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[1. CALL MEETING TO ORDER]

[00:00:03]

IT IS NOW 7:00.

I'D LIKE TO CALL THIS MEETING OF THE MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP PLANNING COMMISSION TOGETHER, PLEASE.

FIRST, I WILL CALL THE ROLL.

COMMISSIONER TREZISE.

HERE. COMMISSIONER MCCONNELL.

HERE. COMMISSIONER CORDILL.

HERE. COMMISSIONER SHREWSBURY.

HERE. COMMISSIONER RICHARDS.

HERE. COMMISSIONER SNYDER.

HERE. COMMISSIONER PREMOE.

HERE. AND I, THE COMMISSIONER BLUMER AM HERE.

SO WE HAVE A FULL PANEL TODAY.

THE NEXT ITEM WILL BE PUBLIC REMARKS.

I'D LIKE TO ADVISE EVERYONE WHO IS HERE TODAY.

YOU HAVE TWO SESSIONS TO SPEAK TO THE BOARD.

THE FIRST IS A GENERAL SESSION OF PUBLIC REMARKS WHERE YOU CAN SPEAK ABOUT JUST ABOUT ANYTHING THAT DEALS WITH THE TOWNSHIP DEVELOPMENT.

I ASK YOU TO, IF YOU WANT TO SPEAK, PLEASE FILL OUT A SPEAKER CARD, GIVE US YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, AND YOUR PRESENTATION WILL BE LIMITED TO 3 MINUTES.

THE SECOND OPPORTUNITY WILL BE THERE WILL BE A TIME FOR PUBLIC COMMENT AFTER EACH OF THE PUBLIC ISSUES THAT WE DEAL WITH.

AGAIN, WE'LL ASK YOU TO FILL OUT A CARD TELLING US THAT YOUR NAME, ADDRESS AND WHAT YOU WISH TO SPEAK ABOUT AND WE WILL GIVE YOU AN OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK AT THAT TIME.

SO IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO MAKE JUST A GENERAL ADDRESS TO THE BOARD AT THIS TIME? ALL RIGHT. NOBODY. ALL RIGHT.

SO WE WILL THEN PROCEED TO ITEM NUMBER FOUR, WHICH IS APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA.

[4. APPROVAL OF AGENDA]

IS THERE A MOTION TO APPROVE? MOVED BY COMMISSIONER CORDILL.

SECOND? SECOND BY COMMISSIONER RICHARDS.

ALL IN FAVOR. THERE ARE NO NAYS.

THEREFORE, THE AGENDA IS APPROVED.

ITEM NUMBER FIVE IS APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES OF THE OCTOBER TEN REGULAR MEETING OF THIS COMMISSION.

[5. APPROVAL OF MINUTES]

IS THERE A MOTION? SO MOVE? MOVE BY VICE CHAIR TREZISE.

IS THERE A SECOND? AND SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER SNYDER.

NO. MCCONNELL.

NO. I'M SORRY.

I. OK COMMISSIONER.

SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER SNYDER.

THEN WE'LL GIVE HER THE HONOR THERE.

IS THERE ANY COMMENT ON THE PREVIOUS MINUTES? ANY CORRECTIONS DISCUSSION? ALL RIGHT. WE'LL CALL FOR THE VOTE THEN.

ALL IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THE PRIOR MINUTES.

SAY AYE. AYE. NO DISAPPROVAL.

THEREFORE, THE MINUTES OF THE OCTOBER 10 MEETING ARE APPROVED.

NEXT, THE BOARD WILL RECOGNIZE THAT THERE ARE COMMUNICATIONS CONCERNING ONE OF THE ISSUES BEFORE THE BOARD TODAY THAT WE RECEIVED AT THE TIME THAT

[6. COMMUNICATIONS]

THE AGENDA WAS PREPARED.

AND THAT IS FROM CHARLES KOTZ.

THAT IS IN THE PACKET THAT THE COMMISSIONERS HAVE RECEIVED.

SINCE THAT TIME.

THE RECORD SHOULD REFLECT THAT WE ALSO RECEIVED THREE OTHERS.

ONE WAS PROVIDED TO US BY DIRECTOR SCHMITT.

GOING TO BRING THAT UP.

AND THAT IS A LETTER ADDRESSED TO THE COMMISSION BY KATHLEEN.

I DON'T HAVE A, KATHLEEN MURPHY KEATY.

AND THEN TODAY THE BOARD RECEIVED TWO MORE COMMUNICATIONS, ALL OF WHICH RELATE TO THE FIRST ITEM FOR OUR DISCUSSION THIS EVENING.

AND THAT IS THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT 22091.

ONE OF THOSE LETTERS IS FROM D'ANDREA KIRK AND THE OTHER IS FROM JOSHUA BURKITT.

ALL RIGHT. NOW WE ARE THEN PROCEEDING

[7.A. SUP #22091 – Grand Reserve]

TO ITEM NUMBER SEVEN ON THE AGENDA, AND THAT IS PUBLIC HEARINGS, THE FIRST BEING SPECIAL USE PERMIT 22091, WHICH RELATES TO GRAND RESERVE.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

THIS IS SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR CONSTRUCTING 115 UNIT RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT CONSISTING OF 60 DUPLEXES AND 55 SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL HOMES.

THIS IS ALL GOING TO BE UNDER ONE OWNERSHIP.

IT TOTALS MORE THAN 25,000 SQUARE FEET BETWEEN CENTRAL PARK DRIVE AND POWELL ROAD.

BECAUSE IT IS OVER 25,000 SQUARE FEET AND UNDER ONE OWNERSHIP WE'VE DETERMINED THERE'S TWO SEPARATE APPROVALS GOING THROUGH HERE.

YOU'LL BE ASKED TO EVENTUALLY BE ASKED TO APPROVE THE SUP, ALLOWING SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT IN THE DISTRICT AS PART OF AN OVERALL DEVELOPMENT THAT THAT APPROVAL WILL FULFILL ONE OF THE CONDITIONS I'LL GET TO IN A MOMENT.

BUT THE 25,000 SQUARE FOOT CONDITION, BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT INDIVIDUAL LOTS THAT WILL GO TO THE BOARD.

SO YOU'LL MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON THAT AT THE SAME TIME.

THE PROPERTY WAS REZONED TO THE RD DISTRICT IN FEBRUARY OF 2021, BUT IT WAS A CONDITIONAL REZONING.

THERE WERE SIX CONDITIONS OF THAT REZONING.

[00:05:01]

WHAT I'M GOING TO POINT OUT RIGHT NOW IS THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE PROPERTY IS LIMITED TO NO MORE THAN 220 UNITS.

THERE'S GOING TO BE NO FEWER THAN 25 SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED HOMES AND THE EASTERN 11 ACRES OF THE PARCEL NEEDED TO BE DEVELOPED AS SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL.

ALL SIX OF THESE CONDITIONS HAVE BEEN MET WITH THE CONCEPT PLAN THAT YOU SEE IN FRONT OF YOU TONIGHT.

AS FAR AS THE PHYSICAL FEATURES OF THE PROPERTY, THERE ARE FOUR IDENTIFIED REGULATED WETLANDS ON THE PROPERTY.

THEY HAVE SHOWN A 40 FOOT BUFFER AS REQUIRED BY ORDINANCE AROUND ALL FOUR OF THE PROTECTED WETLANDS.

THERE IS ONE SMALL ISSUE ON THE SOUTHWEST CORNER.

THEY HAVE THEIR ACCESS ROAD GOING THROUGH ONE OF THE BUFFERS.

THIS DOES NOT IMPACT THE WETLAND PER SE, BUT BECAUSE IT IS IN THE BUFFER ZONE, IT WILL REQUIRE A ZONING VARIANCE.

SO THE SUP CAN BE APPROVED WITH THE CONDITION THAT THE SITE PLAN NOT BE APPROVED WITHOUT A VARIANCE IN PLACE.

AND THAT WOULD BE FINE.

YOU KNOW, WE CAN GET THERE.

BUT THAT WAS BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION.

OTHER THAN THAT, THOUGH, THERE ARE NO FLOODPLAINS ON THE PROPERTY.

THEY HAVE A FULL TRAFFIC STUDY THAT THEY'VE SUBMITTED TO THE ROAD DEPARTMENT FOR THEIR REVIEW.

I HAVE A COMMENT LETTER IN YOUR PACKET FROM THEM.

SANITARY, SEWER AND PUBLIC WATER ARE AVAILABLE ON THE SITE AND THAT'S UNDER REVIEW FOR OUR ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT AS WELL.

SO THE PROPERTY MEETS THE CONDITIONS OF, THE PROPOSAL MEETS THE CONDITIONS SET BY THE REZONING.

IT'S CONSISTENT WITH THE INTENT AND PURPOSES OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

IT'S WELL WITHIN 115 UNITS IS JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN HALF OF WHAT WAS ALLOWED BY THE REZONING IN 2021.

THE WETLAND REPORT CONFIRMS THE WETLAND BOUNDARIES AND AS I SAID, THE BUFFERS ARE IN PLACE.

ONE COMMENT FROM THE FIRE MARSHAL NO PARKING SIGNS WILL NEED TO BE INSTALLED ON ONE SIDE OF THE ROAD TO ALLOW FOR FIRE ACCESS.

OTHER THAN THAT, AND WE ARE ASKING THAT BEFORE THE SITE PLAN IS APPROVED, WE'RE GOING TO ASK FOR A DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT TO BE SIGNED BETWEEN THE TOWNSHIP AND THE APPLICANT.

THIS IS BECAUSE THESE ARE PRIVATE ROADS.

THIS IS A RENTAL DEVELOPMENT.

THE SINGLE FAMILY HOMES ARE NOT GOING TO BE SOLD JUST SO THAT WE KNOW MOVING FORWARD IN THE FUTURE, HOW IS THE MAINTENANCE GOING TO BE HANDLED . OTHER THAN THAT, LIKE I SAID, YOU'RE GOING TO EVENTUALLY BE ASKED TO POTENTIALLY APPROVE TWO RESOLUTIONS.

ONE WILL BE FOR THE SINGLE FAMILY [INAUDIBLE] DEVELOPMENT IN THE DISTRICT AND THE OTHER ONE WILL BE A RECOMMENDATION ON THE 25,000 SQUARE FEET.

AND OTHER THAN THAT, IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM OR TURN IT OVER TO THE APPLICANT.

THE WRITE UP SAID THERE WILL BE NO PARKING ON THE STREETS.

IT DIDN'T SAY ONE SIDE.

FROM MY RECOLLECTION OF WHAT I READ, I COPIED AND PASTED OUT OF AN EMAIL.

IF WHAT I PROVIDED IS IT SAYS DIFFERENT, THEN THAT WILL TRUMP.

YEAH, I DIDN'T.

YEAH. SORRY. THAT CAME AFTER THE EMAIL I GOT FROM THE FIRE MARSHAL THE SAME WAY YOU DID. OKAY.

THERE WOULD BE NO PARKING.

OK THEN. DO I UNDERSTAND THAT THE TRAFFIC CONTROL STUDY APPLIED TO BOTH POWELL ROAD AND THE WESTERN BOUNDARY OF THIS DEVELOPMENT? THAT'S CORRECT.

YES. YES.

BECAUSE I KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF RESIDENTIAL CONCERN ABOUT CHANGING THE CHARACTER OF POWELL ROAD, WHICH IS BASICALLY A RURAL ROAD, EVEN THOUGH IT'S PAVED.

RIGHT. I GUESS I'D LIKE SOME GUIDANCE ON PROCEDURALLY IF THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT WERE APPROVED CONDITIONAL ON A SUCCESSFUL APPEAL TO THE VARIANCE FOR THE WETLAND BUFFER.

IF THAT VARIANCE WERE NOT GRANTED, WHAT WOULD HAPPEN NEXT? THEY WOULD HAVE TO AMEND THE CONCEPT PLAN AND COME BACK FOR AMENDED SUP.

I'D BE INTERESTED IN HEARING FROM THE APPLICANT WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN IN THAT EVENT IN TERMS OF A SITE PLAN? SURE. BECAUSE MY READING OF IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD BE.

[00:10:01]

IT IMPOSES A FAIRLY DRASTIC LIMITATION ON THE YEAH. ON THE OTHER HAND THERE WITH THE PRESENCE OF THE WETLAND, YOU KNOW, ON THAT SIDE OF THE PROPERTY, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF OTHER OPTIONS FOR ROAD GOING THROUGH THERE. SO YES, BRIAN, LET ME ASK YOU.

ARE THERE DIFFERENCES? THE ENTIRE DEVELOPMENT CONCEPT IS A RENTAL.

THAT IS CORRECT. IF SOME OF THIS WERE TO BECOME PRIVATIZED AND SOLD, SOLD OFF INDIVIDUALLY, I MEAN, HOW IS THAT DIFFERENT OR WHAT WOULD CHANGE AS A RESULT OF THAT? THEY WOULD THEY'D HAVE TO REZONE, WOULDN'T THEY? BECAUSE IT'S RD.

YOU'D HAVE TO SPLIT. WE'D HAVE TO LOOK INTO THE SPECIFICS OF THAT.

BECAUSE OF THE RD ZONING, THEY MIGHT HAVE TO REZONE IT TO ALLOW SINGLE FAMILY PARCELS.

BECAUSE REMEMBER, THESE ARE PART OF AN OVERALL MULTIFAMILY, QUOTE UNQUOTE, DEVELOPMENT.

SO I CAN GIVE YOU A MORE SOLID ANSWER BEFORE THE 14TH.

ALL RIGHT. THE AGREEMENT THAT YOU ARE REQUIRING FROM THE DEVELOPERS RELATES TO THAT TOPIC, CORRECT? I MEAN, IT HAS TO DO WITH MAINTENANCE OF THE PROPERTY BECAUSE IT'S A CORPORATE OWNERSHIP.

WELL, WE'RE NOTICING THESE ARE INTENDED TO BE PRIVATE ROADS.

THERE ARE SIDEWALKS BECAUSE THESE ARE RENTALS.

THEY'RE NOT PARCELS.

THEREFORE, WHO'S GOING TO DO THE MOWING? YOU KNOW, WHO'S WEED CONTROL, YOU KNOW, TALL GRASS, WHO GETS THE FINES, THAT KIND OF A THING.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO NAIL DOWN.

SEWER AND WATER, YOU KNOW, ISSUES WITH THE YOU KNOW THEY'RE CONNECTING TO THAT.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR BRIAN? NOT RIGHT NOW. NO, THANK YOU.

OF COURSE. LET ME ASK, IS THERE ANYONE FROM THE DEVELOPER THAT WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS? YES. PLEASE? GOOD EVENING.

I'M JOE LOCRICCHIO.

I'M HERE TONIGHT ON BEHALF OF DTN MANAGEMENT COMPANY, THE PARTNERS AND DEVELOPERS OF THE GRAND RESERVE RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITY.

WITH US TONIGHT IS MATT DIFFIN, OUR PROJECT ENGINEER AND ALSO THE OWNER OF DTN EXCUSE ME, AND THE HEAD OF THE CONSTRUCTION DEPARTMENT OF DTN ARE HERE AS WELL.

SO WE APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE HERE.

AND YOUR ADDRESS IS? 316 BIRCHWOOD AVENUE, TRAVERSE CITY, MICHIGAN, 49686.

I'M GOING TO REPEAT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT MR. SHORKEY SAID, SO I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT.

THE GRAND RESERVE IS A RESIDENTIAL RENTAL COMMUNITY CONSISTING OF DETACHED AND DUPLEX STYLE HOMES.

THE PROJECT IS COMPRISED OF 115 UNITS IN TOTAL, 55 SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED AND 60 DUPLEX HOMES.

UNDER THE EXISTING RD ZONING, WE WOULD QUALIFY FOR UP TO EIGHT UNITS PER ACRE DENSITY OR 220 UNITS.

HOWEVER, WE'RE HERE THIS EVENING PRESENTING A PROJECT CONSISTING OF ONLY 3.57 UNITS TO THE ACRE WITH 115 UNITS.

OUR SITE MEASURES JUST OVER 32 ACRES IN SIZE, AND OUR SITE PLAN PROVIDES FOR OVER 20 ACRES OR NEARLY 64% OF THE SITE IS OPEN SPACE.

THE PLAN FEATURES SIDEWALKS ON BOTH SIDES OF THE ROAD, A DOG PARK, NATURE TRAILS AND COMMUNITY GARDENING AREAS WITH RAISED BEDS FOR THE USE AND ENJOYMENT OF ALL THE RESIDENTS.

THERE ARE LARGE, NATURAL OR PLANNED LANDSCAPED BUFFERS BETWEEN THE PROJECT AND THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORS, AND THERE'S A SPACIOUS COMMUNITY CLUBHOUSE PROVIDED THAT FEATURES A POOL AND EXERCISE ROOM, A GATHERING ROOM AND OUTDOOR PLAY STRUCTURE.

THE SITE AMENITIES ARE CONDUCIVE TO ALL ACTIVE LIFESTYLES.

WITH RESPECT TO THE HOMES THEMSELVES ALL HOMES FEATURE THREE BEDROOMS AND THREE BATHROOMS WITH AN OPTION FOR A FOURTH BEDROOM AND FOURTH BATHROOM WITH THE FINISHED BASEMENT.

THE DETACHED UNITS MEASURE 1864 SQUARE FEET AND FEATURE A FIRST FLOOR MASTER BEDROOM.

EACH UNIT WITHIN THE DUPLEX MODELS MEASURES 2059 SQUARE FEET.

BOTH UNIT STYLES OFFER FOUR DIFFERENT ELEVATION OPTIONS WITH VARIED DESIGN FEATURES AND FINISHES, AND THE UNITS FEATURE LARGE GARAGES AND SPACIOUS STORAGE IN THE BASEMENTS, WHETHER FINISHED OR UNFINISHED.

THESE HOMES WILL APPEAL TO A WIDE VARIETY OF DEMOGRAPHICS, FROM YOUNG PROFESSIONALS TO EMPTY NESTERS WITH MANY MORE PEOPLE WORKING FROM HOME, THE THREE OR FOUR BEDROOM OPTION CAN ADDRESS THE GROWING NEED FOR THE HOME OFFICE.

AND MANY PEOPLE ACROSS ALL AGE PROFILES, AND WHETHER BY CHOICE OR BY LIMITATION, DUE TO RAPIDLY RISING INTEREST RATES AND CHALLENGING LENDING CRITERIA, ARE LOOKING TO RENT A HOME IN A GREAT COMMUNITY VERSUS BEING ABLE TO BUY A HOME THESE DAYS.

[00:15:04]

GRAND RESERVE WILL PROVIDE THAT OPPORTUNITY.

WITH RESPECT TO A FEW ITEMS FROM THE REVIEWS FROM THE ENGINEERING AND OTHER DEPARTMENTS LIKE TO ADDRESS A FEW OF THOSE ITEMS, IF I COULD.

WE HAVE ALREADY RECEIVED AND ADDRESSED COMMENTS FROM THE INGHAM COUNTY ROAD COMMISSION.

SOIL BORINGS HAVE BEEN COMPLETED AND ARE FAVORABLE AND CONDUCIVE TO THIS DEVELOPMENT.

A COPY OF THE BORINGS REPORT WILL BE PROVIDED TO THE TOWNSHIP AS REQUIRED OR HAS BEEN PROVIDED.

EXCUSE ME, THAT WAS PART OF OUR PACKET.

THE SOIL BORINGS ARE THERE.

WE ARE NOT INTENDING ON INSTALLING A SANITARY LIFT STATION AS ALL OF OUR ENGINEERING INDICATES THAT WE CAN SERVICE THE DEVELOPMENT WITH GRAVITY SEWERS.

AND TO THE CHAIR'S QUESTION ABOUT THE TRAFFIC STUDY.

THE TRAFFIC STUDY IS REGIONAL IN SCOPE AND COVERS POWELL ROAD, CERTAINLY AS WELL AS CENTRAL PARK.

SO WITH THAT, WE ARE ALL AVAILABLE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE.

ANY BOARD MEMBERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? NOT AT THIS POINT. BUT LET'S GET THE REST OF THE COMMENTS DONE.

WHAT ARE YOU ANTICIPATING THE AVERAGE COST PER UNIT, AVERAGE RANGE OF COST PER UNIT TO RENT? RENTAL RATES? YES. I MEAN, THESE ARE GOING TO BE MARKET RENTAL RATES WITH RECENT RELEVANT EXPERIENCE WITH SIMILAR UNITS LIKE THIS, YOU'RE LOOKING AT 25 TO 3,000 DOLLARS A UNIT RANGE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? YES. OKAY.

I DO, BUT I HAVE TO HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT FIRST.

ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU.

MAYBE WHAT WE'LL DO IS INVITE PUBLIC COMMENT, AND THEN WE'LL HAVE YOU COME BACK AND RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS THAT THEY RAISED.

I KNOW THAT WE HAVE A CARD FROM CECELIA KRAMER.

WOULD YOU LIKE TO ADDRESS US, MA'AM? JOHN MCCRACKEN.

OKAY. IS THERE ANYONE WHO WOULD LIKE TO MAKE ANY COMMENTS ABOUT.

YEAH. READING IS NOT ONE OF MY STRONG POINTS.

[LAUGHTER] IS THERE ANYONE IN THE ROOM WHO WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE ISSUE OF THIS REGIONAL DEVELOPMENT? NO. ALL RIGHT, THEN WHY DON'T WE HAVE YOU GENTLEMEN COME BACK? A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS THEN.

HAS YOUR.

AFTERWARDS? YEAH, YOU CAN DO THAT AFTERWARDS. JUST LET US.

RIGHT NOW JUST TELL US YOUR NAME AND YOUR ADDRESS, PLEASE.

MY NAME IS ANN PERKINS.

I'M AT 5972 VILLAGE DRIVE IN HASLETT.

I'VE WORKED IN HEALTH CARE AND BEFORE A HOSPITAL CAN ADD BEDS, A NEEDS ASSESSMENT IS DONE TO SEE IF THERE REALLY IS A NEED FOR ADDITIONAL BEDS.

WAS ANY KIND OF ANALYSIS OR STUDY DONE TO SEE IF INDEED MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP NEEDS THIS KIND OF DEVELOPMENT, QUOTE UNQUOTE, WHETHER IT'S FILLING A BIG HOLE OR A HOLE NONETHELESS? WAS ANY KIND OF STUDY DONE? THAT'S MY QUESTION.

VERY GOOD, MA'AM. THANK YOU.

IT IS A VERY GOOD QUESTION.

ANYONE ELSE BEFORE WE BRING THE DEVELOPERS BACK? GENTLEMEN.

WERE YOU ABLE TO HEAR HER QUESTION? I WAS, YES.

WAS A SPECIFIC STUDY DONE ABOUT NEED FOR RENTAL UNITS WITHIN THE COMMUNITY? NOT. THERE WAS NOT ONE SPECIFIC DONE TO THIS.

HOWEVER, WE FIRMLY BELIEVE FROM ALL OF OUR EXPERIENCE IN THIS GENERAL MARKET, RIGHT IN THE SURROUNDING AREAS, THAT THIS IS A LARGE NEED IN THE COMMUNITY AND WILL BE FOR YEARS TO COME.

RAJI LOOKS LIKE HE MIGHT WANT TO LED SOMETHING ON THAT.

COULD YOU GIVE US YOUR NAME, PLEASE, SIR? AND YOUR ADDRESS? MY NAME IS RAJI UPPAL.

I AM MOVING BETWEEN ADDRESSES, SO I HAD TO THINK ABOUT IT FOR A SECOND.

BUT I'M IN THE QUARRY APARTMENTS THAT WE HAVE BUILT OUT IN DEWITT OFF OF CLARK ROAD.

SO I APOLOGIZE ABOUT NOT SAYING MY ADDRESS EXACTLY, BUT I USED TO BE A MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP RESIDENT ALSO.

THE QUESTION ABOUT HAS THERE BEEN A STUDY FOR IT? THE ANSWER IS DTN HAS BEEN BUILDING PRODUCTS LIKE THIS.

WE BUILT A PRODUCT DOWN IN HOLT.

THERE'S ABOUT 40 HOMES DOWN THERE AND THEY'RE ACTIVELY NEEDED AND WANTED SIMILAR PRICE POINTS, SIMILAR NEED.

WE HAVE SOME TOWNHOMES DOWN THERE THAT ARE ALSO SIMILAR.

[00:20:03]

WE JUST BUILT 85, 82 I'M PROBABLY SAYING THE WRONG NUMBER OUT IN DEWITT.

I LIVE THERE NOW MY FAMILY OF FOUR LIVES IN ONE.

IT'S A FLAT THAT WE LIVE IN WITH A FINISHED BASEMENT BELOW IT AND A TWO CAR GARAGE.

WE FINISHED BUILDING THOSE GEE IN THE LAST THREE MONTHS AND WE'RE 90% OCCUPIED APPROXIMATELY AT THIS TIME.

WE ARE FINDING THAT THERE'S THIS MID MARKET AND WHAT'S HAPPENING AND THE REASON WHEN YOU ASK THAT QUESTION IS THERE'S STUDY FOR IT.

WE MANAGE I DON'T KNOW.

WE MANAGE PROBABLY 5000 UNITS HERE IN THE LANSING AREA.

A LOT OF THEM WE OWN AND SOME OF THEM ARE FOR THIRD PARTY, BUT THE MAJORITY WE OWN.

SO IN TERMS OF HIRING SOMEONE TO DO A THIRD PARTY ESTIMATE IN OUR BACK YARD, WE NORMALLY DON'T DO THAT BECAUSE PEOPLE ASK US ACTUALLY WHAT WE THINK THE MARKET IS.

AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT WE'RE THE MARKET LEADER, BUT WE'RE PROBABLY THE BIGGEST IN THE LANSING AREA IN TERMS OF MANAGING CONVENTIONAL.

AND WE HAVE SOME STUDENT HOUSING ALSO.

BUT THIS THE NEED HERE IS WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO HERE IS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO BUILD PRODUCTS THAT WILL HAVE A FLEXIBLE USE.

THE ONE THAT HAS A BEDROOM DOWN ON THE FIRST FLOOR AND HAS A SECOND BEDROOM ON THE FIRST FLOOR WILL BE VERY ADAPTABLE FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO HAVE FIRST FLOOR LIVING.

IN ADDITION, THERE STILL WILL BE A SECOND FLOOR BEDROOM UP THERE AND BATHROOM, BUT IT WOULD BE MORE GUEST ORIENTED OR IF IT WAS FOR A YOUNG FAMILY, WOULD ALSO FIT THOSE NEEDS.

AND WE'RE ALSO BUILDING SOME TWO STORY ONES THAT WOULD ACCOMMODATE YOUNG FAMILIES.

WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S ALL FAMILIES, BUT IT WOULD HAVE A THREE BEDROOMS ON THE SECOND FLOOR AND ALL OF THEM HAVE FINISHED BASEMENTS.

WHAT WE'RE FINDING WHEN WE'RE BUILDING THESE IS THAT AS WE DO FINISH BASEMENTS, PEOPLE LIVE THERE LONGER AND IT'S STICKIER.

AND THAT MEANS THAT'S WHAT THEY DESIRE.

AND SO WE WATCH THEM BUILD THEM AS IF THEY'RE THEIR OWN HOME.

SO THE ONLY DIFFERENCE, IN MY OPINION, BETWEEN SOMEONE WHO IS BUYING A HOME AND RENTING A HOME IS THEIR DURATION OF USE AND WHAT'S CAUSED THAT DURATION OF USE CHANGE OVER TIME HAS BEEN THAT WE USED TO THINK AT LEAST BACK WHEN I STARTED AND GOT MY FIRST JOB.

MY FIRST QUESTION IS WHAT'S THE PENSION? WHAT'S IT GOING TO LOOK LIKE WHEN I RETIRE? WELL, THINGS HAVE CHANGED A LITTLE BIT IN TERMS OF THE DEMOGRAPHICS, AND PEOPLE MORE LIKELY HAVE JOBS FOR A SHORTER PERIOD OF TIME.

THEY LIVE IN MULTIPLE LOCATIONS.

AND SO FROM THAT DURATION AND STUFF LIKE THAT, WE'RE FINDING THAT THERE IS A BIG DEMAND FOR A RENTAL PRODUCT VERSUS A FOR SALE PRODUCT.

AND THE CURRENT COSTS AND ESCALATION OF INTEREST RATES ARE MAKING IT MUCH LESS AFFORDABLE TO BUY HOMES.

VERY GOOD. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT ANSWERS THE QUESTIONS.

DID THAT ANSWER? BUT IN TERMS OF A FORMAL STUDY, NO, I DIDN'T DO A FORMAL STUDY.

A COUPLE OF THINGS. FIRST, THE QUESTION I POSED TO MR. SHORKEY ABOUT THE IMPLICATIONS OF DID YOU HAVE YOU DONE ANY SORT OF THOUGHTS ABOUT A LAYOUT THAT WOULD NOT ENCROACH INTO A WETLAND BUFFER AND WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE? AND THE SECOND ONE HAS TO DO WITH THESE LAST COMMENTS, BUT I'LL GO AHEAD.

I'LL LET HIM TALK IN A SECOND, BUT JUST A LITTLE BIT OF KNOWLEDGE.

WHEN WE FIRST GAVE A CONCEPT PLAN, THERE REALLY HAS BEEN NO WAY OTHER THAN THIS.

AND WE SHOWED THIS CONCEPT PLAN TO THE BOARD AND TO PLANNING PRIOR.

WHAT WE DID IS WE MADE A CONCERTED EFFORT BECAUSE THERE WAS SO MUCH WORRY.

WE HAD ONE TIME WE TALKED ABOUT MITIGATING WETLANDS, SO WE MADE THE BIGGEST EFFORT THAT WAS HUMANLY POSSIBLE TO MAKE THIS PROJECT VIABLE WITHOUT TOUCHING THESE WETLANDS.

SO WE DID NOT MITIGATE ANY OF THESE WETLANDS.

WE DID NOT MOVE ANY OF THESE WETLANDS.

WE DID EVERYTHING THAT WE THOUGHT THAT WAS ASKED OF US FROM OUR PRIOR INTERACTIONS WITH MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP.

SO WE DOWN ZONED IN TERMS OF THE NUMBER OF DENSITY, WE MINIMIZE THE IMPACT THE ABSOLUTE MINIMUM THAT IS POSSIBLE TO RUN ONE THROUGH AND STILL HAVE A ROAD COME THROUGH THIS ENTITY.

WE TOOK OUT ALL THE MULTI TEN UNIT BUILDINGS AND OTHER THINGS THAT WE HAD IN THERE, AND WE TRIED TO KEEP IT AS BASIC AS POSSIBLE TO ACCOMMODATE WHAT WE BELIEVED WAS THE DIRECTION AND THE FROM THE PRIOR BOARD AND OUR INTERACTIONS WITH YOU GUYS.

BUT THE ANSWER IN TERMS OF IF THAT ROAD'S NOT THERE, THEN IT WOULD BE SEGMENTED AND THERE IS NO GREAT WAY TO PUT IT IN THERE.

BUT WE DID EVERYTHING WE COULD, AND THIS IS VERY CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE SHOWED IN OUR CONCEPT PLAN TO YOU GUYS IN OUR PRIOR SUBMISSIONS.

THANKS FOR RECALLING THAT DISCUSSION.

I REMEMBER THAT THE CONCERNS THAT THE BOARD AND OTHERS RAISED AND THAT THERE ISN'T REALLY A WAY ON THAT PARCEL WITH THAT TIGHT CORNER TO GET A CONNECTIVITY FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER WITHOUT CUTTING THAT CORNER, EVEN THERE'S JUST NO WAY TO DO IT.

THE OTHER ONE, THOUGH, I'M SORRY, I WAS SCANNING FOR SOMETHING ELSE WHILE YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT OTHER PRODUCTS AND YOU USE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT FINISHED BASEMENTS? YES. WAS THAT REGARDING A DIFFERENT PROJECT OR THIS ONE? YES. IN DEWITT WE'RE OUT NOW IN QUARRY.

I LIVE IN A FINISHED BASEMENT IN A PRODUCT LIKE THIS.

OKAY. AND I LIVE USUALLY IN OUR PROPERTIES, IF I CAN, TO ENHANCE THE PRODUCT.

[00:25:05]

I MEAN, AN EXAMPLE WOULD BE AS SIMPLE AS WE HAVE A WALKING TRAIL.

AND I SAW SOMEONE ALWAYS USING AND I SAW A BUNCH OF PEOPLE IN THE EVENINGS WALKING THEIR DOGS AND SAID, HEY, YOU KNOW, IT MIGHT BE NICE TO HAVE LIGHTS SO THAT YOU COULD WALK ON THE TRAILS AND I COULD SEE THAT THERE WOULD BE SOME LANDSCAPING LIGHTS.

SO THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF THINGS I DO.

SO WE'RE COMMITTED TO OUR COMMUNITIES, WE'RE COMMITTED TO OUR CUSTOMERS.

AND OUR BEST WAY TO KNOW WHAT THEY WANT IS TO EXPERIENCE THEM.

NOW, I DON'T GO OUT OF MY WAY TO SAY THAT I LIVE THERE BECAUSE I DON'T WANT 20 PEOPLE KNOCKING ON MY DOOR.

[LAUGHTER] THE REALITY IS I WANT TO EXPERIENCE AND LIVE THIS SO THAT WE CAN MAKE IT THE BEST WE CAN.

NO, I GOTCHA. I WAS JUST WHEN I HEARD FINISHED BASEMENTS AND I WAS THINKING ABOUT WETLANDS, I WAS THINKING, OH MY GOSH, BUT IF THEY'RE NOT GOING IN HERE THAT'S.

WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO PUT A FINISHED BASEMENT IN THERE.

THERE IS GOING TO BE A BATHROOM BELOW THAT'S PIPED, UNFINISHED, AND THERE IS AN ABILITY TO DO THAT.

SO WE'RE GOING TO LET THE MARKET DRIVE WHAT THAT DEMAND IS.

WE'VE BEEN GOING TO A LOT OF THESE RENTAL HOME SEMINARS THAT ARE NATIONWIDE THAT ARE HAPPENING BECAUSE THIS PHENOMENA IS NOT JUST OKEMOS, MICHIGAN.

THIS IS NATIONWIDE. WHAT WE'RE DESCRIBING HERE, THIS DEMAND AND THIS TYPE OF HOUSING IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST GROWTH MARKETS IN THE COUNTRY.

THEY ARE SAYING THAT PEOPLE REALLY ARE WORKING FROM HOME.

AND THE BEST THING YOU COULD DO WAS PUT MORE BEDROOMS IN THERE.

NOW, FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, WE DIDN'T WANT TO COMMIT TO THAT.

SO WE LEFT THE FLEXIBILITY TO DO THAT, BUT WE WANTED TO ACCOMMODATE IT IF INDEED THAT'S WHAT THE MARKET DEMANDS.

GOTCHA. IF I COULD CLARIFY, THERE IS THE ENGINEERING DICTATES WE CAN PUT BASEMENTS AND IT IS OUR INTENTION TO PUT BASEMENTS ON EACH ONE OF THESE UNITS.

YES SORRY. THAT INCLUDES THE DUPLEX UNITS? YES. YES, IT DOES.

OKAY. I'VE NEVER PERSONALLY UNDERSTOOD DIGGING BASEMENTS IN MICHIGAN, BUT PLENTY OF PEOPLE SEEM TO GET AWAY WITH IT.

IF THE ENGINEERS SAY YES, THEN THAT'S FINE.

I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD BE PAYING PEOPLE TO FILL THEIR BASEMENTS WITH SAND, BUT THAT'S JUST ME.

I ALSO WANTED TO POINT OUT, I RECALL THAT NATURE TRAIL YOU'RE SPEAKING ABOUT NATURE TRAILS BEING PART OF THE EARLIER DISCUSSION.

I'M DELIGHTED TO SEE THAT IN THERE.

I THINK THAT'S AN EXCELLENT FEATURE.

AND ALSO THERE WAS A QUESTION IN THE PUBLIC COMMENT THAT WAS IN THE PACKET ABOUT WALKABILITY, AND I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT THAT DEVELOPMENT IS LIKE A HALF A MILE FROM TOM'S.

IT'S LIKE A MILE FROM ALDI, A LITTLE MORE THAN A MILE FROM MEIJER.

THAT'S AS FAR AS THIS TOWNSHIP GOES THAT'S ABOUT AS WALKABLE AS IT GETS RIGHT THERE.

NOW, THERE'S SOME BIG ROADS TO CROSS, BUT WE GOT BRAND NEW INTERSECTIONS.

SO IT ACTUALLY DOES MEET OUR GOAL OF PUTTING PEOPLE IN A WALKABLE DISTANCE.

AND I HEAR A LOT ABOUT THE MARKET FOR RENTERS BY CHOICE.

AND I THINK A LOT OF US STILL HAVE SOME PRECONCEPTIONS ABOUT RENTERS THAT DOES NOT APPLY TO THE MARKET OF RENTERS BY CHOICE, THAT PEOPLE WHO HAVE THE RESOURCES TO DO THAT AND THEY CHOOSE TO PURSUE THAT FINANCIAL MODEL.

SO JUST A QUARTER OF A MILE FROM THE HOME DEPOT, WHICH IS MUCH MORE IMPORTANT.

[LAUGHTER] I MEAN, JUST AS AN EXAMPLE, IN QUARRY, OUR MEDIAN INCOME IS IN THE $100,000 A YEAR RANGE, PROBABLY IS OUR MEDIAN.

AND I USE MEDIAN BECAUSE THERE'S PEOPLE WITH MORE AND LESS.

SO I TRY AND AVERAGE INSTEAD OF SAYING AVERAGE, THE MEDIAN, THE AVERAGE WOULD BE HIGHER.

THANK YOU. THE SINGLE FAMILY DWELLINGS AND THE DUPLEXES ARE BOTH TWO STORY'S.

I'M SORRY, DO YOU HAVE ELEVATIONS IN MIND? THAT THEY WERE PART OF YOUR PACKET.

I WAS TRYING TO DIG THROUGH IT.

BUT THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT OPTIONS.

I APOLOGIZE. NO, IT'S ALREADY 35 MEGS, SURE. NO. I UNDERSTAND.

DO YOU HAVE ANY? GREAT.

HE'S GOING TO GET TO THEM.

IT'S A GOOD SIZED PACKAGE, BUT.

OKAY, SO THAT'S THE DUPLEX.

AND THEN THERE'S FOUR DIFFERENT OPTIONS WITH DIFFERENT BRICK OR STONE OR CAN YOU ZOOM IN ON THAT AT ALL MATT OR NOT? I DON'T KNOW HOW IT'S GONNA LOOK ON THEIR SCREENS.

DO YOU SEE THAT ON. I DON'T KNOW HOW IT LOOKS ON YOUR SCREEN.

IT'S PRETTY CLEAR. PRETTY GOOD.

YEAH. SO I'LL JUST KEEP CLICKING THROUGH THESE SLOW.

YOU GET A GENERAL IDEA OF WHEN WE SAY WE'VE GOT DIFFERENT, SAME PRODUCT, JUST DIFFERENT VIEW.

SO IT LOOKS LIKE A REAL NEIGHBORHOOD AND NOT JUST A COOKIE CUTTER.

AND THIS IS THE SINGLE UNIT.

AND AGAIN, WE HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT OPTIONS ON THAT ONE.

GO BACK. COULD YOU PLEASE CALL OUT SOME OF THE MATERIALS

[00:30:04]

ON THE OUTSIDE? YEAH.

SO IT'LL BE A COMBINATION OF STONE AND SIDING.

SO THE FRONT ELEVATION WILL HAVE, WHETHER IT'S STONE PANELS OR BRICK PANELS, YOU CAN SEE THAT UNIT RIGHT THERE HAS A LOT OF STONE OR BRICK ON THE FRONT ELEVATION AND THEN THE OTHERS WILL BE A COMBINATION OF VINYL SIDING, SHAKES AND SHINGLES IN THE GABLE AREAS.

OKAY. SO THAT'S THE GENERAL DIRECTION.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? MR. RICHARDS. YEAH. THIS IS A LITTLE BIT OFF DIFFERENT THAN WHAT THE OTHER QUESTIONS ARE, BUT DO YOU HAVE ANY DEVELOPMENTS OF SIMILAR DEVELOPMENTS WHERE YOU HAVE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF THE UNITS ARE MORE AFFORDABLE IN TERMS OF GEARED TOWARDS PEOPLE WHO ARE IN LIMITED INCOME? THIS I MEAN, THIS PROJECT IS CLEARLY DESIGNED AS MARKET RATE.

IT IS NOT AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING DEVELOPMENT.

SO THIS AND YOU KNOW, TYPICALLY YOU DON'T SEE THOSE TOGETHER, IF YOU WILL.

YOU DON'T SEE MARKET RATE WITH LOWER INCOME HOUSING.

OKAY. AND WE, NOT RAJI, I DON'T THINK YOU HAVE THAT IN YOUR PORTFOLIO, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN.

WELL, YEAH.

THIS PRODUCT IS TO FILL A GAP FOR PEOPLE THAT ARE LIKE WORKING AT THE [INAUDIBLE] FOR PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO BE TRANSFERRING TO THE GM BATTERY PLANT THAT WE HAVE COMING HERE, HOPEFULLY OTHER OPPORTUNITIES THAT ARE COMING IN THE LANSING AREA.

SO THIS IS SOMEONE WHO WANTS TO WORK IS PROBABLY A PROFESSIONAL OR TWO PEOPLE THAT ARE SEMIPROFESSIONAL.

I'M NOT TRYING TO SAY THAT THEY CAN'T BE SOMETHING ELSE.

BUT THE POINT IS IT'S GOING TO BE THAT TYPE OF DEMAND AND THAT'S PULLING IN FROM THE GM WORKERS THAT'S GOING TO PULL IN FROM THE F-RIB.

IT'S GOING TO PULL IN FROM THE HOSPITAL AT MCLAREN.

IT'S ATTRACTING THAT TYPE OF CLIENTS, ATTRACTING PROFESSORS, IT'S ATTRACTING THAT KIND OF MARKET.

SO THAT'S WHAT THIS FOCUS, THIS PARTICULAR PRODUCT IS FOCUSED ON.

WE HAVE A WIDE RANGE OF PRODUCTS.

WE DON'T TYPICALLY DO LIKE A MSHDA AFFORDABLE TYPE OF PRODUCT IN TERMS OF QUOTE, AFFORDABLE.

BUT WE DO HAVE VARIOUS PRICING ON APARTMENTS THROUGHOUT THE LANSING AREA.

I MIGHT ADD ON TO THAT. THE ONE THING ABOUT THIS IS IT'S GOT A REALLY DIVERSE, THE PRODUCT'S DIVERSE.

SO YOU WILL GET EMPTY NESTERS, YOU WILL GET FAMILIES, THOSE SINGLE FAMILY UNITS WILL GET THE DETACHED UNITS WILL BE CONDUCIVE FOR EMPTY NESTERS AS WELL AS A FAMILY. THE REASON I BRING IT UP JUST IS NOT NECESSARILY A HYPOTHETICAL, BUT I DO A FAIR AMOUNT OF WORK WITH IN VOLUNTEER AREA WHERE PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR HOUSING AND THE LOW END HOUSING MARKET IS NON-EXISTENT IN OUR TOWNSHIP.

AND I KNOW ONE OF THE GOALS OF THE MASTER PLAN IS TO PROVIDE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

THIS AND NOTHING AGAINST YOUR PROJECT AND IT'S LOOKS LIKE A VERY NICE PROJECT THAT'S JUST I GUESS I HAD TO ASK QUESTIONS. AND IF YOU START LOOKING AT THE PRICING OF BUILDING MATERIALS AND THE INCREASES THAT HAVE OCCURRED IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, WE'RE SEEING NORTH OF 30% INCREASES JUST IN THE LAST 12 MONTHS.

AND SO WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT AFFORDABILITY, THAT IN ITSELF INHERENTLY CAUSES CONFLICT.

SO IT'S GOING TO TAKE COMMUNITY INVOLVEMENT, GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT, AND COOPERATION BETWEEN BUSINESSES TO REALLY, REALLY, REALLY STRETCH TO FIGURE OUT THE WAYS TO DO THAT.

IT'S A TREMENDOUS NEED AND IT'S SOMETHING WE WOULD LOVE TO DO, BUT WE HAVEN'T YET FIGURED OUT THE ECONOMICS TO DO IT.

AND IT'S, IN MY OPINION, GOING TO TAKE A COLLECTIVE ACTION OF A TOTALITY OF A BUNCH OF PEOPLE TO DO WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

AND WE THINK IT'S ESSENTIAL TO BE HONEST WITH YOU FOR OUR COMMUNITIES HERE.

BUT THE REALITY IS THAT WITH THE INFLATION AND THE INTEREST RATES THE WAY THEY ARE, IT'S GETTING WORSE, NOT BETTER.

I GUESS I WOULD MAKE ONE OTHER AT LEAST OBSERVATION.

IT SOUNDS LIKE MORE OF THE LARGER EMPLOYERS ARE LOOKING AT BRINGING THEIR EMPLOYEES BACK TO WORK AT LEAST TWO OR THREE DAYS A WEEK, AS OPPOSED TO ALLOWING FOLKS TO WORK FIVE DAYS A WEEK OR MOST OF THE TIME.

SO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S ALWAYS I THINK THERE'S ALWAYS A CONCERN THAT IF THERE ISN'T THE MARKET, THEN WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN TO THE UNITS AND WHAT CLIENTELE WILL YOU BE DRAWING AND HOW WILL THAT IMPACT THE RESIDENTS NEARBY? BUT AGAIN, THAT'S MORE CONJECTURE THAN IT IS FACT AT THIS POINT.

WE'VE OWNED OUR UNITS FOR A VERY, VERY LONG TIME.

SO IF YOU WANT TO LOOK AT SOME OF WHAT OUR PRODUCTS LOOK LIKE, PLEASE, PLEASE COME OUT AND VISIT US OUT AT ASPEN LAKES OR PLEASE VISIT US AT QUARRY OR QUARRY VILLAGE AND YOU'LL

[00:35:04]

SEE 10, 15 YEARS LATER, THE QUALITY OF THE INDIVIDUALS THAT LIVE THERE.

AND WE WANT TO BRING THIS TO MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.

WE WANT TO BRING WHAT WE'RE HAVING SUCCESS AT, AT OTHER COMMUNITIES IN THE REGION TO MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP.

AND ALTHOUGH I'VE MOVED OUT BECAUSE I'M LIVING IN ONE OF OUR COMMUNITIES, THE REALITY IS THIS IS OUR HOME AND WE BELIEVE IN WHAT WE'RE DOING.

SO IT'S NOT BECAUSE YOU COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE HERE.

NO. I SOLD MY PLACE ON MY LAKE AND MOVED THERE.

BUT IF I'M HONEST WITH YOU, I LIKE IT BETTER.

JUST BETWEEN ALL OF US HERE.

I DO HAVE A QUESTION.

HAS THERE BEEN ANY PREDICTED IMPACT ON THE SCHOOL SYSTEM? I CAN TALK IN TERMS OF AT LEAST WHAT I'M SEEING OUT AT QUARRY BECAUSE I CAN'T SPEAK TO THIS.

SO I'LL GIVE YOU A FEELING.

THERE IS A LARGE, DIVERSE MARKET SEGMENT AND THERE IS A LOT OF CHILDREN IN OUR COMMUNITY.

SO IF WE'RE LOOKING FOR SCHOOL CHILDREN, I CAN TELL YOU IT'S PULLED IN SCHOOL AGE CHILDREN THROUGHOUT.

BUT I ALSO SEE EMPTY NESTERS SITTING NEXT TO THEM.

AND PART OF THE REASON I'M LIVING IN THESE COMMUNITIES IS TO LOOK AT WHAT THAT DYNAMICS LOOKS LIKE.

AND IT'S HEALTHY FROM MY PERSPECTIVE.

MAYBE I'M BIASED A LITTLE BIT, BUT I'M PROUD OF WHAT I SEE IN TERMS OF THAT INTERACTION.

AND THERE IS A LOT OF KIDS THAT ARE MOVING IN THERE, BY THE WAY A LOT OF PETS TOO.

SO IF YOU LIKE DOGS, THERE'S A LOT OF DOGS AND A LOT OF KIDS WHO LIVE IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? IT'S KIND OF HARD TO SEE.

MAYBE WE COULD GET AN AREA.

I WAS JUST TRYING TO FOLLOW ALONG WITH THE PEDESTRIAN CIRCULATION.

AND I APPLAUD HIM FOR LIVING IN ONE OF HIS DEVELOPMENTS.

I THINK WE COULD USE MORE OF THAT IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

BUT JUST BY LIVING THERE, YOU HAVE A STAKE IN IT.

BECAUSE THERE'S A SIDEWALK ON BOTH SIDES OF THE ROAD, EITHER SIDE OF THE ROAD, ON CENTRAL PARK AND SIDEWALKS ON EITHER SIDE OF THE ROAD AND THE CURB.

SO, YOU KNOW, SPEAKING OF WALKABILITY OR ACCESSIBILITY.

SIDEWALKS ON BOTH SIDES, YOU HAVE NATURE TRAILS THROUGHOUT MUCH OF IT WITH THE INTEGRATED WITH THE GAZEBOS AND THE DOG PARKS.

AND SO THAT INTERACTIVE THE COMMUNITY GARDENS ARE WITHIN THOSE BIG, BEAUTIFUL COMMON AREAS.

AND SO BUT FROM A WALKABILITY STANDPOINT, WE TIE INTO YOUR WALKS ON EITHER SIDE OF THE PROJECT ON THE MAIN ROADS, AND YOU DO HAVE THAT FULL INTERCONNECTIVITY WITH THE WALKS ON BOTH SIDES.

I LIVE SOUTH OF THE AREA AND THERE'S QUITE A BIT OF OPTIONS THERE.

JUST LOCALLY, YOU COULD PICK UP A NEWSPAPER, YOU COULD PICK UP MAIL, WHATNOT.

AND I'M JUST, YOU KNOW, CENTRAL PARK AND GRAND RIVER, THERE WILL BE A PEDESTRIAN WALKWAY ON GRAND RIVER.

SO THAT CONNECTS WITH THE EXISTING.

CAN YOU, BRIAN, TELL ME YOU DID IN GENERAL TERMS WHERE THE CATA BUS STOP IS? IT'S IN HERE.

YEAH, IT'S ON NO DOUBT. I'VE SEEN IT, BUT IT JUST HASN'T REGISTERED.

IT DOES. CENTRAL PARK DRIVE FURTHER NORTH OF THE SITE, RIGHT? YEAH. YES, IT'S ON PAGE THREE, ACTUALLY.

THERE'S ONE RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET, TOO.

OH, OKAY. YEAH, IT'S JUST THERE'S ONE JUST SOUTH OF THE PROJECT, RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET.

YEAH, I THINK THAT'S THE SOUTHBOUND.

YEAH, BUT THE OTHER ONE'S NORTH OF THE PROJECT ON OUR SIDE OF THE STREET.

THAT MAKE SENSE? AT NEWMAN ROAD.

IT MIGHT. I THINK IT'S A LITTLE PAST THERE, BUT YEAH, IT'S RIGHT THERE SOMEWHERE.

I'M SORRY. IT'S BEEN A FEW MONTHS SINCE WE PUT THIS STUFF ON THE PLAN, AND THAT WASN'T ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE LOOKED AT.

THAT'S NEWMAN ROAD. OKAY.

I WAS JUST TRYING TO IN MY MIND OKAY AND I WAS TRYING TO THINK OF THE ONE THAT'S EAST OF THE CLOSEST BUS STOP IS ON GRAND RIVER, EAST OF CENTRAL PARK DRIVE AND SOUTH OF THE PROJECT SITE.

SO THAT SEEMS LIKE THAT'S TOWARDS TOM'S.

YES. YEAH, THAT'S THE EASTBOUND 48 GOING OUT TO WILLIAMS OKAY.

THIS IS THE NUMBER 22 COMING UP INTO THE MALL I THINK.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

DO YOU PLAN TO BUILD THIS IN PHASES OR DO YOU SEE IT ALL GOING IN AT APPROXIMATELY THE SAME TIME? YOU ALSO TALKED ABOUT OPTIONS, AND I'M WONDERING HOW THAT WORKS.

AND THIS IS PROBABLY OUTSIDE OF OUR SCOPE, BUT HOW THAT WORKS WITH THE RENTAL DEVELOPMENT.

[00:40:04]

DO YOU IDENTIFY YOUR POTENTIAL RENTERS AND LET THEM CUSTOMIZE THE BUILD LIKE SOME AN OWNER WOULD? OR ARE YOU? WELL, THERE WILL BE AN OPTION FOR THAT FINISHED BASEMENT.

SO AND THEN THE ELEVATIONS WILL BE INTERSPERSED THROUGHOUT TO PROVIDE THAT VARIETY.

BUT AS FAR AS THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE, THE WAY THE SITE WORKS WITH THE ENGINEERING, THE SEWER, THE WATER, THE STORM, THE ROADS THAT WILL ALL BE DEVELOPED IN ONE PHASE, CERTAINLY.

AS FAR AS CONSTRUCTION SINGLE PHASE.

OKAY. SO THAT'S THE HEAD OF CONSTRUCTION TELLING YOU ONE SINGLE PHASE.

OKAY. SO THERE YOU GO. I HAVE A QUESTION THAT REALLY HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU FOLKS, BUT MAYBE YOU CAN ANSWER IT.

HAS THE DISASTER IN FLORIDA IMPACTED CONSTRUCTION HERE IN MICHIGAN OR DO YOU EXPECT IT WILL? I MEAN, SURE.

OKAY.

GREG CISLO DTN 4010 SNEAKY LANE, HOLT MICHIGAN.

THE ANSWER IS YES.

AFTER IT HAPPENED, LUMBER STARTED GOING BACK UP AGAIN.

WE'RE DEFINITELY GOING TO SEE SOME SHORTAGES, BUT BY THE TIME WE GET GOING ON THIS AND WE GET OUT OF THE GROUND, WHICH WILL BE SPRINGTIME, THINGS SHOULD BE LIGHTNING UP.

SO THEY SHOULD BE BETTER. BUT I MEAN, EVERYTHING DRYWALL, YOU NAME IT, APPLIANCES, IT'S SLOW ON EVERYTHING.

THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT WOULD HAPPEN. YEAH.

SO ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS THIS IS AN OBSERVATION AND AND I APPRECIATE THE INTENT OF THE PROJECT, BUT BEING ON THIS COMMISSION FOR FIVE OR SEVEN YEARS OR WHATEVER IT'S BEEN, I'VE COME TO THE CONCLUSION AND HAVING GROWN UP IN THIS COMMUNITY FROM FIFTH GRADE, THAT WE ALL LIVE IN HOUSES THAT SOMEBODY DIDN'T WANT BUILT AND HAD REASONABLE OBJECTIONS TOO.

AND PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT PROCESS IS THAT THAT THERE ARE CERTAIN THERE ARE ALWAYS GOING TO BE SACRIFICES, BUT THERE'S ALSO GOING TO BE GAINS.

AND I THINK I'M SAYING THIS IN GENERAL TO ANYBODY THAT MIGHT BE VIEWING OUR DECISIONS NEED TO BE MADE WEIGHING THOSE FACTORS AND DECIDING RATHER, THE BENEFITS OUTWEIGH THE DOWNSIDES.

AND, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IN TERMS OF NEED AND ALL THAT.

BUT I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT PEOPLE WERE BUYING HOUSES WHEN THE MARKET WAS INTEREST RATES WERE AT 11% AND THAT WAS IN THE LATE SEVENTIES, EARLY EIGHTIES.

AND OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE MAKING 14 AND 15% ON YOUR INVESTMENT.

SO, YOU KNOW, I GET THE INTEREST RATE ARGUMENT TO AN EXTENT, BUT I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE ALSO EQUITY AND VALUE ISSUES.

SO FOR ME IT'S THAT WEIGHING AND THE ARGUMENTS THAT WE'VE READ AND THE CONCERNS THAT THE PEOPLE AROUND IT HAVE IN TERMS OF PRESERVING SOME OF THE NATURAL FEATURES AND SO FORTH ARE CERTAINLY LEGITIMATE ARGUMENTS.

AND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT HOUSING THAT PROVIDES A REASONABLE OPTION FOR THE KINDS OF THINGS THAT ARE GOING TO BE HAPPENING IN THIS AREA ARE ALSO REASONABLE ARGUMENTS.

AND I THINK THAT AS A COMMISSION, OUR TASK IS TO SAY WHICH IS GREATER, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK WE HAVE TO MAKE OUR DECISION THAT WAY. WE DO HAVE A VALUE IN THIS TOWNSHIP ABOUT PRESERVING GREENSPACES AND PRESERVING WILDLIFE AREAS. AND, YOU KNOW, SO THERE IS A VALUE TO A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF PRESERVATION.

SO THOSE ARGUMENTS SHOULD NOT GO UNATTENDED.

IN MY OPINION.

WE ALSO HAVE A NEED, AS YOU POINTED OUT, FOR PLACES THAT PEOPLE CAN RESIDE AND BECAUSE OF THE WORK ENVIRONMENTS ARE CHANGING AND SO FORTH.

[00:45:06]

SO THIS IS NOT GOING I DON'T THINK IT'S A CUT AND DRY DECISION FOR ME PERSONALLY, AND I DON'T THINK IT'S AN EASY DECISION.

AND WHAT I REALIZE IS, HOWEVER, WE DECIDE SACRIFICES WILL BE MADE ON ONE SIDE AND THERE WILL BE GAINS.

SO THAT'S JUST MY GENERAL OBSERVATION.

BUT THE DEVELOPMENT THAT I LIVE IN, THERE ARE ALL KINDS OF REASONS WHY PEOPLE DIDN'T WANT IT, BECAUSE FOR THE SAME ARGUMENTS THAT WE'RE HEARING NOW AND A LOT OF THE SUBDIVISIONS AND WHEN I LIVED HERE, THERE WERE THREE AND NOW THERE'S QUITE A FEW MORE.

SO THIS IS NOT AN EASY DECISION.

AND I PERSONALLY AM NOT TAKING IT LIGHTLY.

I JUST WANT TO SHARE THAT I ECHO MANY OF YOUR CONCERNS AND I FOUND IT INTERESTING THAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO APPROVE A SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR SOMETHING GREATER THAN 25,000 SQUARE FEET.

BUT I MEAN, COMBING THROUGH THE DOCUMENTS, I DIDN'T SEE EXACTLY WHAT THAT NUMBER EQUATED TO.

IT'S EASY TO CALCULATE WHEN YOU HAVE THE NUMBER OF BUILDINGS, AND THEY'RE ALL ROUGHLY 2000 SQUARE FEET.

SO IT'S 230,000 ISH, GIVE OR TAKE TOTAL.

THAT'S A LOT, A LOT MORE THAN 25,000 SQUARE FEET.

SO I FOUND THAT INTERESTING.

AND ALSO LOOKING BACK TO THE 2017 MASTER PLAN, I JUST WANT TO READ FROM PAGE 64 INCOME DISPARITY.

APPROXIMATELY 60% OF THE POPULATION OWNS THEIR HOME, WHILE 40% RENT HOMEOWNERS TEND TO HAVE HIGHER INCOME, BE OLDER IN AGE AND HAVE LONG TENURES IN THE COMMUNITY.

ALTERNATIVELY, RENTERS ARE GENERALLY YOUNGER, HAVE BEEN IN THE COMMUNITY FOR SHORTER PERIODS OF TIME AND HAVE LOWER LEVELS OF INCOME, WHILE THE MEDIAN HOME VALUE IN THE TOWNSHIP IS $181,300.

WOW. THOSE WERE THE DAYS.

THE NUMBER OF HOUSING OPTIONS VALUED BETWEEN 50,000 AND 200,000 ARE DECLINING IN THE TOWNSHIP, MAKING IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR YOUNG PROFESSIONALS AND FAMILIES TO MOVE INTO THE COMMUNITY. MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOME FOR HOMEOWNERS AT THIS TIME IN 2017 WAS $92,971.

SORRY, THAT WAS IN 2014.

THIS WAS PUBLISHED OBVIOUSLY IN 2017, RENTER OCCUPIED HOUSEHOLDS EARNED $30,000.

HOMEOWNERS SPEND NEARLY 1,400 DOLLARS PER MONTH ON HOUSING AND RENTERS SPEND $800.

I HAVE A LOT OF YOUNG PROFESSIONAL FRIENDS.

NOT ONE OF THEM IS SAYING WE NEED MORE EXPENSIVE HOUSING OPTIONS IN THIS COMMUNITY.

ALL OF THEM ARE SAYING, WHERE ARE THE HOUSES THAT I CAN AFFORD? WHERE ARE THE PLACES THAT I CAN AFFORD LIVING? AND I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE IS A NICHE AND A NEED FOR HIGH END RENTAL PROPERTIES.

I DO UNDERSTAND THAT.

HOWEVER, THAT NICHE IS NOT IN THE DEMOGRAPHIC OF PEOPLE THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, 25 TO 40 YEARS OF AGE.

GENERALLY SPEAKING.

I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT POINT.

I THINK THAT THIS TOWNSHIP HAS A LIMITED AMOUNT OF SPACE, BE IT TO PRESERVE FOR GREENSPACE OR TO DEVELOP IN A WAY THAT MATCHES OUR GOALS FOR OUR MASTER PLAN AND ALLOWS US TO PROVIDE HOUSING FOR PEOPLE THAT THEY CAN AFFORD.

EVERYWHERE I LOOK, THERE ARE NEW DEVELOPMENTS FOR THIS DEMOGRAPHIC ONLY, AND THAT IS FRIGHTENING TO ME.

THE QUESTION. I THINK IT MIGHT BE FOR STAFF.

I REMEMBER IT TOOK A SECOND FOR ME TO RECALL THIS COMING BEFORE US LAST TWO YEARS AGO LAST YEAR.

AND I REMEMBER ONE OF MY CONCERNS AT THAT POINT WAS THE DENSITY OF THE PROJECT, WHICH HAS NOW BEEN MINIMIZED.

BUT WITH OUR APPROVAL, IS THAT SORT OF THEY ARE LIMITED THEN TO THE PROPOSAL IN FRONT OF US, OR WOULD THEY STILL BE ALLOWED TO BUILD TO WHAT THE REZONING ALLOWS? NO, THE CONCEPT PLAN WOULD BE PART OF THE APPROVAL.

OKAY THANK YOU. THAT'S HELPFUL.

I'D LIKE TO MAKE A COMMENT IN RESPONSE TO COMMISSIONER SNYDER.

THERE IS A DIFFERENCE.

I'VE LIVED IN THIS COMMUNITY FOR 50 YEARS.

I'M NOT GOING TO TELL YOU HOW OLD I AM.

BUT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN STUDENT RENTAL AND THE KIND OF RENTAL THAT THESE GENTLEMEN ARE PREDICTING,

[00:50:04]

WHICH IS GOING TO BE VISITING PROFESSORS OR SCIENTISTS OR MIDDLE CLASS PROFESSIONALS WHO SIMPLY DON'T WANT TO BUY FOR VARIOUS REASONS, MAYBE BECAUSE THEY ONLY ANTICIPATE BEING IN THIS COMMUNITY FOR THREE OR FOUR YEARS AND THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE HASSLE OF BUYING AND THEN SELLING.

AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH ANTICIPATING AND PREPARING FOR THAT SEGMENT OF THE MARKET AS LONG AS WE DON'T IGNORE THE OTHER PARTS.

NOW THEY'VE IT IS FROM WHAT I CAN SEE FROM THE PROJECTIONS THAT THE LAND USE APPEARS TO BE APPROPRIATE TO ME FOR THAT AREA. I'VE DRIVEN PAST THAT FOR YEARS AND NOTHING HAS HAPPENED AT ALL THERE.

THE LAND USE APPEARS TO BE WELL ADJUSTED TO THE COMMUNITY NEEDS.

BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, TO ME, IT PROVIDES A VERY SPECIFIC TYPE OF HOUSING FOR A VERY SPECIFIC TYPE OF HOME USER, NOT HOMEOWNER, BUT HOME USER. SOMEBODY COMING HERE FROM GERMANY TO STUDY AT THE F-RIB OR TO DO SOME SCIENCE AT THE F-RIB FOR TWO AND A HALF YEARS IS NOT GOING TO WANT TO BUY A $300,000 HOME IN OUR COMMUNITY.

HE'S GOING TO WANT TO FIND A PLACE TO RENT, BUT HE'S NOT GOING TO WANT TO RENT AN 800 SQUARE FOOT, TWO BEDROOM, ONE BATHROOM APARTMENT LIKE A STUDENT WOULD.

AND I THINK THIS IS GEARED FOR THAT TYPE OF PERSON.

AND FRANKLY, AS LONG AS WE DON'T ELIMINATE OPPORTUNITIES FOR PEOPLE IN LOWER INCOME BRACKETS, I THINK THERE IS A PLACE FOR THIS. AND WE ALSO HAVE TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION, AS FAR AS I CAN TELL, AND I'VE BEEN WATCHING THIS FAIRLY CLOSELY, THE MARKET IS REALLY CHANGING.

A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE NO LONGER BUYING HOUSES BECAUSE THEY CAN'T PREDICT WHERE THE MORTGAGE IS GOING TO BE OR WHAT KIND OF RATES THEY'RE GOING TO BE PAYING, BUT THEY KNOW IF THEY'RE GOING TO BE RENTING A HOUSE FOR $3,000 A MONTH, THEY'RE GOING TO GET A HECK OF A NICE HOUSE AND THEY CAN LIVE THERE FOR THREE OR FOUR YEARS AND THEN GO BACK TO WHEREVER THEY CAME FROM. SO I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH WHAT YOU ARE PRESENTING HERE AS LONG AS THE BOARD RECOGNIZES THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE ELIMINATING THE OTHER END OF THE SCALE. AND SOMETIMES MY PASSION PRECEDES ME.

SO I TOOK THE TIME TO LOOK UP ASPEN LAKES HERE IN HOLT.

AND IT'S ABSOLUTELY STUNNING.

[LAUGHTER] I WOULD LOVE TO LIVE THERE.

SO I'M NOT DENYING THE BEAUTY OF THIS PROPERTY OR THIS PROJECT OR THE POTENTIAL THAT IT HAS.

AND I WOULD AGREE THAT THERE'S A PLACE FOR DEVELOPMENTS LIKE THIS.

OF COURSE, I JUST IN MY SHORT TIME ON THE COMMISSION THIS IS WE'VE GOT HASLETT VILLAGE SQUARE, WHICH IS A SIMILAR NICHE.

I MEAN, THERE ARE ALSO RENTAL PROPERTIES AND THEY'RE IN A SIMILAR PRICE POINT.

THERE'S JUST I, OF COURSE, WOULDN'T WANT TO ELIMINATE OPPORTUNITIES FOR PEOPLE IN A LOWER MIDDLE INCOME BRACKET.

BUT I THINK THAT WHEN WE'RE PLANNING AND APPROVING DIFFERENT DEVELOPMENTS THAT CONTINUE TO BE IN THESE UPPER INCOME BRACKET TIERS, THAT IN SOME WAYS IT DOES ELIMINATE THOSE THE OPPORTUNITIES FOR ALTERNATIVES.

AND I'M NOT EVEN TALKING ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

YOU KNOW, THE DEFINITION OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, HOUSING, I'M TALKING ABOUT JUST MIDDLE OF THE ROAD TYPE HOUSING, BE IT RENTAL OR HOMEOWNERSHIP, I GUESS SORT OF RELATED.

IT'D BE GOOD TO IF WE COULD GET SOME STAFF A LISTING OF THE PROJECTS THAT ARE OUT THERE AND HOW THEY COMPARE IN TERMS OF THE DEMOGRAPHICS THEY'RE SEEKING BECAUSE WE HAVE OKEMOS DOWNTOWN AND THERE'S A FAIR NUMBER IN THE HUNDREDS OF APARTMENTS THERE.

WE HAVE THE HASLETT SQUARE WITH SEVERAL HUNDRED, SO I GUESS I WOULD BE INTERESTED IN THE NUMBER OF UNITS AND WHETHER THE TARGET IS SIMILAR IN TERMS OF THE ARE YOU WONDERING WHAT'S APPROVED AND UPCOMING NOW KIND OF A THING. OKAY.

YEAH. YES THAT HAVEN'T BEEN BUILT, THAT'S NUMBER ONE.

I GUESS RELATED TO THIS PROJECT, I GUESS THE THOUGHT CAME TO MIND THAT I WANT TO SAY WAY BACK WHEN DUPLEXES WERE LOOKED AT AS A MEANS FOR, SAY, A YOUNGER MARRIED COUPLE TO ACTUALLY OWN THE DUPLEX, RENT HALF OF IT AND OWN THE OTHER HALF.

[00:55:01]

AND THEN THEY'RE BUILDING EQUITY AND THEY'RE THE LANDLORD OR THEY HAVE CONTROL OF THE PROPERTY.

AND SO HOW DOES THAT WORK IN TERMS OF THE QUESTION CAME UP ABOUT WHETHER THEY WERE OWNED, IT WOULD NEED A REZONING, BUT IF YOU'VE GOT TWO UNITS AND ONE'S BEING OCCUPIED BY THE OWNER OR THE OTHER NOT BY THE OWNER, THEN IS THAT, YOU KNOW, IS IT POTENTIALLY POSSIBLE TO BUILD THAT SAME PROJECT ON THIS KIND OF PROPERTY? BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND THE ZONING ISSUE HERE IN TERMS OF SINGLE FAMILY VERSUS MULTIFAMILY, BUT THE FACT THAT THESE ARE ALL RENTERS AND AGAIN, THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH RENTERS EXCEPT IN MY OPINION, I'VE BEEN HERE ONLY 34 YEARS NOW.

MERIDIAN TOWNSHIP WAS IN TERMS OF THE SCALE BACK 34 YEARS AGO AND 50 YEARS OR MORE.

THE HOMEOWNERS ARE WAY OVER HERE AND THERE WERE VERY FEW RENTALS.

NOW AND THE RENTALS PRETTY MUCH EITHER THEIR BALANCED OR THEY'RE MORE THAN THE PEOPLE THAT OWN PROPERTIES AND LIVE IN THEM HERE. AND THAT'S A DIFFERENT DYNAMIC IN TERMS OF JUST PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO BE HERE SHORT TERM VERSUS LONG TERM.

SO I THINK THERE'S SOME VALUE NOT ONLY FROM THE VANTAGE POINT OF THE COMMUNITY IS HAVING A MORE BALANCED HOMEOWNER VERSUS RENTER RATIO HERE TOO.

AND AGAIN, IT'S SORT OF, I GUESS, AND LOOKING AT THE ABILITY FOR SOMEBODY TO OWN THE DUPLEX AND RENT HALF OF IT, IF THAT FITS THIS KIND OF A, FITS THIS TYPE OF REZONING.

AGAIN, I KNOW THIS IS A QUESTION I'M JUST ASKING, SO YOU MAY NOT HAVE THE ANSWER RIGHT NOW, BUT I WOULD LIKE THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION AT SOME POINT.

COULD IT BE DONE UNDER THE ZONING? YEAH. NOT, ARE THEY DOING IT.

THAT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT QUESTION.

I MEAN, THEIR PROPOSAL. BUT CAN IT BE DONE? OKAY.

RESIDENTIAL. BUT ARE THERE MORE THAN JUST STRICTLY A NON OWNER OCCUPIED RENTAL HOUSING VERSUS AT LEAST PARTIALLY OWNED? AND I THINK IT ADDRESSES COMMISSIONER SNYDER'S QUESTION ABOUT AFFORDABILITY IN THAT OF SOMEBODY WITH WHO IS GETTING HALF OF IS COVERING HALF THE COSTS OF THE UNIT MAKES THAT A LITTLE MORE AFFORDABLE.

I'LL LOOK AND SEE WELL I'LL FIND THE ANSWER FOR YOU.

OKAY.

I REALLY LIKE THE IDEA OF US BEING ABLE TO SEE AN INVENTORY, I GUESS, OF LIKE WHAT'S OUT THERE IN THE TOWNSHIP AS FAR AS HOUSING AND WHAT ARE THE MEANS.

I GUESS I WOULD ADD TOO THAT THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S AT JOLLY AND OKEMOS ROAD.

THEY'RE BUILDING TWO OR THREE MORE UNITS THERE.

THOSE ARE RELATIVELY NEW.

THEY'RE SOMEWHAT THE SAME DEMOGRAPHIC HIGH END RENTALS TOO.

SO I WOULD PUT THOSE IN THE SAME MIX WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT.

RIGHT? COMMISSIONER CORDILL.

THESE ARE VALID DISCUSSIONS, BUT WE HAVE AN APPLICATION IN FRONT OF US AND I WOULD SUGGEST HAVING NOT THE OFFICIAL VOTE, BUT A.

STRAW VOTE. A STRAW VOTE. WE WERE JUST.

GO AHEAD. SO, AGAIN, I THINK MAYBE A QUESTION FOR STAFF BEING THAT THIS IS ALL ONE OWNER AND THEY'RE BUILDING, THEY STILL HAVE TO MEET ALL OF WHAT WOULD BE A SETBACK REQUIREMENT FOR INDIVIDUAL UNITS.

THAT IS CORRECT. OKAY.

SO, LIKE OK.

THANK YOU. I GUESS MY COMMENT, AFTER [INAUDIBLE] IS I AGREE WITH THAT, BUT ALSO POINT OUT THAT THIS PROPERTY HAS BEEN UNDEVELOPED FOR MANY YEARS.

WE HAVE A PROPOSAL ON THE TABLE AND IF WE WERE NOT TO APPROVE IT, WHO'S TO SAY THAT IT WON'T REMAIN UNDEVELOPED FOREVER? AND THESE ARE PROPERTY OWNERS THAT HAVE A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF RIGHT TO UTILIZE THEIR PROPERTY.

AND OUR DECISION SHOULD BE BASED ON WHETHER IT'S AN APPROPRIATE USE AND FITS IN WITH THE AREA AND THE COMMUNITY NEEDS.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE I COME DOWN.

IT OCCURS TO ME THAT THERE'S ANOTHER ISSUE HERE, AND THAT IS THIS IS A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN THAT'S BEEN PUT TOGETHER.

[01:00:06]

IF WE DISAPPROVE THIS AND LEAVE IT OPEN TO THE POSSIBILITY OF INDIVIDUAL DEVELOPMENT, WE LOSE A LOT OF THE CONTROL OVER THE PROPERTY THAT THEY ARE PROPOSING.

IF IT'S A UNIFIED PLAN AND THAT'S ALMOST ALWAYS BENEFICIAL OVER SCATTERBRAIN TYPE OF SITUATION.

THERE'S ALSO A POSSIBILITY OF THINKING OF THAT PROPERTY NOT BEING DEVELOPED, PERIOD, TO PRESERVE.

YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME ECOLOGICAL ARGUMENTS THAT COULD BE MADE.

THERE'S SOME, YOU KNOW, AND SOME OF THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE RAISED THEIR CONCERNS, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF WILDLIFE AND SO FORTH.

SO WE'RE ASSUMING THAT THE PROPERTY NEEDS NECESSARILY NEEDS TO BE DEVELOPED.

WELL, THAT IN MY MIND, THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY THE CASE.

AND THAT'S WHY THE DECISION IS CUT AND DRY.

IS MAYBE PEOPLE THINK IT IS BECAUSE THERE IS AN OPTION TO LET IT BE.

AND, YOU KNOW, AT WHAT POINT DO WE NOT DEVELOP? YOU KNOW, AND AT WHAT POINT DO WE SAY, YOU KNOW, THIS FOREST REALLY JUST NEEDS TO REMAIN A FOREST AND WE CAN MAKE ALL KINDS OF GOOD ARGUMENTS WHY IT'D BE NEAT TO HAVE HOUSES THERE.

BUT SO IT REALLY IS A BALANCE ISSUE AND I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THE REASONING FOR HAVING A DEVELOPMENT LIKE THIS.

THERE'S ALL KINDS OF REASONABLE ARGUMENTS FOR IT.

BUT THE FLIP SIDE OF THAT IS, YOU KNOW, AT WHAT POINT DO WE NOT NEED TO DEVELOP ANYMORE OR AT WHAT POINT DO WE SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT, HERE'S A PIECE OF LAND THAT WE CAN JUST LEAVE IT ALONE AND LET IT BE. AND IT'S NOT LIKE THIS COMMUNITY IS HURTING IN TERMS OF REVENUE OR ANYTHING ELSE.

AND IN TERMS OF THE SCHOOL ISSUE, YOU KNOW, THAT LARGE OF A DEVELOPMENT IS GOING TO PUT PRESSURE ON THAT PARTICULAR AREA IN TERMS OF SCHOOL.

CORNELL, THEY DON'T KNOW IF THEY'RE GOING TO REMOVE IT, REBUILD IT.

YOU KNOW, THAT WHOLE DISCUSSION IS GOING ON AND YOU'RE MOVING PEOPLE OUT THAT WAY.

SO, I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF ISSUES FLOWING HERE.

AND SO I JUST THINK THAT FOR ME PERSONALLY, THERE'S MORE TO IT THAN JUST THIS OR THIS.

AND I DON'T THINK WE CAN ALWAYS IGNORE THE OPTION OF JUST SAYING, YOU KNOW WHAT, IT'S OKAY THAT THIS PROPERTY ISN'T DEVELOPED.

OKAY. SIR.

CAN I RESPOND TO THAT, PLEASE? THERE'S A CONDITIONAL REZONING ON THE PARCEL AND IT WAS APPROVED FOR RD UP TO EIGHT UNITS TO THE ACRE.

NOW, IF THIS CONDITIONAL REZONING ULTIMATELY IS NOT GRANTED, IT WOULD REVERT BACK TO THE RA, OKAY WHICH IT IS ZONED.

SO IT COULD BE A USE BY RIGHT WHERE IT COULD BE DEVELOPED UNDER RA.

RIGHT, WITHOUT LEVELS OF APPROVAL, WITHOUT CONTROLS LIKE YOU HAVE HERE.

SO YOU JUST IT BASICALLY BECOMES A USE BY RIGHT AND YOU DEVELOP IT UNDER THE RA.

THIS IS A WELL SITUATED PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT WILL BE DEVELOPED.

AND SO WHAT WE ARE PROPOSING IS SOMETHING THAT DOES GIVE YOU THE CONTROL, DOES ADDRESS A MARKET NEED.

AND SO WE YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE INTENT OF WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE.

OH, ONE SECOND, HOLLY.

IF A STRAW POLL WERE TAKEN, I WOULD VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS PROJECT.

THEY MORE THAN MET THE CONCEPTUAL PLAN AND DENSITY.

THEY CUT IT IN HALF.

[01:05:01]

I THINK WE NEED TO TAKE A STEP FURTHER.

YEAH, NO, I AGREE WITH YOU.

IF THERE WERE NO MORE COMMENTS, I WAS GOING TO ASK FOR A STRAW VOTE.

I WOULD LIKE STAFF TO CLARIFY RIGHT NOW WHAT WE'RE VOTING ON THOUGH, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE UNDERSTAND WHAT'S WHAT WILL THE ULTIMATE PROPOSAL BE? YOU KNOW, WE'RE STRAW POLLING.

BUT WHAT I WILL BRING OUT, BASED ON YOUR STRAW VOTE, I WILL BRING TWO PROPOSED RESOLUTIONS TO YOU IN NOVEMBER.

ONE WILL BE TO APPROVE SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPMENT IN THE RD DISTRICT, WHICH IS A SPECIAL USE BECAUSE IT'S A MULTIFAMILY [INAUDIBLE].

BUT SINGLE FAMILY IS ALLOWED AS IN AN OVERALL DEVELOPMENT.

IT'S A SPECIAL USE PERMIT.

YOU WILL APPROVE THAT.

YOU WILL RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF AN OVERALL DEVELOPMENT THAT'S OVER 25,000 SQUARE FEET IN SIZE THAT WILL GO TO THE BOARD.

THAT WILL BE A FORMALITY AT THAT POINT, QUITE FRANKLY.

SO TWO RESOLUTIONS.

SO YOU ARE ESSENTIALLY VOTING ON THE CONCEPT PLAN THAT YOU SEE IN FRONT OF YOU.

OKAY. ALL RIGHT.

THEN THE CHAIR CALLS FOR A STRAW VOTE ON THE CONCEPT AS IT HAS BEEN PRESENTED TO THE COMMISSION, THIS EVENING.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? NO. THE STRAW VOTE WE DON'T TAKE IT. NO.

SO ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THE CONCEPT AS YOU WANT TO ROLL CALL VOTE? YES.

OKAY. I'M SORRY. ALL RIGHT.

THIS IS A STRAW VOTE.

ALL RIGHT. SO JUST CLARIFYING THAT THIS IS A NON-BINDING VOTE.

THIS IS HOW WE'RE LEANING, RIGHT.

ALL RIGHT. SO I'LL START WITH COMMISSIONER CORDILL.

YES.

COMMISSIONER SHREWSBURY.

I'M LEANING TOWARDS YES.

COMMISSIONER RICHARDS.

LEANING TOWARDS YES.

COMMISSIONER SNYDER.

I'M UNSURE RIGHT NOW. OKAY.

COMMISSIONER PREMOE. I AM ALSO NOT READY TO COMMIT.

COMMISSIONER MCCONNELL.

I SUPPORT WHAT THE APPLICANT IS ATTEMPTING TO DO.

I AM IN FAVOR OF THIS PROJECT IN PRINCIPLE.

I HOPE THAT WE DON'T LOSE SIGHT OF THE ISSUES THAT WE'RE GRAPPLING WITH AS WE WORK TOWARDS A REVISION OF THE MASTER PLAN, BECAUSE I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE GENERATE THE SORTS OF PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIPS THAT ARE GOING TO BE REQUIRED TO MAKE IT ECONOMICALLY FEASIBLE TO GET THE KIND OF HOUSING THAT WE WANT.

SO THAT'S MY THOUGHTS.

VICE CHAIR TREZISE.

LEANING TOWARDS YES. AND THE CHAIR RIGHT NOW SEES APPROVAL FOR THIS PLAN.

SO I WOULD VOTE YES.

YES. CAN I HAVE ONE CLARIFICATION? THIS REGARDS THE SETBACK OF WHICH THE ROAD IS CROSSING.

CAN SOMEBODY POINT OUT WHERE THAT ACTUAL WETLAND SETBACK IS? BECAUSE IT RUN PARALLEL TO THE ROAD.

IT'S BETWEEN THE BROWN TREE AND THE GREEN TREE UP ON THAT CORNER.

RIGHT HERE'S THE WETLAND AND RIGHT HERE'S WHERE THE ROAD'S KEPT ALONG THE PROPERTY LINE.

SO THE WETLAND, THERE'S STILL A 20, 25 FOOT BUFFER.

THERE'S JUST NOT A 40 FOOT BUFFER ANYMORE BECAUSE WE'RE NOT SO THE WHOLE ROLL THAT'S RUNNING EAST WEST THERE.

THE WETLAND COMES UP LIKE THIS AND IT GOES JOGS IN AND OUT, BUT IT'S THE BUFFER COMES ALMOST ALL THE WAY TO THE PROPERTY.

SO THE ON THE SOUTH SIDE THERE? YEAH.

SO THE HARDSHIP IS, IS THAT THERE'S NO WAY TO CONNECT THIS ROAD IN THE DEVELOPMENT WITHOUT GOING THROUGH THAT WETLAND BUFFER.

BUT WE'RE NOT IMPACTING THE WETLAND AT ALL.

AND THERE'S STILL A GREENBELT BETWEEN THE WETLAND THAT WE'RE NOT IMPACTING AND THE ROAD THAT WE'RE PROPOSING.

IT'S JUST YOU SEE THE ROAD THAT COMES OFF THAT'S ON PAGE 28 OF THE PACKET.

YOU CAN SEE IT QUITE CLEARLY.

SO I MEAN RIGHT HERE IN THE LITTLE CORNER WHERE THE ROAD IS, RIGHT UP NEXT TO THAT RED LINE, WHICH IS THE PROPERTY LINE.

WHERE THE ROAD 90 STRAIGHT DOWN.

IT DROPS. AND IT DROPS STRAIGHT DOWN TO THE SOUTH.

BUT THERE'S SOME PARKING RIGHT THERE AND THERE'S THE CLUBHOUSE AND THAT ONE SECTION OF ROAD THAT DOESN'T HAVE ANY HOUSES ON IT THAT'S THE SECTION THAT'S WITHIN THE WETLAND BUFFER. BUT AGAIN, WE'RE NOT AND THERE'S STILL A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF GREEN SPACE THAT COULD

[01:10:04]

THANK YOU FOR A CLARIFICATION.

BUT IF WE DON'T IF WE DON'T HAVE THE ROAD CONNECTION, THEN THERE'S THE ISSUE OF YOU'RE PUTTING ALL THAT TRAFFIC OUT ON POWELL, WHICH NOBODY WANTS TO HAPPEN.

SO THE HARDSHIPS THERE, IT'S JUST WE GOT TO GO WITH GET THE VARIANCE TO GET THAT APPROVED.

IN ALL HONESTY, WHAT OUR FOCUS WAS, WHAT WE HEARD FROM THE BOARD, AT LEAST WHEN WE WERE UP THERE, WAS PLEASE DO EVERYTHING YOU CAN NOT TO IMPACT THIS WETLAND.

AND SO WE TOOK AN EFFORT NOT TO MITIGATE ANYTHING.

AND YOUR ALTERNATIVE AND THERE IS AREAS TO MITIGATE TO SOLVE THIS ISSUE, BUT THAT SEEMS SILLY TO US.

SO WE THOUGHT IT WAS BETTER TO GO ALONG THE WETLAND BUFFER THAN TO MITIGATE, AND WE THOUGHT THAT WAS THE INTENT OF WHAT THE BOARD HAD DIRECTED US TO DO.

SO WE MADE WHEN WE LISTENED, WE REALLY TRIED TO LISTEN TO WHAT WE HEARD FROM THE BOARD AND SO FORTH TO TRY AND DO WHAT WAS ASKED OF US.

AND SO THAT WAS OUR INTENTION TO TRY AND DO THAT, BECAUSE YOUR ONLY ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE TO MITIGATE IT.

AND THIS WETLAND.

ANYWAY, LONG STORY SHORT, WHEN THAT ROAD WAS BUILT TO THAT SENIOR COMMUNITY, IT BLOCKED SOME WATER AND THAT'S WHAT CREATED IT.

IF YOU GO BACK AND LOOK AT WHAT THIS WETLAND WAS PRIOR TO THAT, IT WAS VERY, VERY DIFFERENT.

AND SO THE LONG AND THE SHORT IS THAT WE'RE DOING EVERYTHING WE CAN WITH SOMEONE WHO MADE WHO'S NO LONGER WITH US, WHO I HAVE THE UTMOST RESPECT FOR, BUT WAS GETTING A LITTLE BIT OLDER IN AGE AND MISSED IT.

NOTHING FURTHER. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, GENTLEMEN.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ALL RIGHT. WE ARE NOW ON AGENDA ITEM 7B, WHICH IS THE 2022 MASTER PLAN.

[7.B. 2022 Master Plan Kickoff]

SO I'M GOING TO BE INTENSELY BRIEF THIS EVENING BECAUSE I JUST WANT TO SAY THIS I WOULD LIKE MS. KRAMER AND HER FRIENDS TO COME BE ABLE TO SPEAK BECAUSE THIS IS THE FIRST PUBLIC HEARING WE ARE OFFICIALLY HOLDING FOR THE MASTER PLAN, BECAUSE I KNEW THERE WERE PEOPLE THAT WANTED TO COME TALK ABOUT IT.

AND SO WHILE I HAVE THE FLOOR BRIEFLY, I JUST WANT TO POINT OUT AND WE ARE GOING TO MAKE THIS BIGGER, BUT IF YOU GO TO THE HOME PAGE OF THE COMMUNITY PLANNING DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT, THIS IS THE LINK TO THE MASTER PLAN PAGE, WHICH WE ARE BEGINNING.

AND I HIT TWICE AND SO NOW I MESSED IT UP.

[LAUGHTER] BUT WE ARE BEGINNING TO POPULATE WITH INFORMATION AS WE GO FORWARD HERE.

AND SO THERE IS A FORM ON THIS WEB PAGE THAT IF YOU HAVE COMMENTS, IF YOU'RE WATCHING FROM HOME AND YOU WANT TO YELL AT ME ABOUT SOMETHING, YOU CAN CERTAINLY PUT IT IN THAT WEB FORM AND IT WILL GET TO STAFF AND WE'LL BE ABLE TO START INCORPORATING THAT INTO THE PLAN.

THE OTHER THING I WILL STEAL THE THUNDER OF ITEM 8A BATH TOWNSHIP HAS DID RESPOND TO OUR INITIAL LETTER TO THEM AND HAS SOME GOOD COMMENTS ABOUT NON-MOTORIZED

[8.A. Bath Township Response to Notice of Intent]

CONNECTIVITY. AND SO THAT OBVIOUSLY IS SOMETHING WE'LL BE LOOKING AT SOONER RATHER THAN LATER.

AND WITH THAT I WILL CEDE THE FLOOR SO THE PUBLIC CAN SPEAK.

THANK YOU, MS. KRAMER.

YES. GOOD EVENING.

MY NAME IS CECELIA KRAMER 4560 OAKWOOD HERE IN OKEMOS.

AND I HAVE A COUPLE OF MY FRIENDS WITH ME AND WE WELL.

LET'S SEE. JOHN MCCRACKEN AS A MEMBER OF FAITH LUTHERAN CHURCH, AS I AM, AND MR. FEDEWA IS INTERESTED IN THE PROPERTY AND OWNS THE PARCEL TO THE NORTH, WHICH WOULD BE CHIEF OKEMOS CIRCLE APARTMENTS. AT ANY RATE, WE ARE HERE TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT A REQUEST TO PUT BEFORE YOU WHICH DEALS WITH THE UPCOMING LAND USE MAP THAT YOU ARE GOING TO BE DISCUSSING.

FAITH LUTHERAN CHURCH HAS 10 ACRES AT 4515 DOBIE ROAD AND THE LAND USE CURRENTLY SHOWS THAT AS THE RESIDENTIAL EARMARKED [INAUDIBLE] ACTUALLY BUT RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY WITH AN INSTITUTIONAL OVERLAY WHICH IS THE CHURCH AND IT IS A LOW DENSITY DESIGNATION.

WE WILL BE APPROACHING OR WOULD LOVE TO HAVE YOU CONSIDER TAKING THIS AREA FROM BEING A THE LOW DENSITY TO A HIGHER DENSITY TO MATCH THE DENSITY THAT HAS BEEN GIVEN TO THE PROPERTIES JUST TO THE NORTH OF THE

[01:15:08]

CHURCH, WHICH IS THE CHIEF OKEMOS APARTMENTS.

WHY IS THAT SIGNIFICANT? WE ARE UP ON A HIGH TRAFFIC ROAD, WHICH WOULD BE REALLY HIGH TRAFFIC ROAD THIS YEAR WITH ALL THE CONSTRUCTION THAT HAS BEEN SHOOTING THE TRAFFIC UP AND DOWN DOBIE ROAD AS OPPOSED TO TRYING TO GET THROUGH THE OTHER AREAS.

BUT WE ARE IN THE PROCESS OF LOOKING TO WORK WITH AND CHIEF OKEMOS OWNERS, THE FEDEWA'S WAS ABOUT GETTING A PORTION OF OUR PROPERTY ABOUT FOUR ACRES AND PUTTING RESIDENTIAL AND THIS WOULD BE APARTMENTS IN MODERATE PRICE RANGE TO USE THAT PROPERTY TO THE NORTH END OF OUR 10 ACRES.

THIS WOULD LEAVE THIS WITH A LITTLE BIT OVER FIVE ACRES FOR THE CHURCH AND OUR OWN PARSONAGE THAT'S ON THE WHICH WE'RE USING WITH REFUGEES RIGHT NOW.

SO THAT ESSENTIALLY IS OUR HOPE THAT YOU WILL MAKE A SERIOUS CONSIDERATION ABOUT ADJUSTING THAT LAND USE PLAN TO ALLOW US TO MAKE THAT TYPE OF A CHANGE IN OUR PROPERTY.

THE PROPERTY WOULD BE WALKABLE AREA.

WE HAVE SIDEWALKS.

IT WOULD ASSIST THE TOWNSHIP TOWARD GOALS FOR LOWER HOUSING RATES, FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND ALSO INCREASE IN THE RENTAL PROPERTIES, WHICH HAS BEEN APPROPRIATE AND INTERESTED IN THE TOWNSHIP'S BEEN INTERESTED IN DOING.

AND SO THAT IS ESSENTIALLY WHAT OUR PROPOSAL, OUR REQUEST IS.

AND WE'RE LOOKING TO YOU FOR SERIOUS CONSIDERATION ABOUT THIS.

THANK YOU, MA'AM. THANK YOU.

DO EITHER OF THE GENTLEMEN WITH YOU WISH TO ADDRESS THE BOARD? I DON'T KNOW IF THEY WANT TO SPEAK OR IF THEY? DO YOU WANT TO SAY SOMETHING? I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD.

GO AHEAD. I CAN SPEAK. MY NAME IS GREG FEDEWA AT 7030 COLEMAN ROAD IN EAST LANSING.

AND YES, WE JUST WANT TO BUILD APARTMENTS THERE.

IT FITS IN WITH THE GENERAL CHARACTER OF THE AREA.

THERE'S APARTMENTS ACROSS THE STREET AND THERE'S APARTMENTS NEXT TO IT.

WE'RE NOT MOWING DOWN A BIG NATURAL AREA.

WE'RE NOT FILLING IN WETLANDS.

SO WE THINK THAT IT FITS IN WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE SPOT, AND THAT'S PRETTY MUCH IT.

IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM.

COMMISSIONER THIS WOULD BE THE PROPERTY WOULD BE SOLD TO THE PERSON BUILDING THE? THAT'S CORRECT, YES. SO THE CHURCH WOULD BE DIVESTING ITSELF OF THAT PROPERTY? YES. COMMISSIONER TREZISE.

WELL, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE NEED TO AWAIT THE LAND USE MAP ADJUSTMENT WITH THE UPDATED REPORT AS OPPOSED TO A ZONING VARIANCE OR A ZONING CHANGE OF THAT PROPERTY.

SO I HAD A VERY SIMILAR CONVERSATION WITH CECELIA JUST THIS AFTERNOON.

MS. KRAMER, I APOLOGIZE.

OK STAFF WOULD ALWAYS, IN 100% OF CASES, RECOMMEND A LAND USE MAP CHANGE PRIOR TO A REZONING THAT IS NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE CURRENT MASTER PLAN.

BECAUSE IF YOU DO NOT DO THAT.

THEN YOUR MASTER PLAN IS NOT WORTH ONE.

THE ISSUE IS THAT YOU CAN UNDERCUT EVERY DECISION YOU MAKE BY SAYING IT IS NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE MASTER PLAN.

OKAY. SO THIS, AS I'VE ADVISED THEM IN MY TIME HERE, THE FIRST STEP IS DURING THIS MASTER PLAN UPDATE TO CHANGE THE DESIGNATION FOR THE NORTHERN THIRD OF THEIR PROPERTY.

GOT YOU. THANK YOU, TIM.

COMMISSIONER.

THERE WAS SOMETHING MAYBE A YEAR OR TWO BACK WHERE THE CHURCH WAS LOOKING TO SELL THE PROPERTY AND THERE WAS A PROPOSAL, BUT I DON'T THINK THERE WAS A REZONING OF IT.

IF I COULD SPEAK, YES, WE BROUGHT THE SAME ISSUE BEFORE AND WE RAN INTO THE PROBLEM

[01:20:07]

THAT MR. SCHMITT JUST DESCRIBED.

WE WERE TURNED DOWN BECAUSE OF A ZONING CHANGE, BECAUSE IT WASN'T ON THE LAND USE MAP PLAN.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS? COMMISSIONER PREMOE. NO.

ANYBODY ELSE? THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MA'AM.

THANK YOU. I GUESS AN OBSERVATION IS IT'S INTERESTING WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND, YOU KNOW, THE NEXT CONVERSATION THAT CAME UP WAS AND HERE'S A PROPOSAL TOO. SO, YOU KNOW, IS THAT A WAY OF BALANCING A PROJECT THAT WE FIRST HEARD ABOUT WITH THE PROJECT THAT THEY'RE NOW PROPOSING, DOES IT HELP CREATE SOME BALANCE AND ALSO SPEAK TO SOME OF YOUR CONCERNS THAT IT'S AN INTERESTING OPPORTUNITY TO THINK ABOUT.

VERY AND I THOUGHT THE SAME THING WHEN I HEARD IT.

MA'AM, MAY I ASK YOU, YOU'RE NOT AT THE MICROPHONE.

I'M JUST CURIOUS. YOU SAID THAT RIGHT NOW THE CHURCH IS FINDING HOUSING FOR REFUGEES.

IS THAT REFUGEES FROM THE WAR IN EUROPE? IS THAT? YES, FOR THE LAST TWO, THREE YEARS, WE HAVE TURNED OUR PARSONAGE, WHICH IS ON THE PROPERTY AND WORKED WITH SAMARITAS TO TAKE IN REFUGEE YOUNG REFUGEE MEN WHO ARE NOW CONSIDERED TO BE ADULTS.

THEY HAVE GOTTEN INTO THE SAMARITAS SYSTEM, MANY OF THEM IN LIVING IN JACKSON, WHERE THERE'S A A HOUSE FOR THE 12 TO, LET'S SAY, 18 RANGE AND THEY GO TO HIGH SCHOOL THERE.

THEY'RE LEARNING ENGLISH.

THEY'RE LIVING IN A HUGE VICTORIAN MANSION THAT'S BEEN TURNED OVER TO A MULTIPLE HOUSING.

BUT ONCE THEY ON THEIR 18TH BIRTHDAY, THEY GET A BIRTHDAY CAKE, A BIG PARTY AND THE DOOR.

[LAUGHTER] THEY ARE FREE AT THAT POINT TO LIVE UNDER ANY VIADUCT IN THESE UNITED STATES THEY HAVE NO INCOME.

MOST OF THEM HARDLY SPEAK ENGLISH.

THEY HAVE NO SKILLS. THEY HAVEN'T HAD ANY.

MANY HAVEN'T GRADUATED HIGH SCHOOL.

AND SO OUR CHURCH, SEEING THAT THAT PROBLEM HAS WORKED WITH SAMARITAS TO PROVIDE HOUSING AND WE TAKE THEM, GET THEM TO SCHOOL.

ONE IS NOW GOING TO THE OKEMOS SCHOOL.

SEVERAL OF THEM HAD GONE TO WILLIAMSTON SCHOOLS, HIGH SCHOOLS TO OBTAIN THEIR HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMAS.

A NUMBER OF THEM HAVE GRADUATED FROM OUR SYSTEM AND HAVE GOTTEN JOBS.

ALL THREE OF THEM. WE HAVE THREE GUYS THERE RIGHT NOW.

THEY ALL THREE HAVE JOBS.

ONE OF THEM IS STILL GOING TO SCHOOL, TO HIGH SCHOOL.

OTHER ONE IS DOING YES, THE TWO OF THEM ARE STILL GOING TO HIGH SCHOOL.

SO ANYWAY, THAT IS TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, LENGTHY, BUT IT'S A REAL NEED.

AND OUR CHURCH HAS BEEN STEPPING FORWARD TO TRY AND FILL THAT.

POINT OF INFORMATION FOR YOU IS THE NUMBER TWO EMPLOYER IN THE LANSING AREA IS PECKHAM INDUSTRIES.

AND THEY'RE VERY SYMPATHETIC TO HIRING FOLKS WITH THOSE KINDS OF NEEDS.

SO IT'S JUST A DIRECTION THAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO SUGGEST.

OH, EXCELLENT IDEA.

I'LL BRING THAT BACK TO OUR REFUGEE COMMITTEE.

BUT RIGHT NOW TWO OF THEM ARE ACTUALLY WORKING AT QUALITY DAIRY RIGHT DOWN THE STREET.

THEY WALK TO WORK ON THE SIDEWALKS AND STUFF, AND THE OTHER ONE IS WORKING OUT AT THE MEIJERS WAREHOUSE.

AND SO BUT PECKHAM WOULD BE A GOOD SUGGESTION FOR THOSE.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

DID YOU HAVE A? I HAD A QUESTION FOR STAFF ON THE MORE GENERAL MASTER PLAN, ESPECIALLY THE LETTER FROM BATH TOWNSHIP I WAS TRYING TO WORK OUT.

[01:25:06]

THANKS FOR ALERTING ME TO THAT.

THE TWO SECTIONS THAT THEY WERE REFERRING TO ARE PARK LAKE ROAD AND NICHOLS IS THAT NEWTON ROAD.

DO WE HAVE A NICHOLS ROAD? WE DO NOT. WE DO NOT.

BUT YEAH, I THINK THE PARK LAKE ROAD, IF I'M UNDERSTANDING CORRECTLY, IS AT LAKE LANSING, WHERE THERE'S JUST A GAP THAT WE HAVEN'T FILLED YET RUNNING UP.

AND BEFORE IT BECOMES WOOD RUSH OR SOMETHING.

BUT THE OTHER ONE, I WASN'T CLEAR OF, SO I JUST WANTED TO PUT A PIN IN THAT ONE.

WE DO LOOK AT THE I MEAN, IT'S REALLY MORE OF A PATHWAY MASTER PLAN THAN A MASTER PLAN ISSUE.

SO I'M KIND OF HOPING THAT THAT COMMUNICATION CAN GET FORWARD TO THE TRANSPORTATION COMMISSION AND THEY CAN WORK WITH FIGURE OUT WHAT THOSE TWO GAPS THAT WERE BEING CALLED OUT WERE. SO THAT BECAUSE I THINK WE'LL PROBABLY END UP JUST REFERENCING THE PATHWAY MASTER PLAN BY REFERENCE.

I THINK WE ALREADY DO.

SO I THINK IT'S A GAP.

I THINK WHERE NEWTON GOES NORTH, EVENTUALLY IT TURNS AND THEN IT CHANGES NAMES TO NICHOLS, AND I THINK THERE'S A GAP SOMEWHERE THERE.

SO AS LONG AS THAT CAN MAKE ITS WAY TO THE TRANSPORTATION COMMISSION, THEY CAN MAKE SURE THEY HEAR THAT.

ABSOLUTELY. OKAY SUPER.

ALL RIGHT. ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS CONCERNING ITEM NUMBER 8 OF THE AGENDA? ALL RIGHT. THEN WE MOVE ON TO ITEM 9, UNFINISHED BUSINESS, THE TEXT AMENDMENT INVOLVING DAYCARE DEFINITIONS.

[9.A. Text Amendment #2022-15 – Day Care Definitions Update]

THIS IS THE PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE DEFINITIONS FOR FAMILY AND GROUP DAYCARE HOMES IN ACCORDANCE WITH PUBLIC ACT 106 12-2022, WHICH WAS RECENTLY SIGNED INTO LAW.

THIS HAD A PUBLIC HEARING ON OCTOBER 10TH AND WE HAD NO PUBLIC COMMENT THEN, AND WE HAVE NO PUBLIC COMMENT NOW.

SO YOU HAVE A RESOLUTION RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THIS ZONING TEXT CHANGE TO THE BOARD ALONG WITH THE RED LINE AND CLEAN VERSIONS OF WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE.

AND ALSO FOR YOUR REFERENCE, THE PAGE 13 FROM THE TOWNSHIP FOCUS THAT REFERENCES THE CHANGE IN STATE LAW.

JUST A COMMENT.

I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH SIGNING ON BEHALF OF THE COMMISSION A RESOLUTION THAT ALLOWS SEX FOR CHILDREN IN A MULTIPLE CARE HOME.

TO WHAT ARE YOU REFERRING TO? ON PAGE 70 OF THE PACKET? IS IT IN THE. IS IT IN THE IT'S IN THE PROPOSED RESOLUTION, WHEREAS PA 106 IN THAT PARAGRAPH.

THE LAST WORD. WHEREAS I DON'T THINK WE WANT TO BE APPROVING THIS GOT THROUGH THREE PAIRS OF EYES SO THAT I WILL MAKE THAT CHANGE.

ASIDE FROM THAT, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE PROPOSED RESOLUTION.

I MOVE TO ADOPT THE RESOLUTION RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF ZONING AMENDMENT TO 202215 IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE REVISED DRAFT ORDINANCE LANGUAGE DATED OCTOBER 24, 2022, AS AMENDED.

ALL RIGHT. DO WE NEED A ROLL CALL THAT.

ALL RIGHT.

THE MOTION IS APPROVED.

OK. THANK YOU.

ALL RIGHT. WE ARE NOW ON ITEM NUMBER TEN RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA.

[10.A. Recreational Marijuana – Discussion]

SO LET ME AGAIN, STRESS, AS I'VE STRESSED MULTIPLE TIMES IN THE PAST WEEK, THIS IS A DRAFT.

THIS IS THE FIRST DRAFT.

THIS IS INTENDED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE ON THE RIGHT PATH BASED ON THE CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'VE HAD OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST SEVERAL MONTHS BETWEEN THE BOARD AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION. WHAT STAFF HAS DONE AND AGAIN, THIS IS ONLY THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

THERE'S A SEPARATE LICENSING ORDINANCE THAT WILL BE ADDRESSED THROUGH THE TOWNSHIP ATTORNEYS OFFICE AND THE BOARD.

WHAT WE'VE DONE FROM THE ZONING PERSPECTIVE IS RATHER THAN WHAT WE SHOULD DO, WE'VE TAKEN THE EXISTING MEDICAL MARIJUANA OVERLAY AND WE HAVE AMENDED THE LANGUAGE TO BE MODIFIED TO ALLOW FOR ANY MARIJUANA RELATED BUSINESS.

THE WAY WE DO THIS IS BY PROVIDING THE SPECIFIC DEFINITIONS OF THE FACILITIES AS THEY RELATE BACK TO THE PUBLIC ACTS THAT ESTABLISH THEM.

SO THE DEFINITION OF THE REASON THERE'S TWO DEFINITIONS IS BECAUSE THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA ACT AND THE RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA ACT HAVE DIFFERENT DEFINITIONS FOR WHAT ARE COMMONLY REFERRED TO AS DISPENSARIES.

AND SO WE HAVE.

IN OUR ORDINANCE DEFINED BOTH OF THOSE TERMS, PERMITTING BOTH OF THOSE TERMS UNDER THE OVERLAY.

[01:30:06]

SO FUNCTIONALLY, THE ORDINANCE DOES.

THERE'S THREE MAJOR PIECES TO THIS, THE DEFINITIONS.

THE SECOND PIECE IS WE ARE PROPOSING TO REMOVE EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT RETAIL ORIENTED AT THIS POINT.

TO DATE, WE'VE HAD NO INTEREST IN ANY OTHER USE.

THE MARKET IS DRAMATICALLY CHANGING AND WE DO NOT BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD BE UTILIZING OUR EXISTING INDUSTRIAL SPACE FOR THIS TYPE OF FACILITY.

THE LETTER FROM DIRECTOR CLARK IN THE PACKET OUTLINES THE CONCERNS THERE.

THIRDLY, WE ARE TAKING SOME OF THE PIECES OF THE EXISTING LICENSING ORDINANCE THAT ARE ZONING RELATED ISSUES, SEPARATIONS, NOISE ODOR, THINGS LIKE THAT, AND BRING THEM OVER INTO THE ZONING ORDINANCE BECAUSE THEY NEED TO BE HERE, NOT THERE.

THE ONE THING WE ARE ADDING IS BASED ON THE CONVERSATION THAT'S HAPPENED IS WE ARE PROPOSING AND THIS STILL NEEDS TO BE RUN BY THE TOWNSHIP ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, BUT WE WANTED TO GET THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S FEEL ON THIS FIRST.

A LIMITATION, A DISTANCE LIMITATION OF 2000 FEET BETWEEN ANY LICENSED PREMISES.

SO FUNCTIONALLY NOT CREATING A DENSITY OF THE SAME USE IN A SMALLER AREA.

SO THAT'S PART A, THAT'S THE TEXT.

PURVIEW OF THE CHANGES TO THE MAP.

AND SO WE'VE OBVIOUSLY HEARD A LOT OF COMMENTS RECENTLY ABOUT WHERE WE SHOULD GO.

SO I'D LIKE TO WALK YOU THROUGH THESE SEVEN DISTRICTS.

THESE ARE THE EXISTING DISTRICTS STAFF IS PROPOSING WOULD RECOMMEND AT THIS TIME THAT WE STRIKE AREA ONE.

THIS IS THE AREA ALONG TOWNER ROAD, PARTIALLY ZONED INDUSTRIAL, PARTIALLY ZONED, RURAL RESIDENTIAL.

THE OWNER OF THE RURAL RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY HAS BEEN TRYING TO DO A PROJECT THERE FOR YEARS AND THE INDUSTRIAL PROPERTY IS LARGELY WETLAND IS UNLIKELY TO BE DEVELOPED FOR THIS TYPE OF USE.

AREA TWO DOES NOT CHANGE.

IT GETS RENUMBERED BUT DOES NOT CHANGE.

IT'S STILL ESSENTIALLY THE SHOPPING CENTER AT THE CORNER OF HASLETT AND OKEMOS ROAD, AREA THREE AND FOUR.

WE'RE PROPOSING TO ELIMINATE THE DON AVENUE DISTRICT BECAUSE AGAIN, WE DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD BE USING OUR INDUSTRIAL PROPERTY FOR THIS TYPE OF USE AT THIS POINT.

WE'RE ALSO PROPOSING TO ELIMINATE THE NEW RED CEDAR FLATS PROJECT FROM THE DISTRICT AND THE APARTMENT COMPLEX AT THE ALONG NORTHWIND AVENUE FROM THE DISTRICT. THIS IS ACTUALLY AN APARTMENT COMPLEX AND A SENIOR CARE FACILITY.

AND SO THIS DISTRICT WOULD BE TIGHTENED UP, AREA FIVE, WHICH WOULD GET RENAMED.

WE HAVE NOT PROPOSED ANY CHANGES TO THIS DISTRICT, BUT IF THERE IS A DESIRE TO DO SO, YOU VERY EASILY COULD TAKE NEWMAN ROAD ACROSS AND CUT THE DISTRICT, CUT THE SORT OF TARGET COLE SHOPPING CENTER AREA OUT OF THE DISTRICT.

AREA SIX DOESN'T CHANGE ITS FUNCTIONALLY TO PROPERTY OWNERS.

A COUPLE OF SIX PROPERTIES, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, AND THE LAST OF THE AREA JOLLY AND OKEMOS ROAD PROPOSING TO TAKE OUT THE NEWLY DEVELOPED HOTELS, BANK AND THE CAR DEALERSHIP THAT WAS RECENTLY RENOVATED FROM SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THAN THE SIZE OF THIS DISTRICT AS WELL.

THAT'S WHERE WE'RE AT AT THIS POINT.

IF THE PLANNING COMMISSION DOES GENERALLY AGREES TO CONTINUE DOWN THIS DIRECTION, WHAT WE'LL DO IS WE'LL TIGHTEN UP THE LANGUAGE, WE'LL GET WITH THE TOWNSHIP ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND WE'LL TRY AND BRING THIS FORWARD FOR PUBLIC HEARING IN THE FUTURE.

BUT WE WOULD WELCOME ANY FEEDBACK AT THIS TIME.

ROBERT BALDORI AND MARCUS.

WHICH OF YOU WISH TO SPEAK? ROBERT BALDORI, I LIVE AT 2719 MOUNT HOPE ROAD.

BEEN THERE FOR ABOUT 50 YEARS.

LOVE LIVING HERE. IT'S A GREAT COMMUNITY AND I'M HAPPY TO SEE THAT WE'RE FINALLY MAKING PROGRESS.

ON OPTING IN ON ADULT USE MARIJUANA.

I'M AN ATTORNEY AND I HAVE ANYWHERE I HAVE OR HAVE HAD OVER 100 CLIENTS ALL OVER THE STATE OF MICHIGAN IN VARIOUS STAGES OF THE MARIJUANA BUSINESS.

MICHIGAN HAS APPROXIMATELY 1700 MUNICIPALITIES.

I THINK OVER 200 OF THEM HAVE NOW OPTED IN ON ADULT USE MARIJUANA.

AND EVERY ONE OF THEM, IT'S BEEN A RESOUNDING SUCCESS ON A NUMBER OF LEVELS, IMPROVING THE PROPERTIES AND IMPROVING THE TAX BASE REVENUE TO THE COMMUNITY. EACH ONE OF THE RETAIL OUTLETS.

I THINK THE AVERAGE IS ABOUT 30 HIGH PAYING JOBS, PROFESSIONAL JOBS, ALL THAT.

IF WE MAKE SOME PROGRESS ON THIS AND I'M COMPLETELY IN SUPPORT OF AT LEAST THE SHAPE OF THE PROPOSALS THAT TIM SCHMITT HAS

[01:35:01]

PUT IN FRONT OF YOU, AND I HOPE WE CONTINUE IN THAT DIRECTION.

THANK YOU, MARKUS.

YES, MARKUS BALDORI.

I LIVE AT 2267 MOUNT HOPE ROAD.

I'VE BEEN A RESIDENT FOR 30 YEARS.

I'M ONE OF THE APPLICANTS AND JUST WANT TO ECHO A SUPPORT FOR THIS AND DON'T REALLY HAVE MUCH TO ADD, BUT DEFINITELY LOOKING FORWARD TO WORKING WITH YOU GUYS ON CONTINUING THIS PROJECT AS WE HAVE BEEN FOR THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS.

SO I JUST WANTED TO TO CONTINUE SUPPORTING IT.

THANKS. I HAVE ONE QUESTION.

YES. MUCH OF WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE IS SIMPLY REPLACING RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA WITH WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY LIMITED TO MEDICAL USE OF MARIJUANA.

AND NOW, FRANKLY, I KNOW YOUR FATHER.

I'VE KNOWN HIM FOR MANY YEARS.

HAVE YOU SEEN ANY DIFFERENCE IN THE USE OF THE PROPERTY IN THOSE AREAS WHICH HAVE CONVERTED FROM MEDICAL MARIJUANA TO RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA USE? IS THERE ANY SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE IN HOW THE PROPERTY IS HANDLED? NO, I WOULDN'T SAY THAT IT HAS AND A LOT OF THE PEOPLE WHO USED TO HAVE MEDICAL CARDS THAT WOULD FREQUENT ESTABLISHMENTS NO LONGER HAVE THOSE CARDS.

AND IT'S ESSENTIALLY BEING PHASED OUT.

FROM WHAT I CAN TELL.

IT'S JUST BEING SORT OF THE MARKET IS JUST BEING TRANSFERRED.

FROM WHAT I CAN TELL, WE CASTLEROCK IS OUR APPLICANT ENTITY.

IT OPERATES IN JACKSON.

SO I'VE BEEN ABLE TO SEE WHEN THAT STARTED OPERATING IT WAS BOTH MEDICAL AND RECREATIONAL.

WE'RE CONSIDERING DROPPING THE MEDICAL RIGHT NOW FOR THAT FACILITY.

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE IT AT LEAST FOR ONE MORE YEAR, BUT OVER TIME THAT'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE PHASED OUT.

BUT AS FOR HOW THAT AFFECTS THE ACTUAL PROPERTY, IT'S REALLY HARD FOR ME TO SAY.

BUT I DON'T THINK THAT I MEAN, AS WE KNOW, IF IT'S JUST MEDICAL, IT'S NOT EXACTLY IT'S NOT VIABLE FROM, YOU KNOW, CLEARLY THAT'S THE CASE HERE . IN REGARDS TO THE RULES AS THEY APPLY TO RECREATIONAL FACILITIES AREN'T MEANINGFULLY DIFFERENT.

THEY'RE ALMOST ALL SMALL CLERICAL THINGS THAT I CAN'T RECITE OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD.

THERE ARE A FEW, BUT YEAH.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS FOR THE PUBLIC OR FOR STAFF, BUT IT SEEMS THAT ONE OF THE STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS CONCERNS SIMPLIFYING THE TYPES OF USES THAT ARE ALLOWED AND BASICALLY DOING AWAY WITH ALL THE RETAIL CATEGORY. IF I UNDERSTOOD THAT CORRECTLY, AND I GUESS I'M CURIOUS, I THINK PART OF THE RATIONALE FOR THAT THAT I HEARD DIRECTOR SCHMITT EXPLAIN WAS THAT SINCE WE HAVEN'T SEEN INTEREST IN THE SORT OF I DON'T KNOW, IS IT PRODUCTION OR PROCESSING OR PACKAGING SORT OF SIDE, WOULD WE EXPECT TO HAVE SEEN THAT IN THE ABSENCE OF A RETAIL MARKET, OR IS THAT SOMETHING THAT FOLLOWS ALONG WHEN THERE ARE RETAIL ESTABLISHMENTS THAT THEY'RE THEY'RE UP UPSTREAM SUPPLIERS ALSO? AND DO DO WE IN SOME WAY CONSTRAIN THE INDUSTRY BY RESTRICTING ITS OPERATION IN THE TOWNSHIP TO RETAIL ONLY? AND SORT OF FINALLY ALONG THOSE LINES, IF IT'S AN INDUSTRIAL USE THAT WE'RE OKAY WITH, WHY WOULD WE THEN CONTINUE TO EXCLUDE IT FROM OUR INDUSTRIAL ZONES? I THINK I UNDERSTAND THE LOGIC OF NOT WANTING TO REPLACE VALUABLE INDUSTRIAL LAND WITH THE RETAIL USE.

BUT ARE WE KIND OF SHOOTING OURSELVES IN THE FOOT BY THEN LEAVING EXCLUDED AN INDUSTRIAL USE THAT WE MIGHT LIKE? SO THERE'S NO EVIDENCE THAT WE'D BE HAMSTRINGING THE INDUSTRY BY PRECLUDING THOSE USES? FRANKLY, A LOT OF THE GROWING OCCURS THROUGHOUT THE STATE AND IS TRANSFERRED TO PROCESSING FACILITIES IF THEY'RE NOT ON SITE AND THEN COMES TO THE RETAIL OPERATIONS FROM AN INDUSTRIAL PERSPECTIVE.

I THINK THE BIGGEST CONCERN THAT DIRECTOR CLARK HAD IS FRANKLY, THESE PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO PAY TOP DOLLAR FOR THESE FACILITIES AND IT'S GOING TO RUN OUT THE EXISTING INDUSTRIAL USERS THAT WE HAVE.

AND AS WE SAW WITH THE SPARROW EMERGENCY ROOM, ALTHOUGH IT'S GREAT TO ADD TO THE COMMUNITY, WE DID LOSE MIDWEST POWER, WHICH IS A VALUABLE INDUSTRIAL TENANT IN THE COMMUNITY BECAUSE WE HAD NO PLACE TO PUT THEM.

SO IT'S LESS A MATTER OF NOT ATTRACTING NECESSARILY, BUT PUSHING OUT, POTENTIALLY DISPLACING.

CORRECT. AND OK, THANK YOU.

THAT THAT HELPS A LOT.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? YEAH, I HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THE PROPERTY IN AN HAGEDORN ROAD.

[01:40:03]

IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WHEN WE WORKED ON THIS FOR THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA, THE THIS WOULD BE THE NEW DISTRICT FOUR.

THAT WENT BEYOND PROVISIONING CENTERS AND ALLOWED TESTING AND SOME SCIENTIFIC STUFF THAT ISN'T MENTIONED IN THE PROPOSED ORDINANCES THAT'S STILL GOING TO BE ALLOWED IN THE MARIJUANA ORDINANCE AS OPPOSED TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

AT THIS POINT, WE WOULD NOT RECOMMEND INCLUDING ANYTHING OTHER THAN THE DISPENSARY TYPE USES IN THE ORDINANCE.

FROM A TESTING PERSPECTIVE, THERE ARE A EXTREMELY LIMITED NUMBER OF THOSE IN THE STATE.

THE MAJORITY OF THEM PROCESS THROUGH ONE FACILITY.

YOU CAN ARGUE MANY DIFFERENT REASONS WHY THAT'S THE CASE, BUT THERE'S NOT A HUGE MARKET FOR THAT.

FRANKLY, WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT REALLY IS SORT OF THE LIFECYCLE YOU HAVE, THE GROW, THE PROCESS, THE TEST, THE TRANSPORT, THE SALE.

AND FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, I DON'T THINK THERE IS A LARGE ENOUGH MARKET NOR WE'RE TRYING TO WE'RE TRYING TO STRIKE A BALANCE AS WELL IN TERMS OF HOW WE PROCEED AS A COMMUNITY GIVEN THE CONTENTIOUS NATURE OF THIS.

AND WE BELIEVE THAT THE BEST BALANCE IS SIMPLY TO GO WITH THE FORWARD FACING RETAIL THAT EVERYONE HAS SEEN AROUND AND OTHER COMMUNITIES.

AND THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD FOR YOU IS THE 2000 FOOT LIMIT BETWEEN FACILITIES EXCESSIVE? I MEAN, A THOUSAND FEET TO A SCHOOL IS QUITE A WAYS.

MOST OF THESE UNITS OR THESE PLACES ARE SMALL ENOUGH THAT YOU COULDN'T HAVE MORE THAN ONE IN THERE ANYWAY.

WE'RE HAPPY TO WE'RE HAPPY TO TAKE A SECOND LOOK AT IT.

THAT WAS JUST A NUMBER. WHETHER IT'S IT'S USEFUL FOR ANYTHING, IF THERE'S NOTHING THAT COULD BE BUILT IN THERE, I COULD SEE 1000 FOOT LIMITATION THE SAME AS THE SCHOOL.

SO IF SOME OF THESE GRAND RIVER AREA POSSIBLY WOULD BE WIDE ENOUGH TO ACCOMMODATE THAT.

BUT 2000 SEEMS LIKE AN AWFUL LARGE SEPARATION AND PROBABLY IS OVERKILL ON THAT. I WONDERED ABOUT THAT TOO, ONLY BECAUSE I KNOW WE HAVE A LIMITED NUMBER OF AVAILABLE LICENSES.

AND THEN IF YOU'RE REDUCING THE NUMBER OF PLACES WHERE THEY CAN BE AND YOU'RE ALSO REQUIRING THEM TO BE, DO WE ACTUALLY HAVE ENOUGH PHYSICAL SPACE THAT WE COULD FIT? CAN WE ACTUALLY GIVE THOSE LICENSES OUT WITHIN THE AREAS THAT WE WOULD THAT WOULD REMAIN UNDER THOSE PROPOSAL? ABSOLUTELY. AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE LICENSING, NOT THE LICENSE, BUT STILL NEEDS TO BE REDONE AS WELL.

RIGHT. SO WHETHER OR NOT THERE REMAINS THAT SAME NUMBER OF LICENSES IS A WHOLE NOTHER QUESTION.

YEAH, NO, IT'S JUST I CAN SEE SOME BENEFIT.

IN CERTAIN CASES, THERE IS BENEFIT TO GROUPING AS OPPOSED TO HAVING IT SCATTERED ALL OVER, ESPECIALLY WHEN THERE ARE CONCERNS IT MIGHT BE BETTER TO PUT IT IN AREAS WHERE WE'RE VERY COMFORTABLE WITH IT AND NOT IN AREAS WHERE THERE'S SOME QUESTION.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO WITH KIND OF REDUCING OR ELIMINATING CERTAIN ZONES.

BUT I'M NOT NECESSARILY OPPOSED TO PROXIMITY IF IT MAKES SENSE.

AND SO I'D BE CURIOUS TO KNOW WHAT THE.

YOU KNOW, FOR THAT PART OF THIS IS IF IT IS REALLY TO REDUCE HAVING MORE THAN ONE IN A PARTICULAR OVERLAY AREA OR IF IT'S TO DO SOMETHING ELSE THAT, YOU KNOW, SHARE MORE ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE THINKING, YOU KNOW, AND WE CAN TAKE ANOTHER LOOK AT THAT.

AND WE'RE TRYING LIKE I SAID, WE'RE TRYING TO CREATE THE THE BIKE WHILE IT'S STARTING TO ROLL HERE A LITTLE BIT AND, AND, AND, AND PULL OVER SOME OF THE STANDARDS THAT PERSONALLY FROM THE LICENSING PERSPECTIVE RIGHT NOW, I BELIEVE SHOULD BE IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE BECAUSE THEY ARE LOCATION AND GEOGRAPHIC BASED RESTRICTIONS.

SO WE'RE JUST TRYING TO MOLD THIS ALTOGETHER.

SO WE'LL TAKE ANOTHER LOOK AT THE 1000 FOOT REQUIREMENT.

THAT'S WHY I WANTED TO CALL IT OUT, BECAUSE IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS NEW WITH RESPECT TO THIS PIECE THAT WAS NOT THERE FOR THE MEDICAL PIECE.

AND I'M TO CLARIFY, I'M NOT SAYING I'M OPPOSED TO IT.

I'M JUST SAYING I'M CURIOUS WHY 2000 AND WHAT THE INTENT OF THAT PIECE OF THIS WAS COMPARED TO SOME OF THE OTHER STUFF THAT MAKES MORE COMMON SENSE TO ME.

ABSOLUTELY. THINGS.

AND SOME OF THE AREAS, THE OVERLAYS ARE SO SMALL THAT THERE'D BE NO WAY TO FIT MORE THAN ONE.

SO I APPRECIATE THE SENTIMENT, THOUGH, OF HAVING SOME SPACING, TOO, BECAUSE JUST KIND OF ANECDOTALLY, I WAS VISITING MY MY SISTER IN READING, WHICH IS A TINY LITTLE TOWN AND MY NIECE WORKS.

IT'S A PLACE CALLED THE PIZZA BARN.

AND WE WALKED FROM THE PIZZA BARN TO THE LOCAL PARK, AND IT'S THE TINIEST DOWNTOWN.

[01:45:05]

I MEAN, THERE'S PROBABLY LIKE SIX STORES TOTAL AND THREE OF THEM WERE DISPENSARIES AND IT WAS JUST BOOM, BOOM, BOOM, ALL RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER.

I THOUGHT, WOW, HOW DO THEY ALL MAKE MONEY? ANYWAY.

AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S CLEAR THAT FACILITIES IS TALKING ABOUT BUILDING, NOT LICENSE, BECAUSE THEIR SEPARATE LICENSE FOR THE MEDICAL AND THE DISPENSARY.

SO I ASSUME THAT IF WE'VE GOT ONE LOCATION, ONE OWNER, EVEN IF HE'S GOT TWO LICENSES, ONE FOR MEDICAL MARIJUANA, IF THAT CONTINUES AND ONE IF IT'S FOR ADULT USE, THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED ONE FACILITY.

THERE'S ONE FACILITY HERE.

THIS IS JUST A CURIOSITY QUESTION.

THIS IF MEDICAL MARIJUANA IS PRESCRIBED, IS THAT COVERED UNDER YOUR MEDICAL INSURANCE? AS MY UNDERSTANDING IS, THAT IS NOT THE CASE.

OKAY. IT DEPENDS ON THE STATE.

SO, YEAH.

SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT EVENTUALLY, WHY WHY WOULD IF IT'S WHY WOULD WE NEED IT IF YOU NEED IT FOR MEDICAL USE.

YEAH. I MEAN, AT THIS POINT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE MEDICAL AND THE RECREATIONAL IS FUNCTIONALLY THE EXCISE TAX SEEMS LIKE.

YEAH. IF IT.

I MEAN, WHAT WOULD BE THE ADVANTAGE OF CALLING IT MEDICAL.

YEAH. IT'S THE REDUCED TAX AT THIS POINT.

THAT'S REALLY WHAT IT IS.

BUT THE NUMBER OF LICENSED, THE NUMBER OF PATIENTS WITH CARDS HAS DROPPED DRAMATICALLY TO THE POINT WHERE IT'S PROBABLY NOT ENOUGH TO GO AROUND THROUGHOUT THE STATE.

I YOU KNOW, YOU CAN GUESS, WE CAN ALL GUESS.

BUT I WOULD SAY WITHIN FIVE YEARS YOU MAY SEE A MERGER OF THE INDUSTRY AND AT THE STATE LEVEL, I THINK FOR THAT HEARING, NO MAJOR CONCERNS.

WE'LL CONTINUE TO FLUSH THIS OUT, RUN EVERYTHING BY THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND GET A PUBLIC HEARING SCHEDULE IN THE NEAR FUTURE.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. I WANT TO SUPPORT THE 2000 FEET, BY THE WAY.

OKAY. WE'LL HAVE A FURTHER CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT.

I KNOW MULTIPLE COMMUNITIES HAVE DONE THAT AND THAT NUMBER IS FUNGIBLE.

WELL, THERE THE QUESTION IS, HOW IS THE IMPACT, IF WE COULD SEE ABSOLUTELY HOW BIG THE DISTRICTS ARE MAY BE MEANINGLESS.

ABSOLUTELY. YEAH, 2000 FEET IS PRETTY CLOSE TO HALF A MILE, AND VERY FEW OF THOSE DISTRICTS HAVE A HALF MILE MOVEMENT.

AND THAT'S WHY I SUPPORT THE 2000 FEET.

ALL RIGHT. I DON'T THINK ANYTHING IS REQUIRED FROM US ON THIS.

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. WE APPRECIATE THE FEEDBACK AND WE'LL KEEP WORKING ON IT.

VERY GOOD. THAT MEANS THE BOARD IS NOW ON ITEM NUMBER 11 TOWNSHIP BOARD UPDATES TO BRIEF UPDATE THROUGH THIS EVENING.

[11.A. Township Board update.]

THE VILLAGE OF OKEMOS BROWNFIELD PLAN.

PUBLIC HEARING WAS HELD AND THE TOWNSHIP BOARD WILL BE CONSIDERING THE APPROVAL OF THE BROWNFIELD PLAN AT THEIR MEETING NEXT WEEK.

THIS IS ANOTHER STEP IN THE ROAD.

FRANKLY, THIS IS AN IMPORTANT STEP IN THAT IT GETS THE STATE TO START PAYING A LITTLE CLOSER ATTENTION TO THIS PROJECT BECAUSE THERE'S NOW GOING TO BE A FORMAL STATE ASK.

SO WE CONTINUE TO WORK ON THAT.

ADDITIONALLY, THE DELETION OF THE RIA DISTRICT AND THE REZONING SUBSEQUENT TO THAT WILL FORMALLY BE INTRODUCED ON TUESDAY NIGHT, AND WE EXPECT THAT ACTION TO OCCUR BY THE END OF THE MONTH.

SO THAT'S WHERE WE'RE AT WITH THE TOWNSHIP BOARD NOW.

GOOD. LIAISON REPORTS.

[11.B. Liaison reports.]

I WAS IN NEW MEXICO WHEN THE ZONING BOARD MET.

DID THEY DO ANYTHING SIGNIFICANT? THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS HEARD TWO CASES.

ONE OF THEM WAS A [INAUDIBLE] THAT THERE WAS TWO ACCESSORY STRUCTURES.

I THINK IT WAS TWO GARAGES, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY.

THAT'S WHY I'M DRAWING A MINOR BLANK.

NO, RECONSTRUCTION OF A HOUSE ON HAMILTON ROAD.

RIGHT. THAT REQUIRED A VARIANCE BECAUSE OF THE FLOOD DELAY, THE FLOOD WAY IN THIS CASE.

SO THE THE NEW HOUSE IS PROPOSED TO BE OUT OF THE FLOODWAY AND FUNCTIONALLY SET BACK AT THE EXACT SAME AMOUNT AS THE SURROUNDING HOUSES.

SO THAT VARIANCE WAS GRANTED.

AND THE OTHER ONE WAS, I BELIEVE, A GARAGE IN THE FRONT YARD AND THAT VARIANCE WAS GRANTED AS WELL.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER LIAISON REPORTS? NO, VERY GOOD.

NEW APPLICATIONS.

YOU KNOW, I WOULD JUST ADD THAT RIGHT BEFORE THIS WENT TO PRESS, WE DID GET THE APPLICATION FOR A AN ISSUE WITH THE FLOOD PLAIN AT DOUGLAS J AND

[12. PROJECT UPDATES]

[01:50:09]

THE MSU TO LAKE LANSING CONNECTOR TRAIL, BOTH OF WHICH YOU WILL SEE NEXT MONTH, BECAUSE BOTH OF THEM INVOLVE FLOOD PLAIN IMPACTS.

THAT IS WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW.

B OR C SITE PLANS OR SITE PLANS APPROVED.

STILL TRYING TO GET A FEW PEOPLE OVER THE FINISH LINE, ALTHOUGH I WILL SAY THAT CONSUMERS CREDIT UNION THAT YOU APPROVED LAST YEAR HAS FINALLY GOTTEN SIGN OFF FROM ALL OF THE OUTSIDE AGENCIES THAT THEY NEED.

AND WE'LL GO WITH THAT.

ALL RIGHT. THE RECORD SHOULD REFLECT THAT THERE ARE NO FURTHER MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC PRESENT.

SO THAT BRINGS US UP TO ADJOURNMENT.

IS THERE A MOTION TO ADJOURN? MOVE BY COMMISSIONER CORDILL.

SECOND. SECOND.

THEN I'LL DO IT.

ALL IN FAVOR. AYE. NO LEAVING, NO DOUBT.

WE ARE ADJOURNED. THANK YOU BOTH.

THANK YOU ALL.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.