE DO, ARE SAYING NO MORE TAXES.
THAT ANY DISCUSSION WITH THE COMMUNITY CENTER MEANS A LOT MORE OF A TAX BITE FOR OUR RESIDENTS.
IT TRULY IS A WANT, AND WHAT OUR RESIDENTS NEED RIGHT NOW IS TAX STABILITY, NOT A TAX INCREASE.
THE NEED IS FOR TAXES TO BE KEPT DOWN, NOT FOR A COMMUNITY CENTER.
THAT'S WHAT I'M VERY CONCERNED THAT THIS BOARD DO. THANK YOU.
>> I APPRECIATE EVERYTHING THAT TREASURE DESCHAINE IS SAYING, BECAUSE I'VE OVER THE PAST COUPLE MONTHS, MET WITH, I THINK, FOUR OR FIVE DIFFERENT INDIVIDUALS, ONE OF WHICH IS IN THE ROOM, AND I APPRECIATE THEM TAKING THE TIME OUT OF THEIR DAY TO EXPLAIN THEIR PERSPECTIVES AND NEEDS.
I CAN TELL YOU, I AM THINKING ABOUT THIS EVERY DAY.
WITH THAT SAID, I DID HAVE A QUESTION.
AGAIN, MAYBE I MISSED THIS SOMEWHERE WITH THE TASK FORCE, BUT MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT THE FEBRUARY MEETING, IT WAS ASKED OF THE DESIGNERS WERE BOTH PROGRAMS BY 10-15%, AND ONLY THE SENIOR CENTER ONE WAS DROPPED BY 10-15%, DID I MISINTERPRET WHAT I WAS HEARING OR CAN YOU EXPAND ON THAT? AGAIN, I KNOW YOU WERE THERE, SUPERVISOR.
[02:20:02]
>> THAT WAS A REQUEST THAT WAS MADE OF THE PROGRESSIVE TEAM.
THEY ESSENTIALLY CAME BACK WITH A COUPLE OF OPTIONS, BUT THE OPTIONS WERE, AS I RECALL, ELIMINATE THE YOUTH RECREATION SPACE FULLY.
OPTION 2 WAS ELIMINATE SOME OR MOST OF THE YOUTH RECREATION SPACE AND ALSO ALL SPECTATOR SPACE IN THE GYM.
IT'S JUST COURTS, NO BLEACHERS.
THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION AT THE MEETING ABOUT THAT NEITHER OF THOSE BEING OPTIONS THAT WERE INTERESTING TO THE TASK FORCE.
ULTIMATELY, THE TASK FORCE AT THE MARCH MEETING DECIDED NOT TO RECOMMEND A REDUCTION IN SQUARE FOOTAGE.
>> I APPRECIATE YOU EXPANDING ON THAT.
I DID HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR DIRECTOR SHINOZAKI IF SHE'S STILL HERE? [LAUGHTER] BIG POSTER ANYWAY.
YOU HAD MENTIONED THE EXPANSION OF I DON'T WANT TO GET THE NAME OR THE NUMBERS WRONG, SPORTS FOR SHORTIES TO THE TUNE OF 500-600, IF WE WERE TO GO FOR THE SENIOR SENIOR AND COMMUNITY OPTION WITH THE GYM, SO 500-600 BECAUSE WE HAVE OUR OWN SPACE, HOW DOES THAT WORK WITH BORROWING THE RESOURCES, DO THEY LIMIT US TO ONLY SATURDAYS? AS A NON PARENT, I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THEM LOOKS LIKE.
>> IT'S AN EXCELLENT QUESTION, AND IT'S QUITE HONESTLY, VERY COMPLEX, AND IT'S TAKEN ME A YEAR TO FIGURE OUT HOW THESE DIFFERENT RELATIONSHIPS WORK, AND I SAY THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE SCHOOL SPORTS, WE HAVE CLUB SPORTS, THEN WE HAVE TOWNSHIP SPORTS, AND THEY ALL HAVE THEIR OWN NICHE.
THESE SCHOOL SPORTS ALSO ACCOMMODATE THEIR CLUB SPORTS.
IT'S VERY LITTLE I'LL SAY NOT WITH FAULT OF ANYBODY, BUT VERY LITTLE LEFTOVER FOR THE TOWNSHIP, BECAUSE THEY ARE USED.
GENERALLY, OUR BASKETBALL PRACTICES HAPPEN DURING THE WEEK.
THEN BASKETBALL GAMES HAPPEN ON THE WEEKEND.
WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE HAVE TWO GYMS AT HAZLETT MIDDLE SCHOOL, BUT WE'RE RUNNING FOUR GAMES AT THE SAME TIME.
WE'RE NOT EVEN AND WE'RE RUNNING FOUR ON FOUR AS OPPOSED TO FIVE ON FIVE, JUST SO THAT WE CAN HELP ACCOMMODATE ALL THE KIDDOS THAT WANT TO PLAY.
OUR PROGRAMMERS HAS GOTTEN VERY CREATIVE WITH THAT, BUT WITH THAT, THOSE GYMS ARE USED GENERALLY DURING BASKETBALL SEASON WHEN SPORTS IN THE WINTER SEASON WOULD BE BASKETBALL SEASON.
IT GETS COMPLEX THE MORE YOU ADD INTO IT, BUT IT'S VERY MINIMAL GYM SPACE, ESPECIALLY NOW WITH CHIPPEWA UNDER CONSTRUCTION, TOO.
>> GOT YOU. I APPRECIATE THAT EXPLANATION.
THEN THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD WAS, WITH ALL OF THESE GREAT ACTIVITIES THAT YOU'VE LAID OUT, IF WE WANTED TO OFFER KIDS PAINTING CLASSES AND ALL THESE GYMS AND THINGS, DOES THE STAFFING PAGE, I THINK, PAGE 4 REFLECT THE ENTIRETY OF WHAT WOULD BE ASKED OF THE TOWNSHIP TO PROVIDE AS FAR AS STAFFING TO DO THAT, OR WOULD WE NEED VOLUNTEERS TO RUN THAT? DOES THAT COME THROUGH WITH LIKE A FULL TIME BASKETBALL COACH AND REC PERSON? IS THAT A PART OF THAT NUMBER?
>> ALSO, A VERY GOOD QUESTION.
WHAT WE DO CURRENTLY IS I USED WHAT WE HAVE CURRENTLY AND TRIED TO APPLY THAT TO, LET'S SAY, ALMOST DOUBLE THE AMOUNT OF ACTIVITY.
WE CURRENTLY HAVE TWO PROGRAMMERS THAT RUN ALL OF OUR YOUTH SPORTS EVENTS, AND ADULT SPORTS.
LOOKING AT THAT, IT WOULD BE A SIMILAR NUMBER OF PARTICIPANTS, SO WE WOULD EXPECT TWO FULL TIME PROGRAMMERS.
BUT WHAT WE DO NOW IS WHEN IT IS A LITTLE BUSIER, WE DO HIRE A SEASONAL STAFF, IF YOU WILL.
THAT'S BUILT INTO THAT COST AS WELL.
THEN, OF COURSE, WE WOULD NEED SOME MANAGEMENT OF SOME SORT AS WE ADD STAFF.
ALL OF THAT IS BUILT INTO THAT STAFFING COST, CORRECT.
>> I'M SORRY TO INTERRUPT. OUR COACHES ARE VOLUNTEER.
IF YOU EVER WANT TO COACH, YOU JUST CALL THE OFFICE.
>> I DON'T KNOW IF ANYONE WANTS TO SEE.
I APPRECIATE THAT BECAUSE, I THINK IF WE DID WANT TO GO FOR EXPENSIVE PLAN, I DON'T THINK WE'D WANT A SKELETON CREW AND THEN BE LIKE, "WELL, WE ACTUALLY NEED ALL THESE OTHER THINGS IN ORDER TO MAKE IT USABLE ALSO." THANK YOU.
>> AT THIS POINT, WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR ABOUT 90 MINUTES,
[02:25:01]
AND WE ARE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THIS TWO MORE TIMES BEFORE WE HAD TAKEN ANY ACTION.I WANT TO BE RESPECTFUL OF BRENDAN AND ADAM.
IF THERE ARE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE TWO OF THEM, THIS WOULD BE THE TIME TO DO THAT SO THAT WE DON'T NEED TO PULL THEM INTO OTHER FUTURE MEETINGS WITH ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS OF OUR TWO CONSULTANTS AT THIS TIME.
SEEING NONE, THEN, WITH THE BOARD'S LEAVE, WE'LL MOVE ON FROM THIS AGENDA ITEM AND PLAN TO SEE IT BACK ON FOR DISCUSSION AGAIN AT OUR APRIL 15TH MEETING.
I'LL GIVE OUR THANKS TO OUR CONSULTANTS AND OUR STAFF FOR THE PRESENTATION AND TO THE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO HAVE BEEN SO CONTINUOUSLY INVOLVED IN THIS PROCESS.
WE'LL TAKE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK TO CLEAR THE ROOM OF EASELS AND WHATNOT, AND WE'RE BACK AT 8:40.
>> PUBLIC. BUT THAT'S ALL RIGHT.
NEXT ON OUR AGENDA WAS FORMALLY KNOWN AS 13 D,
[13.D. Special Use Permit #25-03 – Okemos Land Investments– 4360 South Hagadorn Road – Recreational Marijuana Retailer]
SPECIAL USE PERMIT 2503 OCS LAND INVESTMENTS, 4360 SOUTH HAGADORN ROAD, RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA RETAILER, AND FOR THIS, WE HAVE DIRECTOR SCHMITT.>> THANK YOU. I'M JUST FLIPPING TO THE RIGHT PAGE HERE.
I HAVE 17 TABS OPEN OF SENIOR CENTER ITEMS. [LAUGHTER] JUST A SECOND, MY COMPUTER IS WORKING HARD, BECAUSE THIS IS IMD, SO IT'S ALL THE WAY DOWN HERE.
THIS IS A REQUEST IN FRONT OF THIS EVENING.
THIS IS THE FOURTH AND FINAL THE RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA SPECIAL USE PERMIT LICENSES.
THIS, APPLICANT HAS GONE THROUGH THE LICENSING PROCESS IN 2014 WAS GRANTED A CONDITIONAL LICENSE ON MAY 9 OF LAST YEAR, AND THEY DID THEN PROCEED ON TO THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT PROCESS.
THEY DID SUBMIT WITHIN 60 DAYS AS WAS REQUIRED BY THE ORDINANCE.
DURING OUR REVIEW AND DURING THE INITIAL DISCUSSION WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION, THERE WAS A REQUEST FOR AN UPDATED TRAFFIC STUDY.
THAT DID TAKE SOME TIME, BUT GIVEN THAT THEY DID SUBMIT IN TIME, WE CONSIDER THEIR APPLICATION COMPLETE, IT WAS COMPLETE.
WE HELD OFF ON FURTHER PROCESSING UNTIL THAT WAS UPDATED.
IN THE PROCESS OF UPDATING THEIR TRAFFIC STUDY.
THEY ALSO CHOSE TO MAKE A MODIFICATION TO THE PLANS TO REMOVE THE EXISTING STRUCTURE ON THE SITE AND BUILD A NEW BUILDING ON THE SITE.
AT THAT POINT, WE DETERMINED THAT WE WOULD HOLD A NEW PUBLIC HEARING ON THE PROCESS.
WE CONSIDERED A BIG ENOUGH CHANGE THAT WE REQUIRED A NEW PUBLIC HEARING ON THE PROCESS, WHICH THE PLANNING COMMISSION HELD ON MARCH 10TH, RECEIVED NO PUBLIC COMMENT AND UNANIMOUSLY RECOMMENDED APPROVAL ON MARCH 24TH FOR THIS REQUEST.
THE APPLICATION IN FRONT OF YOU WOULD BE TO REMOVE THE STRUCTURE AT 4360 SOUTH HAGERORN, EXISTING HOUSE AND OUTBUILDINGS AND BUILD A NEW STRUCTURE IN ITS PLACE SPECIFICALLY FOR THE RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA FACILITY.
IN ALL OTHER ASPECTS, THIS APPLICATION IS IDENTICAL TO THE INFORMATION THAT WAS PROVIDED DURING THE LICENSING PROCESS, OBVIOUSLY WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE TRAFFIC STUDY BEING UPDATED TO MODERN NUMBERS.
THE REASON THIS ONE WAS UPDATED SPECIFICALLY WAS THIS PROJECT ACTUALLY NEVER GOT THROUGH THE SEP PROCESS PREVIOUSLY FOR A MEDICAL LICENSE.
SO THEY DID NOT HAVE A GOOD TRAFFIC STUDY THAT WE COULD BASE THIS APPLICATION OFF OF.
SO WE REQUESTED THE INFORMATION WAS SUBSTANTIALLY OUT OF DATE AND WE THOUGHT WE DID NOT FEEL COVERED IT APPROPRIATELY SO WE ASKED FOR AN UPDATED ONE.
BY AND LARGE, THE REMAINDER OF THIS IS SIMILAR INFORMATION TO WHAT WE SAW DURING THE LICENSING PROCESS. STAFF HAS REVIEWED IT.
IT DOES MEET ALL OF OUR ORDINANCE STANDARDS AND DO NOT HAVE ANY MAJOR CONCERNS AT THIS TIME.
THEY DO HAVE A NUMBER OF THINGS THEY STILL NEED TO DO, INCLUDING GETTING APPROVAL FROM THE DRAIN COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE AND THE ROAD DEPARTMENT, THOSE ARE ITEMS THAT WILL COME AFTER SPECIAL USE PERMIT, AS WE'VE NOTED ON MULTIPLE APPLICATIONS IN THE PAST.
I WILL POINT OUT THAT THE APPLICANT IS AT THIS TIME STAYING OUT OF THE FLOODPLAIN ON THE PROPERTY BECAUSE THAT WOULD REQUIRE AN ADDITIONAL APPROVAL.
LASTLY, I WILL POINT OUT THAT THE MARIJUANA ORDINANCES, THERE'S A NUMBER OF TIME RELATED GATES WITHIN THE LICENSING ORDINANCE THAT THE TOWNSHIP BOARD ESTABLISHED.
THE FIRST TIME RELATED GATE AFTER THE CONDITIONAL LICENSE WAS THE SUP SUBMITTAL AND AS I'VE DISCUSSED, IT WAS MADE TIMELY, IT WAS MADE IN GOOD FAITH.
WE ASKED FOR ADDITIONAL INFORMATION AS WE DID FOR THREE OF THE FOUR APPLICANTS AND THAT'S WHY THE GAP IN TIME THERE.
[02:30:03]
THE SECOND GATE, WHICH I WANT TO POINT OUT THIS EVENING IS THE ISSUANCE OF PERMITS.THE ISSUANCE OF PERMITS NEEDS TO HAPPEN WITHIN 12 MONTHS OF ISSUANCE OF THE CONDITIONAL LICENSE.
IT IS SUBJECT TO ONE, SIX MONTH EXTENSION AT THE AT THE DIRECTION OF THE DIRECTOR IN THIS CASE, MYSELF.
THEY HAVE UNTIL MAY 9TH TO SECURE PERMITS TO START CONSTRUCTION.
I EXPECT, I'M PUTTING IT ON THE RECORD RIGHT NOW THAT WE WILL GET A REQUEST FOR A SIX MONTH EXTENSION ON THAT.
GIVEN THAT THAT WOULD BE A LIGHTNING FAST APPROVAL FROM THE DRAIN COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE AND SO I JUST WANT TO PUT THAT OUT THERE BECAUSE THAT IS THE NEXT DATE GATE IN THE ORDINANCE AND BEING OPEN AND TRANSPARENT ABOUT IT THAT UNDER THE TERMS OF THE LICENSING ORDINANCE, THAT EXTENSION IS LEFT TO ME.
THE THIRD TIMING GATE IS ACTUAL OPERATIONS.
THAT HAS TO HAPPEN WITHIN TWO YEARS.
OF THE ISSUANCE OF THE CONDITIONAL LICENSE, THE BOARD HAS THE ABILITY TO EXTEND THAT ITEM AND SO IF WE GET TO THAT POINT, AND WE'LL BE BACK IN FRONT OF THE BOARD.
WHAT IS TWO YEARS FROM THE ACTUAL OPERATIONS.
IT'S TWO YEARS FROM WHAT DATE? THE ISSUANCE OF THE LICENSING.
MAY 9TH WAS THE DATE THE BOARD AUTHORIZED THE CONDITIONAL LICENSE IN 2014.
>> IF WE FIND OURSELVES BACK HERE MAY 9TH, 2026?
>> YOU WOULD FIND OURSELVES BACK HERE BEFORE THAT, WE WOULD KNOW, AND WE WOULD.
>> SURE. THEY WOULD BE ASKING FOR AN EXTENSION IF THEY'RE OPERATIONAL.
>> CORRECT, SORRY THANK YOU. THAT'S ALL I HAVE.
I JUST WANTED TO GO THROUGH THOSE COUPLE OF DATE ITEMS BECAUSE THIS IS SUCH A UNIQUE APPROVAL.
FROM A ZONING PERSPECTIVE, THIS IS VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD.
WE THE STANDARDS OF THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT, AND WE ARE HERE THIS EVENING FOR THE INITIAL DISCUSSION OF THAT.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SHANE.
>> WHEN THIS WAS LAST BEFORE US, THERE WAS EXTENSIVE DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT BUILDING AND HOW WONDERFUL IT IS GOING TO BE AND HOW THEY'RE GOING TO PRESERVE IT AND MAKE A HISTORIC SIDE OF IT, ETC AND NOW THEY ARE GOING TO TEAR IT DOWN.
IS THERE A NEW OWNER INVOLVED HERE?
>> THERE'S NOT A NEW OWNER. I THINK THEY GOT INTO THE FINANCIALS AND THE DETAILS OF THAT STRUCTURE AND REALIZED THAT IT WAS PROBABLY UNSALVAGEABLE.
I CERTAINLY LOOKED THAT WAY FROM THE TEND TO AGREE WITH YOU. SECOND QUESTION.
ARE THERE CRITERIA FOR YOU ALLOWING THE SIX MONTH EXTENSION OR THE BOARD, OR IS IT COMPLETELY UP TO THE JUDGMENT OF THE DIRECTOR OR THE BOARD?
>> THE SIX MONTH EXTENSION IS ENTIRELY UP TO THE JUDGMENT OF THE DIRECTOR.
>> NO CRITERIA FOR GRANTING IT, I GUESS I'M WONDERING WHY THEY EVEN MAKE THAT AN OPTION.
I JUST GIVE THEM 18 MONTHS IF IT'S JUST UP TO THE DIRECTOR WITH NO CRITERIA REQUIRED TO JUSTIFY THE EXTENSION.
>> I THINK GENERALLY THE STANDARD WHEN YOU HAVE THINGS LIKE THIS IN ZONING IS YOU WANT TO SEE PROGRESS? YOU DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO HAVE IT JUST 18 MONTHS OF AT THE LAST MINUTE I COULD COME IN.
I WANT TO HAVE A GATE IN THERE OF PUSHING TOWARDS IT SO THAT I CAN SAY, YES, YOU DO DESERVE SIX MORE MONTHS.
YOU HAVE A REASONABLE EXPECTATION THAT YOU CAN GET THERE.
OR YOU KNOW WHAT? YOU REALLY HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING.
WHY WOULD WE GRANT YOU SIX MORE MONTHS? I THINK THAT'S WHY YOU BUILD IT THAT WAY. IT'S A JUDGMENT CALL.
IT'S ONE THAT WE MADE WHEN WE ESTABLISHED THIS ORDINANCE, ULTIMATELY. THANK YOU.
>> ARE THEY GOING TO NEED ANY VARIANCES ON THIS PROPERTY? BECAUSE I KNOW YOU'VE GOT THE FLOODPLAIN BEHIND IT, AND IT'S ROUGHLY 2,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING.
ARE THEY GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO IT WITHOUT ANY VARIANCES?
>> WE'VE NOT IDENTIFIED ANY VARIANCES AT THIS TIME.
>> I LIKE A COMMENT THAT BASED ON THE DIAGRAMS PROVIDED, I'M SHOCKED THAT THIS MEETS OUR PARKING STANDARDS.
>> WELL, 2,000 SQUARE FEET IS NOT MUCH, SO IT DOESN'T REQUIRE MANY PARKING SPACES.
>> A COUPLE OF THE EMPLOYEE SPACES AT THE BACK, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MAYBE SIX TOTAL PARKING SPACES FOR THE PUBLIC USE.
>> AT 2,030 SQUARE FEET, LET ME PULL THAT UP REAL FAST, SINCE WE DON'T TYPICALLY GET INTO THAT RIGHT NOW.
>> I'M JUST AMAZED. IS MORE OF WHAT IT IS.
>> NO, WE'RE GOING TO CALL THAT A GENERAL RETAIL SPACE.
IT'S GOING TO BE UNDER 25,000 SO IT'S NOT A SHOPPING MALL.
THEY'RE PROBABLY ONLY AT 10 SPACES.
[02:35:02]
>> WELL, SO IT'S IMPORTANT, I THINK TO REMIND OURSELVES THAT THESE SPECIAL USE PERMIT DECISIONS ARE MEANT TO BE DETERMINED BASED ON ONLY A SMALL NUMBER OF CRITERIA, AND THAT'S LAID OUT IN THE SUP REQUEST STANDARDS THAT'S IN THE APPLICATION PACKET AND AS WE FOUND, I THINK, WITH PREVIOUS RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA RETAILERS, A LOT OF THE SCRUTINY OF THIS PROCESS CAME DURING THE LICENSURE OF THE APPLICATION AS OPPOSED TO AT THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT LEVEL.
OVERALL, AS I LOOKED AT THE CRITERIA.
IT DOES MEET BY MY EYE ALL THE BASIC CRITERIA THAT WE ARE MEANT TO JUDGE THIS ON AND I HAVE NO REAL CONCERNS.
IN FACT, I ACTUALLY HAVE FEWER CONCERNS WITH A NEW BUILD THAT CAN TAKE INTO ACCOUNT MITIGATION MORE EASILY FROM THE GET GO THAN I WOULD HAVE IF THEY WERE TRYING TO RETROFIT THE OLD BUILDING AND SO I SEE NO ISSUE WITH THE OVERALL THE UNDERLYING CRITERIA THAT WE'RE MEANT TO JUDGE THIS ON.
>> IF THEY'RE GRANTED THE SIX MONTH EXTENSION, WHICH TAKES US INTO NOVEMBER OF 2025, WHAT IF THE DRAIN COMMISSION, GIVEN WHAT WE HAVE SEEN THE DRAIN COMMISSION DO, DOES NOT COMPLETE THEIR WORK? WHAT HAPPENS AT THE END OF THAT 18 MONTHS?
>> FROM A LICENSING PERSPECTIVE, THAT CONDITIONAL LICENSE WOULD NO LONGER BE VALID BECAUSE THEY WOULD HAVE NOT MET THEIR TIME GATE.
HOW THAT SHAKES DOWN, WE'LL HAVE TO WORK THROUGH WITH OUR ATTORNEYS, BUT THEY WOULD BE IN VIOLATION OF THE ORDINANCE AT THAT POINT IF THEY ARE UNABLE TO GET THEIR APPROVAL THROUGH ALL AGENCIES AND BE PERMITTED FOR CONSTRUCTION.
NOW, THERE ARE CERTAINLY SCENARIOS UNDER WHICH YOU CAN GET A PERMIT TO START CONSTRUCTION ON CERTAIN ASPECTS OF A SITE BEFORE YOU HAVE ALL OF YOUR APPROVALS.
THE BIGGER CONCERN, IN MY MIND, IF WE'RE BEING CANDID, IS THE LONG TERM GETTING OPEN, BECAUSE IF THEY HAVE A TIMING ISSUE WITH THE DRAIN COMMISSIONER UPFRONT THAT STALLS THEM INTO NEXT YEAR BECAUSE THEY DON'T GET APPROVAL UNTIL SAY NOVEMBER AND ARE UNABLE TO START CONSTRUCTION IN WINTER SO YOU'RE LOOKING AT AN APRIL, MAY START, THAT'S A BIGGER DISCUSSION FOR ME IN THE LONGER TERM BECAUSE THEN I WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE CONCERNED.
MAKE NO MISTAKE. IT'S TIGHT, NO MATTER WHAT IT WAS TIGHT FOR THE FOR THE GROUPS THAT GOT IN IMMEDIATELY.
BUILDING NEW CONSTRUCTION, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO STAY ON IT.
THIS IS THE HARD PART OF DEVELOPMENT NOW, REGARDLESS OF THE USE.
>> IS THIS A COMPLEX PROJECT FOR THE DRAIN COMMISSION OR IS IT A MATTER OF THE QUEUE?
>> IT BUTTS UP AGAINST FLOODPLAIN SO IT'S NOT AN EASY ONE, I WOULD SAY.
THEIR ENGINEERS WILL MAKE THEIR MONEY.
>> OTHER BOARD MEMBERS? TRUSTEE WES.
>> ALMOST ALL OF MY QUESTIONS I HAD WERE ANSWERED BY, WATCHING THE PLANNING COMMISSION OR I GUESS LAST MONTH, AND THEN YOU EXPLAINED THAT TIMELINE, TIM, SO I APPRECIATE THAT.
THE QUESTION I DO HAVE IS THERE GREATER SCRUTINY BY THE BY THE DRAIN OFFICE BECAUSE THIS WOULD BE A NEW BUILD AS COMPARED TO THE LAST FACILITY, WHICH WOULD BE RE HAVING THE BUILDING.
>> NO. I THINK THEY WOULD HAVE GOTTEN EQUAL SCRUTINY EITHER WAY BECAUSE ULTIMATELY THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE TO BUILD A NEW PARKING LOT FOR THE BUILDING AS WELL AND SO YOU WERE STILL GOING TO RUN INTO, WE'RE ADDING 5,000 SQUARE FEET, WHAT ROUND NUMBER OF IMPERVIOUS SURFACE, AND SO WE HAVE TO ACCOMMODATE FOR THAT.
I THINK UNDER EITHER SCENARIO, IT'S GOING TO GO THROUGH THE NORMAL PROCESS IN MASON AND IT'S JUST GOING TO BE A MATTER OF THEM MEETING THE STANDARDS OF THE DRAIN COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE.
>> THANK YOU. I FEEL LIKE EVERYTHING THAT I HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT HAVE BEEN SUFFICIENTLY ANSWERED. I APPRECIATE THAT.
>> OTHER BOARD MEMBERS? WELL, BASED ON THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT CRITERIA, ARE WE I WANT TO GIVE OUR STAFF SOME DIRECTION SO THAT THEY CAN BRING THIS BACK AT THE NEXT MEETING?
>> YES. I KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING WITH THAT
[02:40:01]
AND BASED ON WHAT WE'VE SEEN AND THE CRITERIA, I THINK IT MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS TO GRANT THE SUV.>> WHAT ELSE? A DISAGREEMENT ABOUT THAT? SOUNDS LIKE WE'LL BE ASKING FOR A RESOLUTION TO APPROVE IT AT OUR NEXT MEETING, PLEASE. WE WILL BRING THAT FORWARD.
>> THANK YOU TO OUR APPLICANTS FOR BEING PRESENT.
SORRY, FOR HAVING YOU SHOW UP AND NOT HAVE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, BUT I GUESS THAT'S PROBABLY THE IDEAL STATE FOR YOU.
[LAUGHTER] THAT BRINGS US TO OUR NEXT AGENDA ITEM, WHICH IS NOW 13C TO PERSONNEL I ALMOST SAID, PERSONALITY.
[13.B. Personnel Policy Update]
PERSONNEL POLICY UPDATES.AND WE HAVE DIRECTOR TETOF WITH US TONIGHT TO WALK US THROUGH SECTION 2.
>> GOOD EVENING, SUPERVISOR AND BOARD.
HOPE YOU'RE DOING WELL TONIGHT.
>> SO FAR SO GOOD. LET'S TALK WORKPLACE SAFETY.
>> THAT'S RIGHT. FOR THAT SECOND PART, HOW SHALL WE TACKLE IT? DO YOU WANT TO START WITH QUESTIONS? ANYTHING THAT YOU'VE HAD, TIME TO LOOK AT THAT YOU WANT TO DO IN THAT WAY?
>> AT LAST TIME AROUND FOR THE FIRST SECTION, WE JUST WENT PAGE BY PAGE.
I KNOW THAT A NUMBER OF US HAVE TAKEN NOTES ON THE SIDE, AND WE'LL JUST SAY IF ANYONE HAS ANY ISSUES, WE'LL STOP THERE AND THEN WE'LL KEEP GOING.
>> WE'LL START, I GUESS, WITH PAGE 19 IN YOUR PACKETS, WHICH IS WORKPLACE SAFETY, AND WE START WITH DRUG FREE WORKPLACE.
ANY BOARD MEMBERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE DRUG FREE WORKPLACE SECTION OR ISSUES? OKAY.
>> CAN I MAKE A COMMENT ABOUT PARAGRAPH 2.
YOU STATE IN THE FIRST SENTENCE THAT ILLEGAL DRUG OR ALCOHOL AND THEN YOU TACK ON THIS STATEMENT IN SECOND STATEMENT IN THAT PARAGRAPH UNDER MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP PROHIBITS ALL EMPLOYEES.
THIS PROHIBITION APPLIES TO MARIJUANA.
IT'S LIKE HANGING OUT THERE, AND I'M NOT SURE WHY IT ISN'T INCORPORATED INTO ILLEGAL DRUG OR ALCOHOL OR MARIJUANA.
IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S MORE LOGICAL TO PUT THOSE THREE THINGS TOGETHER.
I THINK WE CERTAINLY COULD PUT IT THAT WAY.
WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS WITH COUNSEL, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MAY HAVE BEEN ALSO FOR EMPHASIS, JUST GIVEN THE NATURE AND THE EVOLUTION OF THE MARIJUANA AND HOW THAT'S WORKING OUT FOR EMPLOYERS AND USE GENERALLY.
I'M NOT OPPOSED TO CHECKING ON THAT TO PUT TOGETHER.
>> OR ARE WE ARE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT CHANGE? SEEING NODS. LET'S ASK AND SEE IF WE CAN MAKE THAT HAPPEN.
>> ANYTHING ELSE IN THIS SECTION? ALL RIGHT. SEEING LET ME MOVE ON.
PAGE 20, EMPLOYEE ASSISTANCE AND DRUG FREE AWARENESS.
ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT SECTION?
DO WE HAVE AN EMPLOYEE ASSISTANCE PROGRAM THAT WOULD COVER THIS?
>> YES, WE DO HAVE AN IN PLACE.
>> ANYTHING ELSE ON THAT PAGE? WE STRUCK THROUGH A BUNCH OF ITEMS THAT I BELIEVE GOT REALLOCATED ELSEWHERE.
>> BECAUSE I DROVE THROUGH THE REST OF IT, SO WE'LL SEE THOSE AGAIN SOON.
PAGE 21, REQUIRED DRUG AND ALCOHOL TESTING, ISSUES, COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS ON THE UPDATED LANGUAGE HERE.
FROM A POLICIES PERSPECTIVE, I HAVE DONE.
I MAY FOLLOW UP WITH SOME PRACTICAL QUESTIONS FOR ANOTHER TIME, BUT WE'LL SAVE THAT SINCE WE'RE GOING PRETTY LATE HERE.
CONSEQUENCES FOR VIOLATION OF DRUG FREE POLICIES.
I APPRECIATE ADDING THE ADDITIONAL ITEMS TO THE TITLE, SO IT'S NOT JUST CONSEQUENCES THAT HELPFUL.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON THAT? SEEING NONE. CONFIDENTIALITY OF DRUG TEST INFORMATION.
THIS IS PRETTY STANDARD LEGAL USE, I'M SURE.
PAGE 23, IF WE DON'T SEE ANYTHING THERE.
>> BEFORE WE START, I WANT TO REMOVE WORKPLACE BULLYING.
>> THAT HAS BEEN REFRAMED UNDER THE CODE OF CONDUCT UNDER PROFESSIONALISM AND CIVILITY.
>> VIOLENCE IN THE WORKPLACE? [NOISE] I THINK WE CAN ALL AGREE WE'RE OPPOSED TO THAT.
>> WE'RE ONLY EXPECTED TO REFRAIN.
>> [NOISE] SAFETY. PAGE 23 AT THE BOTTOM.
EVERYONE BE SAFE WHILE YOU WORK,
[02:45:01]
FILL OUT YOUR ACCIDENT REPORTS, IF YOU PLEASE.>> SEE NO SHOOTING UP HANDS ON THAT ONE.
THIS IS STANDARD MYOSHA STUFF AND NO CHANGES.
WE ARE ACKNOWLEDGING THAT VAPING EXISTS AND PROHIBITING THAT AS WELL.
I DON'T SEE ANYONE READING TO THAT ONE AS EITHER. LOOK AT THAT.
WE'VE MADE IT ROUGH A WHOLE SECTION ALREADY.
WORKPLACE EXPECTATIONS, PERFORMANCE EXPECTATIONS, CODE OF CONDUCT, TRUSTEE WILSON.
>> AT THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE PAGE, THE LAST PARAGRAPH, IN ADDITION, THE TOWNSHIP ALSO MAINTAINS A CODE OF CONDUCT.
THE SECOND SENTENCE SAYS, AS WELL AS TO PROTECT THE RIGHTS OF PEOPLE.
YOU SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT THE LIST BE LOWEST FOR ILLUSTRATION PURPOSES ONLY.
THERE ARE OTHER TYPES OF CONDUCT THAT MIGHT JEOPARDIZE PERSONAL.
IT IMPLIES THAT THIS LIST ARE THE THINGS YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO.
THAT PARAGRAPH NEEDS TO BE REWORKED BECAUSE IT'S VERY CONFUSING. DID YOU READ THAT?
>> YES. I DID SEE THAT, AND I BELIEVE THE MISSING SENTENCE THAT ADDS THE CONTEXT THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR, CAN BE FOUND ON PAGE 26 BECAUSE ON PAGE 26, IT SAYS THAT THERE IS A LIST BELOW.
>> OF EXAMPLES OF UNACCEPTABLE WORKPLACE BEHAVIORS, AND THEN THE LIST INCLUDES THINGS LIKE TREAT OTHERS WITH DIGNITY AND RESPECT.
I BELIEVE THAT WE'VE JUST SWAPPED WHERE THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE.
IN FACT, THE LIST OF UNACCEPTABLE THINGS IS FALSIFICATION OF TIME KEEPING RECORDS, AND THE CODE OF CONDUCT SHOULD REFER TO THE TREATING PEOPLE WITH DIGNITY AND RESPECT.
SO IT'S THE PARAGRAPH BEFORE THE LIST ON PAGE 25, AND TWO PARAGRAPHS BEFORE THE LIST ON PAGE 26.
WE NEED TO EXAMINE THE LANGUAGE AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE REFERRING TO THE CORRECT LIST.
>> GOING ON IN THIS SECTION AT THE TOP OF PAGE 22, THE 1, 02, 3, 4, 5, 6 BULLET, FIFTH AND SIXTH.
YOU TALK ABOUT UNAUTHORIZED USE OF TELEPHONE, MAIL SYSTEM, INTERNET OR COMPUTER WORKS.
NOWHERE DO I SEE IN HERE THE UNAUTHORIZED USE OF CREDIT CARDS, AND WE ACTUALLY HAVE HAD THAT SITUATION.
I THINK YOU SHOULD ADD THAT IN.
>> JUST TO EMPHASIZE THAT THAT GOES ALONG WITH OUR CREDIT CARD AND OUR PURCHASING POLICY.
>> I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT.
>> UNAUTHORIZED USE OF CREDIT CARDS, NOT IN ACCORDANCE WITH EXISTING DEBT [OVERLAPPING].
>> BASICALLY PAYING YOUR TOWNSHIP PROPERTY.
>> ANY OTHER CHANGES TO THAT SECTION? PAGE 25, AND THEN ON TO 26.
SO NONE. PROFESSIONALISM AND CIVILITY AT THE BOTTOM OF PAGE 26, WE ALREADY MENTIONED THE SWAPPING OF PARAGRAPHS.
ANY OTHER CHANGES TO THAT? DON'T SEE ANY ONE JUMPING AT THAT EITHER.
VERY GOOD. TWENTY SEVEN IS JUST THE CONCLUSION OF THAT SECTION, TRUSTEE WILSON?
>> I'M SORRY. I THINK I'M ON 28.
>> I'M SORRY. 26. I KNEW I HAD PUT A NOTE THAT WAS ON A DIFFERENT AGENDA.
I THINK IT MIGHT BE THE SAME CONCERN THAT YOU TWO HAD WITH THE OTHER LIST.
ALTHOUGH IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CREATE AN ENCOMPASSING LIST OF PROHIBITED BEHAVIOR, AND THEN THE LIST BELOW IS TREATING OTHERS WITH DIGNITY AND RESPECT.
>> THAT'S THE SECTION THAT [OVERLAPPING]
>> WELL, YOU'RE GOOD. [OVERLAPPING] THAT'S WHAT WE'RE MOVING.
>> THEN WE'RE MOVING ON TO PAGE 28.
IN THE CENTER OF THE FIRST PARAGRAPH, IT SAYS, CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION WILL NOT BE DISCLOSED TO EXTERNAL PARTIES OR OTHER EMPLOYEES WITHOUT A LEGITIMATE BUSINESS REASON.
I THINK THAT COULD BE SUBJECT TO INTERPRETATION OF WHAT'S A LEGITIMATE BUSINESS REASON.
MAYBE THAT NEEDS TO BE CLARIFIED A LITTLE BIT MORE.
>> [NOISE] WELL, AND I WONDER IF DOES THE NEXT LINE HELP THAT IF AN EMPLOYEE HAS QUESTIONS ABOUT WHETHER IT IS CONSIDERED CONFIDENTIAL ON WHETHER TO DISCLOSE IT?
>> IT SAYS CONFIDENTIAL, BUT AGAIN, LEGAL BUSINESS REASON, I THINK NEEDS TO ALSO BE CITED THERE IN THAT LAST SENTENCE.
BECAUSE I THINK IT LEAVES IT TOO WIDE OPEN.
[02:50:07]
>> I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT AND MAYBE YOU CAN HELP ME TO UNDERSTAND THE RATIONALE FOR HAVING THE HUMAN RESOURCES DIRECTOR BE INCLUDED AS A CHECKPOINT FOR WHETHER SOMETHING IS CONFIDENTIAL.
THERE'S A LOT OF INSTANCES WHERE YOU MAY NOT KNOW IF INFORMATION IS CONFIDENTIAL.
>> ITS SUPERVISOR IS THE FIRST PERSON THEY CAN GO TO.
>> THEN WE'RE COVERING IT IN ALL THREE [OVERLAPPING]
>> IN THAT SAME SENTENCE, I THINK WE SHOULD SAY, IF THEY HAVE QUESTIONS, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO CHECK WITH THEIR SUPERVISOR DIRECTOR OR THE HUMAN SERVICES DIRECTOR.
>> I AGREE. IT SHOULD BE PERMISSION.
>> VERY GOOD. ANY OTHER CHANGES IN THE CONFIDENTIALITY AREA? MEDIA CONTACTS.
IT'S A RELATIVELY SMALL PARAGRAPH.
SEEING NONE, CONFLICTS OF INTEREST.
>> PLEASE. THANK YOU. WE NEEDED TO UPDATE THE COMMUNICATIONS MANAGER.
>> WE DON'T HAVE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR.
WE HAVE THE COMMUNICATIONS MANAGER.
>> THAT'S IN A COUPLE OF PLACES THERE.
CONFLICTS OF INTEREST? I THINK THAT'S PRETTY WELL LAID OUT THERE.
PAGE 29. MOTORING RIGHT ALONG. GIFTS AND FAVORS.
SEEING NO CHANGES THERE. YES, TREASURY CHANGE.
>> BACK TO THAT GIFTS AND FAVORS.
IN ORDER TO INFLUENCE THEIR TOWNSHIP DECISION MAKING, SOMEONE COULD TAKE A GIFT AND SAY, I DON'T THINK THIS IS GOING TO INFLUENCE ME.
>> IT'S A NARROW INTERPRETATION.
>> I'D RATHER SAY FROM A PERSON FIRM OR COOPERATION, THAT COULD BE CONSTRUED AS AN ATTEMPT TO INFLUENCE THEIR TOWNSHIP DECISION MAKING.
WE'RE LEAVING THE WHOLE DECISION OF WHETHER THIS IS APPROPRIATE OR NOT ON THE EMPLOYEE.
I THINK WE NEED A MORE OBJECTIVE THING TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT COULD BE CONSTRUED AS AN ATTEMPT TO INFLUENCE THEIR DECISION MAKING.
>> I WONDER IF WE COULD EVEN STRENGTHEN IT, BECAUSE WE DID HAVE CONVERSATION AT LENGTH ABOUT THIS WHOLE CONCEPT, BECAUSE THERE ARE TIMES WHERE EVEN A VENDOR MAY STOP BY AND DROP OFF COOKIES, AND SO WHERE WE DRAW THE LINE ON WHETHER THAT'S INFLUENTIAL OR NOT.
WE CAN TAKE THAT BACK AND FIND SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT MORE AFFIRMING, AND THEN IF ANYONE RECEIVES, OR IF SOMEONE TRIES TO GIVE A GIFT TO GIVE THEM THE LANGUAGE TO SAY, THANK YOU SO MUCH, BUT WE CANNOT ACCEPT THAT.
>> I GOT OUT FOR SOME CAR WASH PASSES, AND I SAID, THAT'S REALLY NICE OF YOU. WE DON'T TAKE.
[INAUDIBLE] AT THE COUNTER, PEOPLE WANT TO DO NICE FOR US, BECAUSE WE HAVE A LOT OF INFLUENCE OVER THEM.
YOU GOT TO BE REALLY CAREFUL OF THESE THINGS.
>> YOU COULD. ONE OF THE AREAS, YOU COULD SAY YOU CANNOT ACCEPT GIFT THINGS, WHATEVER FROM ANYBODY WHO HAS BUSINESS BEFORE THE TOWNSHIP OR WITH THE TOWNSHIP OR WHO'S THE OTHER ONE OR ANY GIFT, WHATEVER THAT IS DELIVERED TO YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE A TOWNSHIP EMPLOYEE.
>> THINK OF CHRISTMAS TIME, WHEN VENDORS COME IN AND BRING US A PLATE OF COOKIES OR SOMETHING THAT.
>> THEY'RE NOT GIVING IT TO YOU.
THEY'RE GIVING IT TO THE DEPARTMENT.
[OVERLAPPING] IT NEEDS TO BE SOME CLARIFICATION, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE TIGHTENED UP FROM WHAT WE HAD.
WE TALKED ABOUT IT FOR A WHILE.
[OVERLAPPING] SOMETHING I THINK WE TURNED UP THE LAWYERS TO COME UP WITH SOMETHING.
>> WE JUST TALKED ABOUT THAT RECENTLY WITH COUNSEL, AND EVEN JUST TALKING ABOUT GIFT CARDS, HARD NO, AND ANYTHING, MONEY, ANY FAVORS, ANYTHING LIKE THAT, AND TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S JUST A THANK YOU SO MUCH.
WE REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR GENEROSITY, BUT WE WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE IT.
I'D BE GLAD TO TALK TO HIM ABOUT IT JUST TO SEE IF WE CAN REWORK IT.
[02:55:05]
BECAUSE, WE SPECIFICALLY CALL OUT ELECTED OFFICIALS AS WELL IN THIS, AND OBVIOUSLY, WE DON'T WANT TO PUT OURSELVES ABOVE THE LAW, BUT THERE IS A CANDIDATE SIDE OF BEING AN ELECTED OFFICIAL WHERE DONATIONS ARE SOLICITED FROM VARIOUS PEOPLE ALONG THE WAY.
SEVERAL PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM HAVE DONATED TO A NUMBER OF OUR CAMPAIGNS.
HOW DO YOU DRAW THAT LINE ON THAT AS WELL.
I WON'T WANT TO FIND OURSELVES IN A POSITION WHERE EVERYONE UP HERE IS RUNNING AFOUL OF THE PERSONNEL POLICY SIMPLY BY HAVING TO RUN FOR OFFICE AND DO THAT.
HOW DOES ONE DIFFERENTIATE THAT?
>> I THINK AS FAR AS WITH THIS BEING THAT PERSONNEL MANUAL, AND WE'RE RELATING TO EMPLOYEES.
>> SHOULD WE EXCLUDE ELECTED OFFICIALS THEN FROM THAT, IF THAT'S THE CASE?
>> WE DO FALL WITHIN THAT AS AN EMPLOYEE.
>> I THINK THIS ALSO SPELLS IT OUT FOR THE EMPLOYEES THAT WE'RE ALL BEING HELD TO THE SAME STANDARD AND EXPECTATION.
I KNOW THAT THERE IS SOME OF THAT THAT IS COVERED IN THE BOARD POLICY MANUAL, AND IT'S LAID OUT VERY CLEARLY.
BUT SOMETIMES IT DOESN'T HURT TO HAVE IT IN THE EMPLOYMENT MANUAL, TOO, SO THAT EMPLOYEES SEE RIGHT THERE, THAT WE ARE ALL IN ALIGNMENT THAT WE WOULDN'T ACCEPT A GIFT OR A FAVOR.
>> IT HIT ME ALL OF A SUDDEN, IT'S LIKE, BOY, FOUR YEARS FROM NOW. [LAUGHTER] [OVERLAPPING].
>> THE TOWNSHIP IS NOT ONLY AFFECTED BY THE DECISIONS THAT WE MAKE [OVERLAPPING] LET OURSELVES IN THAT KIND OF.
IT'S ESOTERIC, BECAUSE THERE'S NOT A WHOLE LOT THAT COULD BE DONE ANYWAY, BUT I DON'T WANT TO CREATE SOMETHING THAT WE KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THE PEOPLE AT THIS TABLE ARE GOING TO RUN A FOUL OF IN TERMS OF THE CAMPAIGNS.
>> I APPRECIATE THAT. AND I THINK AS FAR AS IT RELATES TO THE EMPLOYEES, JUST TO GIVE THEM THE GUIDANCE TO SAY, THESE SCENARIOS ARE GOING TO HAPPEN, AND WE WANT TO GIVE YOU THE RIGHT LANGUAGE AND UNDERSTANDING TO JUST KNOW THAT THAT'S REALLY NICE OF PEOPLE.
>> I THINK LET'S SEE IF THE LAWYERS CAN'T TAKE ANOTHER PASS AT THIS.
SINCE THIS IS ONE THAT IS MORE THAN JUST A LANGUAGE TWEAK, PERHAPS WE CAN BRING IT UP INTO THE MEMO FOR THE LAST TIME AROUND SO WE CAN SEE WHAT THE CHANGE ENDED UP BE COMING, AND THEN THAT WAY, WE CAN TAKE A MORE DIRECTED APPROACH AT THAT PARAGRAPH SINCE THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT IS OF SOME SCRUTINY.
>> TO MAKE SURE I'M UNDERSTANDING, YOU'D LIKE ALSO TO HAVE LANGUAGE THAT IS INCLUSIVE OF BOARD MEMBERS OR BOARDS AND COMMISSIONERS GENERALLY, OR -.
>> I'D SAY RAISE IT WITH THE ATTORNEY AND SEE WHAT THEY FEEL IS.
>> I NEED TO WRITE IT BOTH WAYS, AND WE CAN DECIDE, TOO.
>> OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT? YES, TRUSTEE LANCE.
>> THE SECOND PARAGRAPH, I AM TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IF SO THE FIRST SENTENCE, WHICH IS ABOUT 2.5 LINES LONG, AND THE SECOND SENTENCE, IF I'M UNDERSTANDING THE TERMS CORRECT, DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THEY HAVE DIRECT TIES TO EACH OTHER, SO ANY FULL TIME EMPLOYEE DESIRING TO PARTICIPATE IN OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT, WRITTEN PERMISSION, AND THEN THE NEXT ONE HAS TO DO WITH PAID OR UNPAID LEAVE OF ABSENCE.
UNLESS I'M MISREADING THAT, AND I GUESS I WOULD ASK SOMEONE WHO WORK, MAYBE THE ATTORNEYS, DOES THAT FIRST SENTENCE, IS THAT ENOUGH OF A INDICATION THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE WRITTEN PERMISSION? IF SO, DOES THAT SECOND SENTENCE NEED TO BE LISTED AS A SEPARATE PARAGRAPH? BECAUSE IF THAT DEALS SPECIFICALLY WITH PAID AND UNPAID LEAVE, WHICH I GUESS I'M CURIOUS.
DOES UNPAID LEAVE JUST MEAN ME GOING LIKE, IF I WANTED TO GO WORK AS A PART TIME ICE CREAM SALESMAN OUTSIDE OF THAT, DOES THIS APPLY HERE? DO THOSE TWO SENTENCES.
>> IT CAN. I THINK IT IS A TWO PART THING.
YOU'VE GOT THIS FIRST PART THAT JUST CLARIFIES THAT IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT.
IF YOU HAD SOMETHING ONGOING, IF YOU HAVE A JOB, YOU HAVE A POSITION HERE AT THE TOWNSHIP THAT ALLOWS YOU TO HAVE SAY, YOU GOT A LAWN MOWING SERVICE OR SOMETHING, THAT IT ACKNOWLEDGES THAT PLEASE LET US KNOW ABOUT THAT BECAUSE IT'S RELEVANT TO OUR WORK, AND WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE KEEPING THEM SEPARATE, AND WORKERS' COMP BENEFITS,
[03:00:01]
ALL THINGS LIKE THAT.>> JUST ONE OTHER THING AND MAYBE YOU BE ABLE TO ANSWER THIS.
ANY FULL TIME EMPLOYEE, DOES THAT NOT INCLUDE SEASONAL FULL TIME EMPLOYEES? I'M THINKING ABOUT.
>> NO SEASONAL FULL TIME, I DON'T THINK.
>> IT SAY SEASONAL ELSEWHERE IN HERE, IT SAYS SEASONAL EMPLOYEES DO NOT GETTING BENEFITS.
>> I WASN'T SURE IF WE HAVE SEASONAL FOLKS WHO WORK FULL TIME?
>> YEAH. THEY'RE JUST TEMPORARY AND THEY'RE SEASONAL.
THEY COME IN AND THEY'RE DOING A SERVICE FOR US OVER THE SUMMER OR MAYBE PARK RANGER.
>> I WAS WONDERING IF BECAUSE FULL TIME IS WRITTEN HERE.
THEY ARE SEASONAL ABOVE FULL TIME, BUT THEY ARE FULL TIME IF THAT CREATED A STICKY ISSUE.
>> ARE YOU ASKING TO CLARIFY THAT IT'S PERMANENT PART TIME OR PERMANENT?
>> [OVERLAPPING] I DON'T THINK IT WOULD EVER COME UP, BUT, LIKE, A SEASONAL EMPLOYEE WHO DOES WORK FULL TIME, AND THEN DURING THE WINTER GOES AND DOES SOMETHING ELSE, MAYBE TECHNICALLY IN VIOLATION OF THIS.
>> YOU GOT TO LOOK AT THE SECTION YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT PAID OR UNPAID LEAVE? THAT APPLIES TO SOMEONE WHO'S ON A DISABILITY WORK PAYING INSURANCE BENEFITS FOR THEM UNDER FMLA OR A LEAVE POLICY.
IF THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE UNABLE TO WORK, WE'RE SAYING YOU CAN'T WORK IF WE'RE CONTINUING YOUR BENEFITS BECAUSE YOU'RE UNABLE TO WORK.
IT'S NOT THE UNPAID OR UNPAID.
IT JUST HAS WHERE THEY ARE IN SICK LEAVE AND ALL THAT.
>> I UNDERSTAND. I WOULD STILL SAY THAT THOSE TWO SENTENCES NOT SEEMING TO NEED TO BE TIED TOGETHER.
IT MIGHT MAKE SENSE TO SEPARATE THEM MORE?
>> I THINK THEY DO BELONG TOGETHER BECAUSE THE FIRST SENTENCE IS ABOUT BEFORE YOU GET THAT EXTERIOR OR OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT.
NOW YOU'RE AN EMPLOYEE, AND AS A TOWNSHIP EMPLOYEE, YOU SHALL NOT BE ALLOWED TO ENGAGE AND WORK DURING A SPECIFIC TIME PERIOD OFF.
>> BASICALLY, IF I'M A FULL TIME EMPLOYEE, NOT THE DISABILITY ARGUMENT, BUT IF I HAVE THREE MONTHS OF TIME OFF AND I SAY, I'M TAKING THE SUMMER OFF, WOULD HAVE TO TELL EVERYONE BEFORE I GO TEACH SURFING LESSONS ON THE BEACHES OF MAUI, ESSENTIALLY.
>> IF YOU LEFT ON THE ASSUMPTION THAT YOU WOULD BE RETURNING TO EMPLOYMENT AS OPPOSED TO RESIGNING AND COMING BACK?
>> THE CLASSES DON'T EVER LAST SO LONG.
MAYBE YOU WILL, MAYBE YOU WON'T.
>> OKAY. THAT'S THE INTENT, IS THAT YOU CAN'T USE YOUR TIME OFF AND THEN WORK ANOTHER JOB OR BEYOND DISABILITY AND WORK OTHER JOB?
>> ANYTHING ELSE IN THE OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT?
>> HAD SOME FUN IN THAT SECTION.
ATTENDANCE AND PUNCTUALITY, PLEASE BE ON TIME.
>> I LOVE SECTIONS LIKE THIS TO WHERE YOU'RE SPECIFYING CLOTHING.
BUT AT THE VERY END PARAGRAPH ON PAGE 30, THE TOWNSHIP PERMITS EMPLOYEES TO WEAR JEWELRY OR DISPLAY TATTOOS.
I WOULD CONTEND THAT YOU ALSO NEED TO ADD BODY PIERCINGS.
>> UNLESS THAT FALLS ON THE JEWELRY.
IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU PUT IN IT.
[BACKGROUND] I THINK YOU SHOULD BECAUSE THERE'S SOME REALLY INTERESTING STUFF OUT THERE IN BODY PIERCINGS LATELY.
>> IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE THAT SPECIFIC, JUST SAY JEWELRY AND TATTOOS.
>> THAT'S IN SEVERAL PLACES IN THAT PARAGRAPH.
>> ANY OTHER THOUGHTS ON THIS SECTION? OKAY. YES.
>> DO YOU KNOW WHERE THE LIST OF UNPROFESSIONAL ATTIRE, LIKE, WHERE THOSE EXAMPLES CAME FROM?
>> THANK YOU. I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO BRING IT UP. THANK YOU.
>> WELL, SOME OF IT JUST WE'VE HAD IT IN PRIOR LANGUAGE, BUT THEN WE ALSO, AGAIN, WITH OUR POLICY REVIEW COMMITTEE, WE HAD TALKED IT THOUGH AND THEN WE HAD TALKED IT OVER YET AGAIN WITH COUNSEL.
[03:05:01]
THOSE ARE THINGS WHERE WE HAVE LANDED, EVEN AS OF OUR LAST VISIT WITH CHAD AND LIZZIE AT FAHEY SCHULTZ.>> BUT I THINK YOUR POINT IS, ANGELA, HOW DO YOU TELL THE EMPLOYEES? WHEN I WORKED AT A PARTICULAR PLACE, WE DID A LITTLE BROCHURE OF INAPPROPRIATE CLOTHING AND JUST GOT IT OUT TO EVERYBODY SO THEY KNEW EXACTLY WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT.
>> IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE MENTIONING?
THAT IS HELPFUL TO PROVIDE FOR EMPLOYEES.
MY CONCERN IS I JUST WANTED TO UNDERSTAND WHERE WE GOT THESE EXAMPLES FROM BECAUSE PRIMARILY WHAT'S ON THIS LIST IS TARGETING, I WOULD SAY, A FEMALE DEMOGRAPHIC OF PEOPLE.
THAT'S SOMETHING TO BE CONCERNED WITH.
>> YEAH. CERTAINLY SWEAT PANTS ARE NOT GENDER-SPECIFIC?
>> BUT I AGREE THAT IN LOOKING AT THIS, IT FELT LIKE A VERY TARGETED LIST DIRECTED AT WOMEN.
>> SO ARE WE SAYING, JUST TO CLARIFY, INSTEAD OF SAYING LEGGING, SAYING TIGHT ELASTIC PANTS AND JUST LUMP IT IN SO THAT WE'RE NOT SAYING SPECIFICALLY YOGA PANTS OR LEGGINGS, JUST DESCRIBING WHAT THAT MEANS.
>> I WOULD SAY AS THE ATTORNEY.
>> YEAH, BUT I WOULD SAY THAT BECAUSE THERE ARE PROFESSIONAL LEGGINGS OUT THERE.
THAT'S JUST FROM A FASHION PERSPECTIVE, BUT FROM TECHNICALITY, I WOULD ASK THE ATTORNEYS WHAT TO SPECIFICALLY USE.
>> OKAY. I THINK WE DID GO BACK OVER THIS, SO I'M HAPPY TO SEE IF WE CAN GET SOME MAYBE MODERNIZED LANGUAGE.
IS THAT WHAT WE'RE GETTING AT?
>> YEAH. MAYBE CLOTHING THAT MALES CUSTOMARILY WEAR THAT WOULD BE INAPPROPRIATE TOO.
I DON'T SEEM TO MAKE THIS FIRST.
>> I THINK IF WE CAN FIND A WAY TO IF NOT REMOVE THE GENDER-SPECIFIC CLOTHING, THEN AT LEAST PROVIDE A LITTLE MORE BALANCE SO THAT IT'S NOT ALL AS ONE SIDED AS IT CURRENTLY FEELS.
>> YEAH. OKAY. THAT'S GREAT INPUT. I THANK YOU.
>> WE'VE ALSO LET OUR EMPLOYEES BE QUITE CASUAL HERE.
THIS IS A CHALLENGE JUST GENERALLY BECAUSE THEY NOW SEE THAT AS A BENEFIT.
WE LOWERED THE BAR, AND THAT'S AN ACCEPTED BAR NOW THAT'S LOWER.
WE ALSO NEED TO THINK ABOUT WHAT DOES THIS MEAN GOING FORWARD IN TERMS OF ENFORCEMENT.
>> YEAH. I EXPECT THAT PEOPLE AREN'T WALKING AROUND IN PAJAMAS. PAJAMAS ARE ABSOLUTELY [OVERLAPPING].
>> THEY'RE NOT LISTED. [LAUGHTER] BUT THERE'S A PERFECT GENDERLESS THING TO SAY.
>> NICE CLOTHES. [LAUGHTER] [BACKGROUND]
>> I THINK MY WORRY IS IF WE KEEP HAVING EXAMPLES, YOU CAN FIND A BUNCH OF THINGS TO ADD TO THIS LIST.
FINDING THE BEST LANGUAGE TO INCLUDE ALL OF THE UNACCEPTED CLOTHING GUIDELINES, I THINK THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL.
>> GET AS SPECIFIC AS POSSIBLE, LIKE, GETTING INTO FLIP FLOPS AND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS.
>> THAT SHOULD BE ON THE LIST.
>> I MIGHT NOT BE LETTING THEM GO ANYMORE.
>> MY QUESTION ABOUT SPECIFICALLY WOULD BE WITH THE PARK STAFF, LIKE FLIP FLOPS AND SHORTS ARE SPECIFICALLY LISTED HERE.
>> IT DOES SAY MUST BE APPROPRIATE TO THE TYPE OF WORK BEING PERFORMED.
>> SO GENERALLY, DEPARTMENTS HAVE SPECIFIC POLICIES RELATED TO THAT.
FOR INSTANCE, IN THE INSPECTORS IN THE SUMMER, IF IT REACHES A CERTAIN TEMPERATURE OUT, THEY'RE ALLOWED TO WEAR SHORTS, ETC.
OBVIOUSLY, IF YOU'RE IN A DANGEROUS WORK ENVIRONMENT, YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE APPROPRIATE FOOT GEAR, LONG PANTS.
THERE ARE GOING TO BE SPECIFIC DEPARTMENTAL REQUIREMENTS THAT WILL [OVERLAPPING] ESPECIALLY FOR SAFETY AND LIKE EXTREME WEATHER.
>> YEAH. IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT SUPERSEDES THE SPECIFICALLY LISTING SHORTS FOR PARK STAFF WITH MY EXAMPLE, LIKE THAT'S FINE.
I JUST WOULDN'T WANT THE SEASONAL FULL TIME STAFF MEMBER WHO WORKS AT ICE CREAM SHOP NOT BEING ABLE TO WEAR SHORTS WHEN HE DOES WORK FOR US.
>> WE DO HAVE THIS CASUAL FRIDAY ATTIRE THAT APPLIES FROM MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY.
IT APPLIES TO ANGELA'S STAFF AND MEETS THE PUBLIC, MY STAFF AND UB STAFF, IN PARTICULAR, WE SEE 90% OF PEOPLE THAT COME INTO THE BUILDING.
WE SHOULD PROBABLY TRY AND DEFINE WHAT THAT IS.
HAVE WE EVER PUT IT IN RADAR? I DON'T THINK WE HAVE.
[03:10:04]
>> NOT BEYOND WHAT'S BEEN IN THE POLICY TO DATE, SO WHICH IS A LOT OF THE SAME LANGUAGE THAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE.
>> IT MIGHT BE EASIER TO DEFINE WHAT IS APPROPRIATE BEHAVIOR IF I HAVE A LIST OF WHAT WAS INAPPROPRIATE.
>> RIGHT. THAT MIGHT BE EASIER.
I WOULD SAY I'D BE HESITANT TO WANT TO INCLUDE A POLICY RESTRICTING BUSINESS CASUAL OR EVEN CASUAL ATTIRE THAT HAS BEEN VIEWED AS THE NORM HERE IN THE TOWNSHIP, BUT I'M NOT OPPOSED TO IT.
I JUST DON'T SEE A NEED FOR THAT IN HERE.
I THINK WE SHOULD FOCUS MORE ON WHAT IS VIEWED AS UNPROFESSIONAL AND UNACCEPTABLE.
>> RIGHT. EVEN AS DONNA IT GETS INTO THE SPECIFICS AND POLITICAL MESSAGES AND ENDORSEMENTS, LIKE THOSE ARE THINGS THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO BE CONFUSED ABOUT.
COULD I PUT THIS ON AND WEAR THIS TO WORK TODAY, AND MAYBE AND I DEFINITELY HEARING WHAT YOU'RE ALL SAYING.
IF WE CAN GET MORE MODERNIZED LANGUAGE, PERHAPS, GET A LITTLE INTO A LITTLE BALANCED GENDER-NEUTRAL TYPE LANGUAGE AND THE PAJAMAS, PROBABLY A REALLY GOOD IDEA.
[LAUGHTER] WHAT WE ALL WEAR OUT OF THE WORLD OR SOME FOLKS WEAR OUT OF THE WORLD RIGHT NOW, THAT'S A GREAT IDEA, TOO.
>> OKAY. WE'LL SEE SOME UPDATED LANGUAGE NEXT TIME.
>> THANK YOU. ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATION AND INTERNET USE.
NOT A WHOLE LOT OF CHANGES HERE, BUT TRUSTEE WILSON.
>> AT THE BOTTOM OF PAGE 31, THE VERY LAST STATEMENT, INTERNAL AND EXTERNAL EMAILS ARE PUBLIC RECORDS.
AREN'T TEXTS ALSO PUBLIC RECORDS? I THINK WE HAVE TO ADD THE WORD, TEXTS, T-E-X-T-S.
>> WELL, IT MAY DEPEND ON WHAT DEVICE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
>> IF YOU USE YOUR PHONE FOR ANY BUSINESS WORK.
>> YEAH, LIKE A TOWNSHIP PHONE?
>> IF YOU USE IT FOR BUSINESS USE, IT'S AVAILABLE UNDER FOIA.
>> IT IS WELL, BUT I THINK WE CAN HAVE [OVERLAPPING]
YOU CAN GO THROUGH IT AND CUT OUT WHAT ISN'T APPROPRIATE, BUT IT IS AVAILABLE UNDER FOIA.
>> I JUST KNOW THAT THAT'S THE PREFERRED METHOD OF COMMUNICATION FOR PROBABLY EVERYBODY SITTING HERE AND IT IS SUBJECT TO FOIA.
>> WELL, I'M WONDERING, THOUGH, I THINK WHERE WE'VE GOTTEN INTO THIS IS THE CLARIFICATION PART.
TEXT IN GENERAL, AND THEN HOW TO DESCRIBE WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BECAUSE NOT EVERY PERSON'S TEXT IS GOING TO APPLY.
>> BUT IT CAN BE SOMETHING THAT HAS TO BE SEARCHED UNDER FOIA TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT IS DISCOVERED.
>> RIGHT. TIED TO TOWNSHIP. POINT TAKEN.
>> YEAH. JUST ADDING ON TO THAT, ANYTHING THAT IS SUBJECT TO FOIA, I THINK THAT SHOULD BE CLARIFIED HERE, EVEN IF IT CAN BE CONFUSING, WE DO HAVE A PLACE TO REFERENCE FOIA GUIDELINES.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL FOR TOWNSHIP EMPLOYEES AND EVERYONE.
>> YEAH. I DO BELIEVE WE REFERRED TO IT IN OUR IT POLICY, BUT I THINK WE'LL NEED TO CROSS CHECK THAT.
>> IF WE DO, MAYBE IT CAN BE ITS OWN PARAGRAPH, SO WE CAN BE A LITTLE MORE CIRCUMSPECT INSTEAD OF SAYING OUR PUBLIC RECORDS, MAYBE PUBLIC RECORDS.
>> MAY BE SUBJECT TO FOIA IN A SEPARATE PARAGRAPH BELOW THE ONE IN QUESTION.
>> WELL, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD IDEA TOO TO EMPHASIZE PEOPLE TO BE MINDFUL OF WHAT THEY'RE SENDING.
SEEING NONE, PAGE 32, RIGHT TO MONITOR.
WE'VE ELIMINATED THE INSPECTION.
THAT'S JUST BECAUSE WE COVERED IT WITH RIGHT TO MONITOR, ESSENTIALLY.
>> NO, HOW COMES IT'S [OVERLAPPING]
PAGE 32 AT THE BOTTOM, SOLICITATION, DISTRIBUTION, AND POSTING OF MATERIALS.
THAT'S FINE. EMPLOYEE TRAVEL AND REIMBURSEMENT ON PAGE 33.
[03:15:01]
SOLICITATION, AFTER THE FIRST PARAGRAPH, THAT EXCEPT FOR PROTECTED LABOR RELATIONS ACTIVITY STANDS OUT THERE. WHERE DOES THAT BELONG?>> MAYBE YOU PUT A COLON THERE.
>> IS THAT MEANT TO BE THE HEADING FOR THE AREA?
>> I THINK IT'S THE HEADER FOR THIS LIST, SO MAYBE A COLON AFTER ACTIVITY.
>> IF YOU MOVE IT OVER WHERE PROVISIONS IS.
>> YEAH. THAT DOESN'T FALL OUT OF THE STRIKEOUTS.
>> OKAY. EMPLOYEE TRAVEL AND REIMBURSEMENT? HEY, THIS IS GREAT BECAUSE THIS LETS ME POINT OUT THAT THE APPLICABLE IRS MILEAGE REIMBURSEMENT AMOUNT IS RIGHT HERE IN THE PERSONNEL POLICY.
WE DON'T HAVE TO APPROVE THAT EVERY YEAR.
>> WE'VE DONE THAT EVERY YEAR SINCE I JOINED.
EVERY YEAR, I ASKED, WHY CAN'T WE JUST MAKE IT POLICY? TURNS OUT IT ALREADY WAS.
FABULOUS. USE OF TOWNSHIP EQUIPMENT.
THAT'S ABOUT AS STRAIGHTFORWARD AS YOU GET.
TOWNSHIP VEHICLES, DON'T SEE ANY CHANGES IN THERE ACTUALLY, SO WE CONTINUE ON.
WE'RE STRIKING THE ENERGY EFFICIENT WORKPLACE. WHY DID YOU DO THAT?
>> I THINK THAT IN THE LAST DISCUSSION THAT WE HAD AS A TEAM, INCLUDING COUNSEL, THAT SOME OF THIS IT'S AN EXPECTATION.
IT'S IMPLIED, IT'S HOW WE OPERATE.
IT'S WHAT WE DO. IF WE'RE NOT DOING THESE THINGS, WE'RE DOING IT WRONG.
[LAUGHTER] SOME OF THESE THINGS ALSO, RELATING TO THE COMPUTERS, WE PROBABLY NEED TO WORK ON THAT FROM THE CYBERSECURITY ANGLE AS WELL, MAKING SURE THAT YOUR STUFF IS SHUT DOWN AND ACCESSIBLE.
>> I GUESS IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO BE AN EXPECTATION, WHY WOULDN'T WE INCLUDE IT IN THE MANUAL, I GUESS WOULD BE MY QUESTION.
>> PART OF THIS TOO IS YOU LARGELY HAVE SECTIONS HERE, LANGUAGE THAT'S SOMEWHAT ENFORCEABLE.
THIS IS JUST ONE OF THOSE AREAS THAT, MY EMPLOYEE DOESN'T TURN OFF THEIR LIGHT EVERY NIGHT, THAT'S A VIOLATION OF A POLICY, SO WHAT DO I DO WITH THAT?
>> YOU FORGET THE ELECTRIC PENCIL SHARPENER.
>> YEAH, IT'S THE GOOD HABIT VERSUS A MORE EXPLICIT.
IT JUST GETS A LITTLE AWKWARD.
>> EMPLOYEES ARE EXPECTED TO USE SPELL CHECKER BEFORE THEY SEND AN EMAIL.
>> YOU MEAN WE CAN'T WE CAN'T ENFORCE THAT? [LAUGHTER] OKAY. FAIR ENOUGH.
>> YOU CAN ENFORCE IT, BUT ARE YOU GOING TO FIRE SOMEONE FOR FAILING TO USE SPELL CHECK?
IN ONE PARTICULAR CASE, AN EMAIL, I'LL TELL YOU HIS NAME.
[LAUGHTER] LEAVE OF ABSENCES, TIME OFF, HOLIDAY PAY.
TERRIFIC. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON HOLIDAYS?
>> NO, PLEASE. I JUST WANTED TO BRING UP THEN.
>> I THINK IT WAS THE LAST SENTENCE AFTER THE LIST AND THE ONE SENTENCE.
THERE'S A PARAGRAPH THAT SAYS, TO QUALIFY FOR HOLIDAY PAY.
THE VERY LAST SENTENCE OF THAT ENDS WITH EXCEPT THAT HOLIDAY PAY WILL NOT BE PAID TO AN EMPLOYEE WHO IS ON LEAVE OF ABSENCE OF ONE WEEK OR MORE DURING WHICH THE HOLIDAY FALLS.
>> I HAD A NOTE IN HERE AS WELL TO SAY UNPAID LEAVE.
>> I THINK IT WASN'T CLEAR TO ME.
>> ANYTHING ELSE IN THAT AREA? MR. DEMPSEY?
>> WE HAD THIS ISSUE RECENTLY WITH GOOD FRIDAY HOLIDAY AND ALL OF THE HOLIDAYS WITH THE EXCEPTION OF GOOD FRIDAY AND THEN CHRISTMAS EVE AND CHRISTMAS DAY ARE CIVIL HOLIDAYS, BASICALLY.
THERE WAS SOME THOUGHT THAT BECAUSE OF RESPECTING OTHER FAITHS, OTHER BELIEF SYSTEMS, DO WE RENAME GOOD FRIDAY TO SPRING BREAK HOLIDAY OR SOMETHING ELSE? THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION AT THE M-TEAM.
I DON'T KNOW THAT WE DELVE INTO IT DEEP ENOUGH TO REACH CONSENSUS, BUT I DIDN'T KNOW IF WE JUST WANT TO LEAVE THIS BIT FOR NOW AND COME BACK TO IT ANOTHER TIME, BUT THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT WE DID HAVE SOME CONVERSATIONS AROUND.
>> ALWAYS TIES TO EASTER, DOESN'T IT?
>> YES. BECAUSE THAT'S A MOVING DAY.
>> THE PASSOVER IS A MOVING DAY, TOO, SO I DON'T THINK YOU CAN CHANGE THAT.
>> UNFORTUNATELY, A VESTIGE OF FAITH-BASED HOLIDAYS.
>> YEAH. AGAIN, IF IT THERE'S NOT A BIG, WE CAN LEAVE A VIEW. THAT'S FINE.
[03:20:03]
>> I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S A SOLUTION THAT ALLOWS YOU TO MOVE THE HOLIDAY AND ALSO.
>> YEAH. WHAT WOULD YOU RENAME IT? TWO DAYS BEFORE EASTER? [LAUGHTER]
>> [LAUGHTER] NO. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT.
>> ISN'T IT IN THE UNION CONTRACTS SPECIFICALLY SAY GOOD FRIDAY? I THINK THAT WOULD RUN INTO SOME ISSUES IF WE CHANGE IT HERE.
>> WELL, IF ANYONE HAS ANY BRILLIANT STROKES OF GENIUS ON HOW WE CAN [LAUGHTER] RENAME THOSE IN SUCH A WAY THAT MAKES SENSE, LET US KNOW.
>> OR MAYBE MAKE IT A FLOATING FOUR HOURS HOLIDAY, BUT THAT'S DOWN THE ROAD.
[LAUGHTER] WE CAN LOOK AT THAT.
>> [OVERLAPPING] YOU WANT TO CORRECT THE ANSWERING?
>> NAMES OF MANAGERS EVERYWHERE. [OVERLAPPING].
>> WELL AND THERE ARE OTHER PIECES PARTS TO TALK ABOUT WHY, EVEN WITH ESTHER AND SOME OF THOSE IMPLICATIONS.
MAYBE THAT'S FOR DOWN THE ROAD A LITTLE BIT.
>> VACATION. MOST OF THIS IS GOING TO BE COVERED IN THE UNION CONTRACT, BUT ANYWAY PERSONAL LEAVE.
THIS IS THE UPDATED TEXT FROM ESTHER, RIGHT?
SO WE'RE GOING TO FLOW RIGHT THROUGH THIS POP STAND OR MAYBE NOT.
>> SORRY. VACATION BENEFIT SCHEDULE.
CAN THEY ACCRUE AND USE IT THE FOLLOWING YEAR?
>> DO WE WANT TO SAY THAT IT'S ROLLING? IT CAN BE ROLLED OVER INTO THE NEXT YEAR?
>> I GUESS I ASSUMED THAT WAS THE POINT.
[NOISE] BEREAVEMENT LEAVE, NOTHING. JURY DUTY.
I'VE NEVER SEEN A JURY DUTY POLICY I LIKE.
I HATE THEM ALL. [LAUGHTER] ELECTION LEAVE.
THIS WAS ACTUALLY THE SUBJECT OF SOME DEBATE.
[NOISE] DID WE END UP COMING TO A DECISION, BECAUSE I BELIEVE WE ALLOWED PEOPLE TO DO THIS PAID.
DID WE NOT IN PREVIOUS ELECTIONS?
>> I THINK THIS IS TALKING AT AN EXTERNAL.
>>[OVERLAPPING] [INAUDIBLE] IN FACT, THE MANAGER AND I HAD A CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT RECENTLY TOO, JUST HOW TO INCENTIVIZE AND ACKNOWLEDGE WHEN AN EMPLOYEE VOLUNTEERS AND SERVES IN OUR ELECTIONS.
>> WE'LL LEAVE THE INTERNAL STUFF OFF THEN.
>> THEY HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT WERE INTERNAL THAT WORKED THE ELECTIONS.
>> NO, THEY'RE SAYING THIS POLICY IS EXCLUSIVELY TO OTHER COMMUNITIES. IT DOESN'T READ THAT WAY.
>> IT WOULD. WE NEED TO MAKE IT MORE EXPLICIT.
>> HOW IS THIS DIFFERENT FROM OTHER LEAVE TIME? RECALL ELECTION LEAVE, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE ANY LEAVE TIME THEY HAVE TO GIVE US NOTICE FOR IT.
WHAT'S THE BENEFIT OF KNOWING THEY'RE GOING TO WORK AN ELECTION COMPARED TO JUST TAKING [OVERLAPPING] TAKING A DAY OFF.
I DON'T REALLY SEE THE POINT IN THIS.
>> WELL, I THINK BECAUSE IT HAS COME UP ENOUGH THAT IT'S BEEN A QUESTION.
MAYBE I THINK IF YOU'RE SAYING THAT AS IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO BE A SEPARATE LAYOUT, THAT IT COULD BE INCLUDED UNDER PERSONAL OR VACATION.
[OVERLAPPING] BECAUSE YOU CAN SAY THAT WAY IF THEY WANTED TO SERVE IN ANOTHER VOTING LOCATION. WE CAN LOOK AT THAT.
>> YOU'RE SAYING MAYBE INSTEAD OF STRIKING IT, [NOISE] FINDING A PLACE WITHIN THE VACATION SECTION TO COVER THAT INSTEAD?
>> ONLY JUST TO ACKNOWLEDGE IT, BECAUSE IT HAPPENS.
IT COMES UP AND IT'S A QUESTION.[OVERLAPPING] IT'S NICE TO HAVE SOME REASONABLE EXPECTATION.
>> I HAD A QUESTION ABOUT ELECTION LEAVE.
THAT LAST SENTENCE, TIME ENGAGED AS AN ELECTION OFFICIAL SHOULD BE REPORTED FOR TIME KEEPING RECORDS.
WAS THERE A REASON WHY THAT WAS SPECIFIC FOR BEING AN ELECTION OFFICIAL, THAT WE NEED TO KNOW THAT THEY WERE AN ELECTION OFFICIAL?
>> IS THERE A SEPARATE CODING IF I IF I GO WORK IN THE CITY OF LANSING FOR A DATE IN SERVICE?
THAT'S JUST YOU'RE USING YOUR TIME TO GO.
>> I GUESS PRACTICALLY IF I'M AN EMPLOYEE AND I WANT TO DO THIS, I'M JUST TAKING A VACATION DAY AS I WOULD, ANY OTHER WAY, ANY OTHER USE?
>> AND I'M REPORTING IT ON MY TIME CARD AS TIME OFF.
[03:25:05]
THAT DOESN'T FEEL NECESSARY TO INCLUDE EITHER IF IT'S THE SAME PROCESS THAT THE TIME WASN'T USED?>> WE'LL JUST HAVE TO CIRCLE BACK ON THE WORKING IN HOUSE.
NOT A WHOLE LOT OF CHANGES THERE, EXCEPT WE HAD SOME INTERESTING REFERENCES TO COMPANY NOT TOWNSHIP. THAT'S FUN.
[LAUGHTER] IT'S NICE TO BORROW FROM YOUR FRIENDS.
LACTATION AND BREASTFEEDING, NOTHING CHANGED.
THEN THE NEXT 2.5 PAGES ARE PAID PARENTAL LEAVE POLICY WITH OBVIOUSLY THIS BROAD CAST RECENTLY.
ANY ISSUES WITH THAT OR CHANGES YOU WANT TO SEE THERE?
>> SORRY. I DID HAVE AND I'M STILL CATCHING THEM UP.
I HAD SOME INPUT THAT SUGGESTED THAT WE MOVE UNDER LACTATION BREASTFEEDING TO PUT THEIR CHILD TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THEM.
>> YES, [INAUDIBLE] FOR THE PAID PARENTAL LEAVE.
>> I'M SORRY IF I'M NOT SEEING IT, BUT I READ THROUGH IT TWICE AND ARE EMPLOYEES ALLOWED TO ADD EARNED VACATION TIME ON TO THE END OF THEIR PAID PARENTAL LEAVE?
>> THEY'RE STILL ELIGIBLE FOR THE FMLA.
THE 12 WEEKS FMLA IS APPLICABLE AND IT RUNS CONCURRENTLY WITH THIS PAID PARENTAL.
UNDER OUR FMLA, IF THEY WERE TO EXTEND BEYOND THIS FOUR WEEKS, THEY WOULD HAVE TO USE SICK LEAVE IF THAT HAS TO BE USED FIRST. [OVERLAPPING]
>> THEY HAVE THAT OPTION. THEY HAVE TO.
>> VACATION IF THEY EXHAUST SICK.
>> I JUST WANT TO JUMP BACK A LITTLE BIT TO THE LACTATION AND JUST IT WAS MANY YEARS AGO.
IT WAS TWO PARTS BECAUSE WHEN I STARTED MY JOB WITH THE STATE, I LITERALLY HAD TO GO INTO A BATHROOM.
>> WE'VE HAD FOLKS WHO'VE HAD THAT.
>> THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF IS 20 MINUTES MIGHT NOT BE ENOUGH TIME.
IF A WOMAN IS BREASTFEEDING AND SHE NEEDS TO COME, IT MIGHT BE MORE LIKE 30 MINUTES.
THEN THAT'S ALL I'M BRINGING UP.
>> I THINK THAT WAS DOUBLE STANDARD THAT WAS PULLED FROM OTHER POLICIES THAT I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO CHECK ON THAT AND SEE IF WE WOULD WANT TO OFFER THAT EXTRA TIME, A LOT OF TIME.
>> FOR ME IT WAS AND I DID JUST DO 30 MINUTES WHEN I ULTIMATELY, BUT 30 MINUTES IS WHAT I NEEDED TO EXPLORE.
>> INTERESTINGLY, NOWADAYS WE CAN ACTUALLY WORK WHILE WE'RE TAKING CARE OF THAT BUSINESS.
>> BY MAKING THE PUMPS MORE EFFICIENT. I DON'T KNOW.
>> WE'LL CHECK ON THAT. THANK YOU.
>> ANYTHING ELSE ON THE PAID PARENTAL LEAVE? I THINK WE DID TALK ABOUT REVISITING THIS AT SOME POINT A YEAR AFTER WE ADOPTED IT.
THAT'S GOING TO COME UP AT SOME POINT HERE, BUT THAT'S NOT TONIGHT.
THAT BRINGS US TO THE END OF PAGE 41 WHICH IS THE END OF THE SECTION THAT WE SAID WE WERE GOING TO LOOK AT TODAY.
THEN OUR INTENT IS TO BRING THIS UP ONE MORE TIME NEXT MEETING AND GET THROUGH THE THIRD AND FINAL SECTION.
>> THAT'S CORRECT. THEN OUR PLAN WOULD BE TO TAKE ALL THE SUGGESTED EDITS THROUGH THOSE INCORPORATED, PROVIDE YOU BACK WITH ALL THESE DOCUMENT THAT HAS EVERY CHANGES.
WE DID HAVE OUR COMMUNICATIONS TEAM WENT THROUGH TO CATCH THEIR REFERENCE, WAS ONE OF THOSE.
WE HAD SEVERAL OTHERS LIKE THAT, THAT HAVE BEEN INCORPORATED.
THEN WE'VE ALSO HAD STAFF WHO HAVE BEEN APPROACHING US AS THIS IS BEING DISCUSSED WITH SOME OTHER THINGS.
MYSELF FROM THE HUMAN RESOURCES DIRECTOR, THANK YOU.
WE'LL WORK WITH OUR ATTORNEYS TO REVIEW SOME OF THOSE TWO, SO THERE MIGHT BE A FEW OTHER CHANGES BASED ON.
AGAIN, EMPLOYEE FEEDBACK THAT WE'RE GETTING.
A PLAN WOULD BE TO PRESENT THAT FINAL ONE AFTERWARDS FOR ULTIMATE APPROVAL.
>> THAT'LL BE OUR FIRST MEETING IN MAY, WE THINK?
>> PROBABLY SECOND MEETING TO GIVE US ENOUGH TIME TO INCORPORATE ALL THE CHANGES AND ADD A NICE CLEAN DOCUMENT WITH APPROPRIATE HEADINGS THAT MATCH PAGE NUMBERS AND GO THROUGH THAT.
ESPECIALLY GIVEN THE DECISION TIMELINE ON THE SENIOR COMMUNITY CENTER 2.
>> WHAT DO YOU THINK WE'RE GOING TO BE BUSY?
[03:30:01]
>> THANK YOU. THANK YOU, DIRECTOR TDA.
WE APPRECIATE THE GUIDED TOUR.
>> NICE QUADRA. THANKS FOR YOUR HELP.
[13.C. Brownfield Policy Updates- Housing TIF Incentives]
WE HAVE BROWNFIELD POLICY UPDATES HOUSING TIF INCENTIVES.DIRECTOR CLARK HAS BEEN EXCEEDING PATIENT. [OVERLAPPING].
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SOMEONE HAD TO BE LAST.
WITH THE DIRECTION FROM THE TOWNSHIP BOARD AT OUR MARCH MEETING REGARDING THE POTENTIAL FOR HOUSING ELIGIBILITY THROUGH THE BROWNFIELD PLAN, WE PRESENTED A DRAFT POLICY THAT IS INCLUDED IN TONIGHT'S PACKET TO THE BROWNFIELD REDEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY AT THEIR MARCH MEETING.
MOVING OVER MUCH OF THE DETAILS, BUT THE BROWNFIELD REDEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY WOULD LIKE THE BOARD TO START WEIGHING IN ON MUCH OF THOSE CHANGES BEFORE THEY GET TOO FAR DOWN THE ROAD.
THEY WERE IN GENERAL IN APPROVAL OF THE FOUNDATIONAL CHANGES TO THE PROPOSED POLICY PLAN.
IN THE PACKET IT IS OUR CURRENT APPROVED HIGH LEVEL POLICY AND PROCEDURES FOR ANY DEVELOPER TO ACCESS THE INCENTIVES OF THE BROWNFIELD PROGRAM IN MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP.
IT JUST PRESENTS WHAT A DEVELOPER HAS TO DO.
WHAT IS THE ELIGIBLE ACTIVITY, THE DEFINITIONS.
IN THE PROPOSED CHANGES WE'VE UPDATED THE ELIGIBLE ACTIVITY DEFINITIONS AND ADDED IN TWO SEPARATE SECTIONS.
4C FOCUSES ON MULTIFAMILY OR FOR RENT PROPERTIES AND WHAT THOSE REQUIREMENTS ARE TO ACHIEVE APPROVAL FOR THAT INCENTIVE.
THEN 4D IS FOR FOUR SALE DWELLINGS AND WHAT A DEVELOPER MUST DO IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE THAT LEVEL OF INCENTIVES.
WE'VE UPDATED SOME ADDITIONAL THINGS LIKE THE APPLICATION AND THEN THAT FEES POTENTIALLY FOR THE REVIEW, AND CONTINUED ADMINISTRATION OF THE PLAN.
MUCH OF THE REQUIRED REPORTING FALLS TO THE DEVELOPER AS FAR AS THE POLICY IS CONCERNED, BUT THERE ARE SOME ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO DO.
WE ALREADY HAVE A REQUIREMENT FOR THE CONTRIBUTION TO THE REVOLVING LOAN FUND FOR THE BROWNFIELDS THAT STAYS THE SAME, BUT THE PERCENT OF THE PROJECT COST, THAT MAY BE A FEE ASSOCIATED THAT THE TOWNSHIP BOARD MAY WANT TO CHANGE.
THE PROPOSED CHANGES ARE JUST SPECIFICALLY BETWEEN 4C TO INCLUDE MULTIFAMILY FOR RENT PROPERTIES AT OR BELOW 120% AREA MEDIAN INCOME.
ALL OF THE REQUIREMENTS TO DETERMINE THE BUT FOR THE RUBINO WITHOUT THIS INCENTIVE, THE PROJECT WILL NOT COME STAYS THE SAME.
THE PROCESS FOR REIMBURSEMENT, THE PROCESS FOR ADDED INTEREST, THOSE ALL STAY THE SAME.
WE'RE PRESENTING THESE PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE BOARD TONIGHT FOR YOUR INPUT, FOR YOUR ADDITIONAL CHANGES, YOUR QUESTIONS, AND HOPEFULLY ADOPTION.
THAT WAY WE CAN CREATE AN APPLICATION THAT WOULD INCLUDE THESE, AN UPDATED DRAFT REIMBURSEMENT AGREEMENT FOR ANY DEVELOPER INTERESTED IN APPLYING TO THIS PROGRAM.
>> IF I'M READING 4C CORRECTLY PARAGRAPH 2, IT SAYS THEY HAVE TO HAVE 20% OF ALL DWELLING UNIT TYPE STUDIO, ONE BEDROOM, TWO BEDROOM RE SITES, SO 20% OF EACH INDIVIDUAL GROUP OR IS IT 20% OF ALL?
>> TWENTY PERCENT OF EACH INDIVIDUAL GROUP.
WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE SURE THAT THE AFFORDABILITY UNITS AREN'T IN ONE BUILDING OR LOOK A CERTAIN WAY THAT THEY CAN BE IDENTIFIED TO THAT MAKES THE OCCUPANT FEEL AWKWARD.
>> I DO LIKE THAT PROVISION, BECAUSE IT ALSO ENSURES THAT IF THEY'RE BUILDING A CERTAIN NUMBER OF TWO BEDROOM APARTMENTS THAT THEY HAVE TO MAKE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF AVAILABLE.
WE AREN'T JUST DEALING WITH STUDIO APARTMENTS.
>> CORRECT. THE WAY THE STATE HAS CREATED THE DELTA BETWEEN MARKET RATE AND PROPOSED AFFORDABILITY, IF I WERE A DEVELOPER I WOULD GO AFTER STUDIO APARTMENTS FOR THIS FOR SURE.
WE WANTED A MEASURE THAT WE WEREN'T GETTING ALL STUDIO APARTMENTS AS THE AFFORDABLE.
WE WOULD LIKE IT TO SUPPORT LARGER FAMILIES AND SO ON.
>>ACROSS YES, COMPLETELY. ACROSS THE DEVELOPMENT.
>> I THINK IT MIGHT HELP TO REDUCE CONFUSION THAT I THINK I HAD AND MAYBE TRUSTEES ALSO HAD IF WE MOVE IN AN APPROVED PLAN BEFORE THE PARENTHESES THERE.
[03:35:01]
THAT WAY WHERE BY IT'S SPECIFICALLY SAYING IT'S EGG ONLY IN THIS PLAN AND THEN LIST THEM MUST BE 20%.THAT WAS MY CONFUSION, BECAUSE IN AN APPROVED PLAN CAME AFTER THE LIST.
AND IT WASN'T LIKE YOU HAVE TO HAVE 20% OF EACH OF THESE TYPES.
THAT WAS WHAT HAD ME A LITTLE CONFUSED AS WELL.
>> BOARD MEMBERS, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS?
>> WE TALK ABOUT THE DEVELOPER A LOT IN THIS PROJECT AND WE KNOW IT'S NOT A HOMEOWNER, BUT CAN WE DEFINE THE DEVELOPERS THAT A DEVELOPER OF A MULTIFAMILY HOUSING DEVELOPMENT? IS THAT WHAT YOU MEAN BY DEVELOPER?
WE DON'T HAVE A DEFINED LIST WITH OUR POLICIES AND PROCEDURES.
WE DO ONLY IN THE SINGLE FAMILY SAY IT CANNOT BE AN INDIVIDUAL, SO I CAN ALSO PUT IT CANNOT BE AN INDIVIDUAL.
I DON'T SEE GENERALLY TOO MANY INDIVIDUALS SAYING THEY'RE GOING TO CREATE A MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT.
>> SOMEONE COULD CALL THEMSELF A DEVELOPER AN ATTEMPT TO BASICALLY DO WHAT A SINGLE FAMILY OWNER MIGHT DO.
>> I DID FIND THAT IT WAS A LITTLE NOT CONFUSING, BUT WE TRADE OFF BETWEEN SAYING DEVELOPER SHELL AND THE DEVELOPER SHELL? IF WE CAN CLEAN THAT UP THROUGH OUT THE DOCUMENT, THE DEVELOPER.
IF WE JUST CLEAN THAT UP THROUGHOUT THE DOCUMENT, THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL TOO JUST TO HELP MY SANITY. JUSTICE LENTZ.
>> THANK YOU. ON PAGE 34C PARAGRAPH 4, I'M READING IT RIGHT THAT, '' SO THE TOWNSHIP HAS NO RESPONSIBILITY IN ANY ASPECT OF RENTAL ELIGIBILITY CHECKS WITH THE DEVELOPER?'' I'M THINKING ABOUT, IF THEY GO THROUGH THESE CHANNELS HERE WHICH IS WORKING THROUGH THE STATE AND THE STATE DETERMINES THEY ARE NOT WORKING TOWARDS THAT RENTAL ELIGIBILITY GOAL.
DOES THE STATE THEN TELL US THAT THERE'S AN ISSUE, OR IS THE TOWNSHIP NOT AT ALL INVOLVED IN THAT?
>> IT'S A GOOD QUESTION. THE DEVELOPER SHALL PROVIDE TO THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP BROWNFIELD AUTHORITY THOSE CHECKS.
THE INFORMATION AND DOCUMENTATION, AND THAT ALSO HAS TO BE REPORTED TO MISTA.
THEY ARE REPORTING TO TWO ENTITIES EACH YEAR.
>> MTBRA IS MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP BROWNFIELD REDEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY.
NOT A PROBLEM, LOTS OF ACRONYMS.
>> THE OTHER QUESTION I HAVE IN THAT PARAGRAPH IS DOCUMENTATION THAT IS OR WOULD BE PROVIDED TO THE MICHIGAN STATE HOUSING DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY.
IS IT, OR WOULD IT, OR HAS IT? [LAUGHTER].
>> IT DOESN'T SAY THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT IT.
>> IT SAYS, WILL THEY GIVE US A DOCUMENT THAT IS OR WOULD BE.
>> WE CAN SAY SHALL PROVIDE THE DOCUMENTATION.
>> OR THE DOCUMENTATION THAT HAS BEEN SUBMITTED.
>> HAS BEEN FEELS LIKE A MUCH MORE.
THEY HAVE TO DO IT ANNUALLY BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT IT TO US AFTER IT'S BEEN.
THERE MAY BE A BETTER WAY TO DO THAT OR TO WRITE IT, BUT THIS DIDN'T SEEM TO BE AS EMPHATIC OR AS INFORMATIVE AS I WISHED.
>> WHAT HAPPENS WITH PROJECTS WHERE THE DEVELOPER DOES NOT STAY ENGAGED IN THE MANAGEMENT OF THE PARCEL AFTER THE INITIAL DEVELOPMENT OF IT? BECAUSE CERTAINLY, THIS IS A 20-YEAR PROJECT THE DEVELOPER COULD MOVE ON AND SELL IT TO SOMEONE ELSE.
DO THEY TAKE ON THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE INCOME CHECKS?
>> BROWNFIELD PLANS AND THE REIMBURSEMENT AGREEMENTS CAN BE ASSIGNED.
>> BUT THE REIMBURSEMENT WOULD GO TO THE ORIGINAL DEVELOPER?
RIGHT NOW THERE'S A PROJECT THAT POTENTIALLY COULD SELL.
THEY WOULD NOTIFY THE TOWNSHIP, THAT NEW PROPERTY OWNER WOULD ASSUME THAT BROWNFIELD PLAN AND REIMBURSEMENT.
THE DEAL BETWEEN THE TWO WOULD HAVE HAPPENED, SO THERE WOULD BE SOME FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT BETWEEN THE TWO TO COVER THAT, AND THE NEW PROPERTY OWNER WOULD MAINTAIN THAT.
YOU'RE ASSIGNED THE WHOLE PLAN AND REIMBURSEMENT AGREEMENT, SIMILAR TO AMERICAN HOUSE MERIDIAN WHEN THEY TOOK OVER THE PLAN FOR WHAT WAS HUDSON SENIOR LIVING FOR THAT PROJECT.
[03:40:02]
>> THANK YOU. TREASURY DESCHAINE.
>> ALSO ADMINISTERS TAX CREDIT PROJECTS SECTION 42 OF LIKE WOODWARD PLACE AND OF COURSE, SECTION EIGHT, AND THEY'RE VERY ASSIDUOUS IN THE WAY THEY CHECK THOSE FILES.
IF THE DEVELOPER DOESN'T MEET THE CRITERIA FOR WHO THEY'VE MOVED IN, THAT THE DEVELOPER CAN LOSE THE ENTIRE TAX CREDIT FOR THE LIFETIME OF THE PROJECT.
ARE THEY AS THOROUGH? DO WE KNOW HOW THOROUGH THEY ARE WITH THESE BRA PROJECTS?
>> YES. ANNUAL REPORTING REQUIREMENTS FOR THE BROWNFIELD PLAN ADMINISTRATIVELY FROM THE TOWNSHIP SIDE WILL CONTINUE TO HAPPEN.
THE NEW STATE REPORT WILL INCLUDE AUTOMATICALLY THE REQUIREMENTS TO FILL IN HOUSING, REDEVELOPMENT IF YOU'RE GETTING RECEIVING SCHOOL OPERATING TAXES, AS WELL AS THE DEVELOPER HAS TO SUBMIT THAT INFORMATION TO MISTA IN ORDER TO CONTINUE TO RECEIVE THE REIMBURSEMENTS.
MUCH LIKE WHEN, GENERALLY, EVERY YEAR, WE SIT DOWN AT TREASURY TO IDENTIFY AND MAKE SURE EACH PROJECT HAS MET THEIR PROPER CRITERIA.
IF THEY HAVE NOT, THEN THE REIMBURSEMENTS ARE NOT ISSUED.
>> ARE THEY CHECKING EVERY FILE FOR THE 20% THAT WHATEVER THE NUMBER IS?
>> WE WOULD HAVE TO CHECK THAT.
>> WE WOULD HAVE TO MAKE SURE THE DEVELOPER IS PROVING THAT EACH YEAR WITH THEIR REPORTING.
IF THAT 20% COMES TO US, THAT'S NOT A REQUIREMENT THROUGH MISTA.
>> SO WE'VE GOT TO CHECK THE 20% OF THOSE FILES TO MAKE SURE THAT THE VERIFICATIONS ARE CORRECT, THE INCOME HAS BEEN VERIFIED WHATEVER THE CRITERIA IS.
>> WE'RE ALSO VERIFYING, YES, THE INFORMATION THAT THEY'RE SENDING TO MISTA THAT'S ALSO VERIFIED. YES.
>> THAT'S THAT'S A BIG TASK TO TAKE ON.
>> WE HAVE INCLUDED SOME ADDITIONAL FEES AND PERCENT, IN MY OPINION, I THINK THAT IS AN APPROPRIATE PERCENT TO SUPPORT THE ADMINISTRATION OF THAT IF THE TOWNSHIP THEN SEES THAT WE NEED TO ADD ANOTHER STAFF PERSON OR ADDITIONAL TIME FROM COMMUNITY PLANNING IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE THAT THOSE THINGS ARE VERIFIED.
WE ALSO DON'T ANTICIPATE THIS TO HAPPEN ON EVERY BROWNFIELD PLAN, SO THERE'S ALSO THAT TO HELP SAVE US.
>> THIS IS LIVELIHOOD OF MANAGEMENT COMPANIES.
THEY HIRE INCOME QUALIFICATION SPECIALISTS WHO GO THROUGH THESE FILES AND VERIFY A TALK CORRECT.
THERE'S MORE TO IT THAN IT SEEMS BECAUSE THEY REQUIRE CERTAIN TYPES OF VERIFICATIONS THAT ARE ALLOWED AND SOME ARE, SO AS LONG AS YOU'RE FIRMLY AWARE THAT THESE ARE GOING TO BE A LOT OF WORK TO VERIFY, I'M OKAY PROCEEDING, BUT IT'S NOT A SMALL TASK.
>> BRA HAS ASKED THE SAME QUESTION.
DO WE BELIEVE THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH STAFF TO ACCOMMODATE THE REQUIREMENTS FOR CHECKING? MUCH LIKE WE USE A CONSULTANT NOW TO VERIFY SOME OF THOSE INTRICACIES OF THE PLAN THAT GOES ABOVE STAFF'S PURVIEW, I THINK WE COULD ALSO HIRE ANOTHER CONSULTANT TO HELP US TO DO THE SAME THING, AND THE FEES ASSOCIATED WITH THE PLAN AND THE MANAGEMENT THEN WOULD BE DISTRIBUTED TO PAY FOR THAT SO WE WOULD BE AT A NET ZERO.
>> THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS?
>> ANYTHING ELSE IN THE NEXT SECTION, SECTION 4D, SINCE THAT IS THE OTHER OPERATIVE CHANGE?
>> I GUESS I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THAT WORKS.
>> YEAH. I CAN COUNT APARTMENTS. I DON'T KNOW.
>> THE BENEFIT AGAIN GOES TO THE DEVELOPER, AS [INAUDIBLE] SAID.
USING ROUND NUMBERS, TAKING A COPPER CREEK HOME $350,000.
IF THEY'RE GOING TO SUBSIDIZE THAT FOR AN INCOME THAT WOULD BE 120%.
NOW WE'RE GOING TO MARK IT DOWN TO MAYBE 225-50.
THAT $100,000 WOULD BE THEIR POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT LOSS.
THAT WOULD BE WHAT THEY ROLL INTO THEIR REQUEST FOR REIMBURSEMENT OVER TIME.
NOW, IT DOES GET TRICKY BECAUSE WE'VE TALKED WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY SELL? WHEN DO WE ALLOW A PROPERTY TO SELL? WE'RE TRYING TO DO AFFORDABILITY, BUT THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH POWER AND CONTROL WE CAN HAVE OVER IT, SO THAT'S WHY WE HAVE 4D3, WHICH TALKS ABOUT OUR REQUIREMENTS FOR HOW LONG WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE AN INCOME QUALIFIED OCCUPANT IN THAT HOME, AND WHAT HAPPENS IF THE INCOME QUALIFIED OCCUPANT WOULD LIKE TO SELL? WOULD THE BOARD LIKE THAT INDIVIDUAL TO SELL TO ANOTHER INCOME QUALIFIED PERSON? EVEN THOUGH THE POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT LOSS IS TO THE DEVELOPER.
THE NEXT PERSON, WHAT IS THE SALE PRICE GOING TO BE? WE DO REQUIRE THE INFORMATION FROM THE SALE PRICE TO BE PRESENTED TO THE TOWNSHIP, THAT IF THERE IS A LARGER GAP THAN WHAT WE FEEL LIKE IS APPROPRIATE, THAT MAY HAVE TO COME BACK TO THE TOWNSHIP.
THESE ARE SOME DETAILS THAT WE NEED TO IRON OUT.
>> I CAN SEE A SITUATION WHERE A DEVELOPER DOES, AS YOU SAID.
[03:45:05]
INSTEAD OF SELLING IT FOR 350,000, HE SELLS IT FOR 250,000, SO THEY QUALIFY FOR THIS.THEN THE PERSON THAT BUYS IT SELLS IT FOR 400,000 TO SOMEONE WHO WOULDN'T QUALIFY FOR THIS, AND THAT'S GOING TO ELIMINATE THE BROWNFIELD REIMBURSEMENT? ?? IT WOULD NOT.
HONESTLY, IT WOULD PROBABLY BE AN INCREASE, SO IT WOULD PROBABLY HELP US PAY OFF FASTER BECAUSE IT WOULD BE A FASTER IMPROVEMENT.
ON ONE HAND, WE COULD PAY OFF, WE COULD GET PAID BACK FOR THOSE IMPROVEMENTS FASTER IF THE FOR SALE PRICE WAS LARGER, BUT IF THE GOAL IS AFFORDABILITY WE'VE LOST THAT.
>> THAT WAS MY QUESTION ABOUT THIS.
HOW DO WE MAKE SURE THAT THE AFFORDABILITY CONTINUES DEED RESTRICTION OR SOMETHING? I DON'T KNOW.
>> MR. REQUIRES THE DEED RESTRICTION FOR ANY OF THESE PROPERTIES BUT IT IS OUR POLICY TO DETERMINE HOW LONG THAT DEED RESTRICTION IS GOING TO STAY AND WHAT IS THE REQUIREMENT.
FOR THE MULTIFAMILY COMPONENT, I'VE SAID FOR THE DURATION OF THE PLAN, SO FOR 20 YEARS, 20 YEARS, IT'S EASY.
THE SALE COMPONENT GETS TRICKY.
DO WE, SAY, TELL A PERSON WHOSE INCOME QUALIFIED, YOU CAN'T SELL THIS PROPERTY BEFORE 10 YEARS.
THERE ARE DIFFERENT MASTRIC? MISTA DOES FIVE.
THE INGHAM COUNTY LAND BANK DOES, I THINK, 7-10.
PEOPLE TYPICALLY STAY IN A HOUSE FOR ABOUT SEVEN YEARS, BUT, 10 SEEMED A LITTLE RIGHT.
AT THE SAME TIME, IF THEIR INCOME QUALIFIED, LET'S SAY THE OCCUPANTS AT A RANGE OF 50% OF THE AREA MEDIAN INCOME.
DO WE DENY THEM THE OPPORTUNITY TO TO MAKE MONEY IN THE MOST CONVENIENT WAY TO MAKE MONEY IN AMERICA.
>> I KNOW. THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING YOU.
WHAT WOULD YOU PREFER? I STUCK TO 10 YEARS BECAUSE 10 YEARS FOR A FAMILY THAT GETS THE FAMILY INTO THE SCHOOL SYSTEM, IT GETS THEM THROUGH A GOOD SCHOOL SYSTEM FOR A WHILE.
THEN IF THEY WERE TO SELL, IT SEEMS LIKE THE MARKET'S PROBABLY IN A LITTLE DIFFERENT OF A PLACE, COULD BE UP, COULD BE DOWN.
DEPENDING ON THAT, IT MIGHT HELP ANOTHER END USER.
AGAIN, THE WAY THAT MISTA'S WRITTEN THIS PROGRAM, THOUGH THE END USERS RECEIVE A BENEFIT, THE DEVELOPER IS REALLY THE ONE TO RECEIVE THE COST BENEFIT UP FRONT.
>> ESSENTIALLY, YOU'RE GIVING A HOME AT AN AFFORDABLE RATE TO SOMEONE WITH A, IN THIS CASE, A 10 YEAR BALLOON, BUT A GOOD BALLOON.
THE BEST BALLOON. THE BALLOON THAT SAYS YOU CAN SUDDENLY SELL YOUR HOUSE FOR TWICE AS MUCH AS YOU BOUGHT IT OR WHATEVER, HOWEVER THE MATH WORKS OUT.
>> WHATEVER THE MARKET MAY BE IN 10 YEARS.
>> EXCEPT THE PERSON THAT GOT IT AT A DISCOUNT MAY GET TRANSFERRED OUT OF THE AREA.
WELL, THAT HE CAN'T HE DOESN'T HAVE THE MONEY FROM SELLING HIS HOUSE OR HER HOUSE TO BUY A NEW HOUSE SOMEPLACE ELSE BECAUSE OF THE RESTRICTIONS ON THE SALE PRICE.
>> YES. I GUESS IT COULD GO BOTH WAYS.
>>I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER, BUT I THINK TEN YEARS MAY BE A LITTLE LONG BECAUSE OF THE MORE LIKELY OR THE POSSIBILITY OF MOVING TRANSFERS.
NOBODY STAYS OTHER THAN ME AND MARTA HERE IN THE SAME PLACE FOR 40 YEARS ANYMORE. I DON'T I DON'T KNOW.
IT'S A TOUGH QUESTION TO ANSWER AND IT MAY BE THAT IF WE GET SOME INTERESTING NEWS WE'D LOOK AT IT AND WATCH IT, HOW IT DEVELOPS AND WHAT IT DOES TO SOMEONE BECAUSE WE DO WANT TO ENCOURAGE REASON AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND I'M NOT SURE THIS DOES IT.
>> I FEEL LIKE THE END GOAL FOR MISTA IS UNITS.
THEY SEEM TO BE VERY PARTICULAR ABOUT REGIONS IN THE STATE LACKING QUALIFIED UNITS.
THIS IS A WAY TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DEVELOPER IS BUILDING QUALIFIED UNITS THAT ARE SEAMLESS THAT ISN'T AN INCOME RESTRICTED PROPERTY LIKE WE'VE SEEN IN THE PAST.
4D3 IT HAS A RESTRICTED DEED REQUIREMENT, INCOME RESTRICTIONS, AND A 10 YEAR LIMIT ON THAT.
IF YOU ARE TO SELL, IT HAS TO BE TO AN INCOME QUALIFIED PERSON.
THEN IF THEY SELL AND THERE'S A VERY LARGE GAP IN THAT, WHICH THE DEVELOPER WILL NEED OR THE PROPERTY OWNER WILL NEED TO SHOW APPRAISALS,
[03:50:01]
BROKER PRICE AND MAKE SURE THAT THEY'VE SOLD IT TO AN INCOME QUALIFIED PERSON BY USING THE MISTA LIMITS AT THAT TIME AND THE AGREEMENTS FOR THE SALE, THEN THE TOWNSHIP CAN SAY, THIS LOOKS GOOD, OR THE TOWNSHIP CAN SAY, ACTUALLY, YOU'VE MADE AN EGREGIOUS ERROR, AND THIS IS NOT WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE.>> WELL, I'M GLAD YOU HAVE TO FOLLOW AND NOT ME.
>> I DO THINK IT'S A GREAT PROGRAM.
IT'S JUST EASIER TO ADMINISTER IN AN APARTMENT SETTING THAN IT IS IN A SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE.
THERE'LL BE MORE CHALLENGES THERE.
THERE MAY ALSO BE FEWER TAKERS.
>> G DICHA, I DON'T SEE ANYWHERE ADDRESSED IN THIS POLICY, WHAT HAPPENS IF A PERSON'S INCOME GOES ABOVE THE LIMIT DURING THE 10 YEARS.
WHAT HAPPENS THEN? SUDDENLY THEY'RE NO LONGER INCOME QUALIFIED.
THEY'RE STILL LIVE IN THE UNIT. WHAT ARE THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THAT?
>> WE DO NOT HAVE ANY SPECIFICATIONS TO THAT, AND NEITHER DOES MISTA.
WE CAN ADD THAT IN IF THERE WAS A PARTICULAR REQUEST OF THE BOARD.
>> I THINK WE NEED TO ADDRESS THAT.
IF WE'RE REALLY TALKING ABOUT AFFORDABILITY, WHAT DO WE DO IN THE PERSON AFTER ONE OR TWO YEARS? THERE'S NO LONGER IN NEED OF THAT.
>> WE CAN MONITOR THAT IN THE APARTMENT.
WE CAN'T DO IT IN THE SINGLE FAMILY HOME.
>> NOT UNTIL THE SALE, THEN WE WOULD KNOW THAT.
BUT IF WE'RE MONITORING IT IN THE MULTIFAMILY, ARE YOU SAYING IF THEY EXCEED AN INCOME OF ABOVE 120% OF THE AREA MEDIAN INCOME, THEY SHOULD NO LONGER LIVE THERE.
>> WELL, THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED, I THINK, ON A TAX CREDIT PROPERTY.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT POLICY WOULD BE WITH THIS. I DON'T KNOW.
>> THE LAST THING THAT MARDIAN TOWNSHIP BRA WANTS TO DO IS BE THE ONES WHO SAY, SORRY, YOU MAKE TOO MUCH, YOU'RE OUT OF YOUR SINGLE FAMILY.
>> THAT'S GOING TO BE TIGHT I. I HAVE HAD THE ATTORNEYS TAKE A LOOK AT THIS, SO I CAN ASK. I CAN DEFINITELY ASK.
>> JUST ONCE. IN DIRECT RESPONSE TO THAT, I THINK, I WOULD PROBABLY BE THE FOSTER CHILD OF THAT.
WHEN I MOVED HERE, I WAS MAKING, BOY, VERY LITTLE MONEY.
DEFINITELY WOULD HAVE QUALIFIED.
IN MY TIME HERE HAVE GROWN PROBABLY OUTSIDE OF THAT RANGE, MAYBE RIGHT ON THE VERGE THERE, BUT CONSIDERING THE INTENTION BEING A HOME HELPS BUILD WEALTH AND LONG-TERM STABILITY IN A LIFE, I WOULD AGREE WITH THE SENTIMENT THAT'S BEING EXPRESSED.
I WOULDN'T WANT TO SEE SOMETHING LIKE THAT BE TAKEN FROM SOMEONE BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT PEOPLE PRIME EARNING YEARS ARE GOING TO TAKE THEM OR COULD POTENTIALLY TAKE THEM FROM BEING QUALIFIED AND NOT QUALIFIED, PUT THEM RIGHT BACK IN A SITUATION THAT THEY JUST SPENT FIVE YEARS GETTING OUT OF, LET'S SAY.
THAT WOULD BE THAT WOULD BE MY OPINION ON THE MATTER.
>> FRANKLY, IT'S WHAT WE WANT. WE WANT PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO GROW BETTER AND FIND THEMSELVES INTO A DIFFERENT CATEGORY.
I NOTICED THAT WE'VE SKIPPED SECTION 7 THROUGH 9, JUST A FORMATTING THING, MAYBE, OR DID WE LOSE SOMETHING IMPORTANT?
>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR ISSUES HERE? ARE YOU RELATIVELY COMFORTABLE WITH WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THAT SECTION? I KNOW WE'VE GOT A FEW CHANGES YET TO HEAR FROM THE ATTORNEYS FROM.
>> I'D LOVE TO SEE US BACK ON DISCUSSION AT LEAST ONCE MORE.
THIS IS A PRETTY COMPLEX PROGRAM AND WE'RE GOING TO GET SOME ANSWERS, SO I THINK IT'D BE USEFUL TO DISCUSS AT LEAST ONCE ONCE MORE.
>> THEN WE TAKE OUR LEAVE FOR TONIGHT AND WE'LL SEE YOU BACK AT THE FUTURE MEETING.
>> ITEM 14, COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC.
DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC WISHING TO MAKE COMMENTS? NO. PUBLIC COMMENT IS CLOSED AT 10:11 P.M. OUR MATTERS AND BOARD MEMBER COMMENTS,
[15. OTHER MATTERS AND BOARD MEMBER COMMENTS]
ANY OTHER MATTERS AND BOARD MEMBER COMMENTS THIS EVENING?>> I'M SORRY. I DID HAVE ONE THING I FORGOT TO BRING UP REALLY QUICKLY.
IN COUNTY BROADBAND TASK FORCE, THEY HAVE ENDORSED ABOUT SIX OR SEVEN DIFFERENT INTERNET SERVICE PROVIDERS.
TWO OF THEM HAVE APPROACHED US FOR LETTERS OF SUPPORT, SO IS MY INCLINATION TO PROVIDE LETTERS OF SUPPORT WITH A CAVEAT THAT WE ARE NOT EVALUATING ALL THE APPLICATIONS, THAT WE SIMPLY SUPPORT INCREASED ACCESS TO INTERNET SERVICE IN OUR COMMUNITY AND RELY UPON THE STATE, MI, MICHIGAN, HIGH SPEED INTERNET OFFICE TO DEAL WITH ALL THE TECHNICAL SIDES, BUT JUST AS A GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO SUPPORT IT WAS FRONTIER
[03:55:04]
AND ANOTHER ONE WAS STRATEGIC MANAGEMENT OR PFN NETWORK.NOT IN THE TOWNSHIP CURRENTLY, BUT THEY WANT TO PROVIDE SERVICE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
I DON'T KNOW IF THERE WAS A GREAT ANGST OVER THAT, BUT IF NOT, I'D BE HAPPY TO WRITE THOSE LETTERS.
>> EVERYONE FEEL PRETTY COMFORTABLE WITH THAT>
>> THANK YOU. A OTHER MATTERS AND BOARD FOR COMMENTS.
SAYING NOW ON BRIGGS ITEM 16 ADJOURNMENT, A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
>> MOVED BY TRUSTEE WILSON, SUPPORTED BY TRUSTEE LENTZ ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF ADJOURNMENT PLEASE SAY, AYE.
>> ANY OPPOSED? PLEASE STAND ADJOURNED AT 10:12 P.M.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.